Role Call I (Game Over)

[Almost50]

The problem with giving you neighbor means that nero would become Day 5 IC. a50 says he can read nero. And given your D1, I would say that you are one of the few viable options for D5 IC that I actually see making it to D5 with that role.

I don't even know Oversoul (or if I so then I dunno whose alt it is), so being with him in a neighborhood is useless. the Neighbors need to be 2 people who know each other well enough to make it beneficial for the town (and less so for scum since they can't "pocket" the townie neighbor if one happened to be scum)

[Almost50]

You're basically proposing to neuter me forever

Timid isn't neutering you though. Inactive is. Unless you rate the proposals (that have to be sanctioned by the majority) more powerful than the actual abilities if the roles.

[Oversoul]

What does pocket mean? I keep seeing it used and it is not a term that was used back when I actively played.

[Almost50]

Pocketing is when scum sweet talk a townie to convince them they're town too. This is obviously much easier to do 1 on 1 (i.e. in a 2 person neighborhood) provided the two players don't know each other well. It becomes harder the bigger the neighborhood is, or the more the two players are familiar with each other... obviously.

[Gamma Emerald]

Oh, shit! One scum lord replaced by one scum lord"ess" (so to speak)

Hello, Titus. I hope your health is getting better. Also, tell Math I miss playing with him.

Now odd we go: let's lynch TITUS.

I honestly don't know about RC's replace out, but if I was in a hydra and replaced out shouldn't the other head take over as dingle player? The fact that Baezu never posted and didn't take over is pinging more than the fact RV replaced out.

Yeah, too many reasons are piling up for this lynch.

I stand by my statement that RC is a good player. But he made clear mistakes.

Okay here's what I'm thinking and this goes for all days: we should select our lynch first and then our full proposal. Lynching uses majority rules until 48 hours to deadline in which case we'll probably start in on the proposals.
Fyi I don't want this to be the de facto plan but it's what makes sense on a quick brainstorm

[Gamma Emerald]

Hey I am subbing for the hydra. I am also drunk.

Try to lynch me but I have zero access to RC hydra chat.

He probably subbed out to preserve his won percentage.

No matter. We"ll lynch thevscum and win.

And who would have more incentive to rep out to preserve win rates, town, which have greater numbers and the main detriment to losing one is losing their perspective if it was helping to win the game, or scum, with lesser numbers where every loss hurts the cause at least a little?

[Gamma Emerald]

He probably subbed out to preserve his won percentage.

Hold up, this confirms that RC slot was scum.

Because u only sub out to preseve the win percentage if you're about to be lynched as scum. If you're town, you can still win.

Guys Titus scum slipped. She is drunk.

EXACTLY.

[Gamma Emerald]

I think it's time we have an official proposal. I think this one is as good as any and I'll be voting for it. Even if it doesn't pass, we need the discussion.

Official Proposal

Timid = Hidden Happiness (Shadoweh/MariaR hydra)
Vanilla = Iconeum
Inventor = popsofctown
Day 5 Innocent Child = Oversoul
Miller = apthet
Neighbour = Nero Cain
1-shot Gladiator = momo
Day 3 King = Vecna
Night 1 Universal Backup = CheekyTeeky
Neighbour = Almost50
Odd-Night Motion Detector = Gamma Emerald
Macho = Lil Uzi Vert
Inactive = Saudade
Compulsive Quitter = Titus

I don't agree with CheekyTeeky being backup. I think Almost should get that role. I also still want the neighbor role, but if Nero is going to have the other one I will pass.

I kinda want neighbor but I'll defer

[Iconeum]

Does anyone have any history with Saudade? Does he play contradictory like that?

For what I've seen he's usually far more agressive as town

Ok the answer is scum, not bad town. That helps me feel less bad about it at least.

@everyone you can take whatever precautions you want about my scum game, ic, whatever, but we're lynching Momo today.

In no world is momo the D1 lynch.

it's personal. unless you're scum. then it's not. but even then it's still kinda personal to me, ngl.

Why do you always make a scumread on you personal?

VOTE: Against

Uh I am not in favor of basically being a hated townie in this setup. (I don't think Maria would mind actually but she's too busy packing to stop me. )

I also can't remember any time two people screaming at each other to death was actually alignment indicative of anything but two townies being stubborn as fuck. I wouldn't support a lynch on that slot at all. I see the hydra replaced out but unless RC has literally replaced out as scum about to be lynched before I'd sooner think he realized he shouldn't be playing.

Why would you care for being a hated townie? That doesn't mean you get lynched for it. The soft defence for RC here is bad. I'd lynch RC today, and if this flips scum you are next. Though I know i'm not Original in saying this… just my thoughts as well

[Iconeum]

I think it's time we have an official proposal. I think this one is as good as any and I'll be voting for it. Even if it doesn't pass, we need the discussion.

Official Proposal

Timid = Hidden Happiness (Shadoweh/MariaR hydra)
Vanilla = Iconeum
Inventor = popsofctown
Day 5 Innocent Child = Oversoul
Miller = apthet
Neighbour = Nero Cain
1-shot Gladiator = momo
Day 3 King = Vecna
Night 1 Universal Backup = CheekyTeeky
Neighbour = Almost50
Odd-Night Motion Detector = Gamma Emerald
Macho = Lil Uzi Vert
Inactive = Saudade
Compulsive Quitter = Titus

I'd not give neighbour to Nero, he's been very inactive this game. Adding an active role to him is not right.
I'd not give Gladiator to momo, I think King goes to momo. Gladiator I would have given to Saudude

Fine with just about everything else, but I really dislike the Nero neighbour distribution.

[popsofctown]

There have been no previous proposals.

Current proposal

(by momo ):

• 1-shot Gladiator
  : momo
  Nope not a fan, see my previous posts. Prefer 1-shot Gladiator : Hidden Happiness, since they're too apathetic to dig into mechanics and hopefully additional too hydra to use a high-risk high-reward mechanic. When I play Mario Kart Double Dash co-op I'm too scared to take the fancy shortcuts and embarrass myself and harm my poor teammate, true story.
  
  
• Inactive
  : Saudade
  I'm pretty o.k. with this
  
  
• Day 5 Innocent Child
  : Oversoul
  This seems wasteful as this slot seems legible. I'd prefer to see this on Nero Cain, who I remember difficulty reading, CheekyTeeky who has seemed to start to establish a difficult to read style so far, or even just like "the hydra because hydras are hard to read"
  
  
• Inventor
  : popsofctown
  I'm not going to object to getting the second most powerful role, I think if I sketched out what my INT DEX STR CHR WIS LUK spread was for mafia I'm better at scumreading than at townreading compared to the average player (but it's still easier to townread), for the record.
  
  
• Day 3 King
  : Vecna
  ok I guess I can swallow pride/proxy ego enough for this, certainly not a slot who is going to be lazy and submit rand choices.
  
  
• Macho
  : Lil Uzi Vert
  Yeah I don't think LUV is generally NK bait
  
  
• Miller
  : apthet
  We don't have posts from this player. Miller should go to a high legibility player. It's the opposite of day 5 IC. I'd want to see this on Oversoul or Almost50 or momo.
  [*]

  Odd-Night Motion Detector

  : Gamma Emerald

  This is actually kind of fits GE a bit I think he would tend to survive a to get lots of shots off. It doesn't necessarily need to fall in town hands because a Motion Detector can themselves be caught in a lie at times.

  
  [*]

  Neighbour

  : Nero Cain

  I'd rather the neighborhood go to a townread player or at least someone who I think would use it. There's scenarios where you want to communicate night action results only in the neighborhood so an all town neighborhood can be good and NC is pretty null to me so far.

  
  [*]

  Neighbour

  : Almost50

  I tentatively TR Almost50 so this is ok

  
  [*]

  Timid

  : Hidden Happiness

  This role is basically VT. VT/ "can't become king if callforjudgment distributes a king again". So it's whatever

  
  [*]

  Night 1 Universal Backup

  : CheekyTeeky

  One of the scummier slots in the game for me by PoE so I'm ok with it getting a negative utility role, which it is pretty likely this becomes.

  
  [*]

  Vanilla

  : Iconeum

  This is an excellent role for someone who went 49 hours without visiting the thread in a recent game >_> <_< >_>

  
  [*]

  Compulsive Quitter

  : Titus

The replace-out and the events leading up to it don't look great. I think RC is a guy who maybe has some kinds of principles and sensibilities going on that are not necessarily 100% married to his alignment, but I don't see anyway this lynch is -worse- than rand, I don't think he'd set up a categorical rule against replacing out as scum over issue X or Y.

"color" commentary by drunkpops

[Nero Cain]

I'd rather the neighborhood go to a townread player or at least someone who I think would use it. There's scenarios where you want to communicate night action results only in the neighborhood so an all town neighborhood can be good and NC is pretty null to me so far.

I'm actually not a hard read it's just that most players lack familiarity with me or are just downright horrible.

[Vecna]

I'm getting at that a difficult to read player seems like the best fit for the IC role.

That would be RC (The SSS hydra) then. They're hard to lynch without a hard guilty, yet everybody wants to lynch them from the word go anyway.

If the RC hydra is scum, theyll probably try for a flawless victory anyway, which means day5 is too late of a sorting for the slot.

Bad allocation there id say.

This is a terrible post. Why are you trying to appeal to fear like this? People talk up RC's reputation a lot but suggesting he can protect all of his partners with 100% reliability is flat absurd.

This is not me appealing to fear. Day5 is too late to sort a slot like RC, and if hes town scum will likely jave killes him by then. So IC is wasted there. You can disagree all you like, but the IC is much better used on a person more likely to survive that.

[Nero Cain]

I'd not give neighbour to Nero, he's been very inactive this game. Adding an active role to him is not right.

I've been inactive for a few pages, why are you acting like this has been an ongoing thing or that it's going to continue?

[Vecna]

Your win condition isn't to make momo happy it's to kill all the mafia.

If he's truly your top townread you should want him king.
I don't particularly want the gladiator ability to be on someone who's eager to use it. Gladiator days generate less information. It's only a half step away from governor where technically if you fire it very accurately it furthers the town wincon but overall you're subverting the protown mechanics of the game and it's negative utility really.

I like this post, and now I like pops

[Vecna]

Ew, preflip associatives. Why do people do those? Especially day 1?

No one seems to see Vecna the same way as me huh. I wonder if I would read him differently with a different avatar. I hate that tv show.

I think a lot of people read scummy intentions in my posts due to my avatar. Untill they get to know my playstyle, abd realize I often throw out half assed or weird reasoning just to see how people react. Most of the times theres sone thoight to it though, bit im just being to lazy to make the argument in a proper manner.

[Vecna]

@momo:

1- Why do you SR RC?
2- My point was "you can SR RC all you want, but getting him lynched w/o an explicit guilty is a pain in the arse", and I see no other investigative roles on the list top use on the slot.

Baezu's silence, the connections in between my other scum reads and him. Especially paired with his normal activity, both in games and around sites. It would be a really smart move for scum RC to declare that he's going to lurk day one.

Of my 3 SRs, I would probs lynch RC last. However, if any one of those two flip scum, the ties to RC become much stronger.

Either way, RC is very hard to read. The best use of the

inactive

role, imo, would be for someone like RC. If he is town, then great. He can help us scum hunt and the incentives to lynch a player like RC would be much lower if we make him inactive. That way town RC stays alive and helps us.

If he is scum, then he can't use any abilities.

Giving RC inactive is probably the easiest decision we have to make today.

This also works out perfectly because the HH hydra is hard to read. Day 5, we get a confirmed read. Just swapping those two would make your proposal better.

I might be weird, but I want to give you one of the worst abilities. Youre already so solidly town, and putting in the good work that youll never be lynched. Make scum kill a terrible ability when they want to get rid of you.

[Nero Cain]

If we are talking about roles, I think I would want one shot gladiator. I could solve the game with that role Day 2.

how?

Nero why aren't you scumreading me yet?

Do you feel like asking me things when I'm not around is good fake/scumhunting? b/c it seems a bit manipulative to me.

[Vecna]

All players are multiacting and both the NK and the rolestop are factional. Deactivating RC does very little. If Day2 has a watcher it maybe helps scum!RC's partner not misplay, lol. Oh, actually we have motion detector today there's that.

An inactive RC is weakened as last scum standing but I thought your stance was that you agree with Vecna about presuming a game with a lategame scum!RC is lost (which I still think is toxick and defeatist)

This was not the point I was trying to make. I love games with scum RC because theyre usually very challenging. It was just making a point about proper ability allocation.

So far im a bit sad that he doesnt come out to play.

[Nero Cain]

I'll also be the VC maker b/c I already do them in games with inactive mods.

[Vecna]

Oversoul - Finally oversoul. He opens by saying "these roles are lame." He also requested roles. On top of this, Oversoul had light buses on both RC and Sadude. Nothing substantial and nothing he needs to commit to, but they are there. This one for Sadude and this one for RC. He is right, RC is active, and he is directing this scum game.

I feel like you are incredibly off base with your reads this game if you're going to base the entire scumteam around me. You are too influenced by your own confirmation bias that I

must

be scum. Please read your own reasoning for me being scum.

"Oversoul thinks these roles are lame" Ok.
"Oversoul then ASKS for one of those lame roles" Ok.
"Therefore, Oversoul must be scum"

The only thing I can conclude from your scumread on me is that your preconceived notions about how scum would play this game are entirely wrong since I am your strongest scumread and I

know

you're wrong about that.

1. Objectively, these roles are lame. I was thinking we would get more basic things like 1-shot vigilante, tracker, roleblocker, macho cop, etc. Instead, we got a motion detector, several mechanic specific day abilities, and a slew of negative utility passive abilities. I came into this game thinking it was going to be role madness. Obviously that is not the case.
2. I chose a role that I felt like I could actually 1) have fun with, and 2) give benefit to the town. I think I am pretty good at needling people to better understand their motivations. I love neighborhoods, masons, etc. It is like a game within the game. I really do not see why scum would objectively want neighborhood when it has no bearing on actual night play (at least as far as Night 1 goes).

You seem to be holding me to

your

standard of play when it comes to these reads and what

you

would do. I very much doubt that you and I play similarly. The answers to my questions about Saudude and RC would be very helpful for me to ascertain their general motivations in this game. If Saudude has done this type of contradictory behavior, then it would help frame is motivations as not scummy. Additionally, if RC likes being scum and would try, then his lack of trying would help frame is motivation as not scummy.

Pedit:

No he is not. I thought Almost was Alchemist.

This feels like a very honest town-post to me.

[Vecna]

dictating gives us so little info though. letting people do as they please, and be held accountable for their choices later on sounds a lot more interesting to me.

More trickery and fancy play potential makes for a more interesting game.

Either way, I doubt well see many day abilities.

Exactly this

Because i dont feel like itttt
Tbh ive made some good content relatively you shouldnt worry

Hmm. I do not know what to make of this. At first I thought your open declaration of not trying was a CYA moment for future play:shifty: But now that you are trying, I am not so sure. What happened to change that attitude? To me it looks like you read the mechanics of the game and that somehow jumpstarted your interest.


I was town reading Vecna until 116.

Vecna has been extremely sensible so I don't get this

I will stand behind the fact that I think town gains more by dictating specifically who gets what then just leaving it to chance.

Also dictating to the king seems fine (Depending on who it is, and to a certain extent). I was talking more about other day abilities

[Vecna]

Here's a new strategy: Let's all in to games we know we won't play. Like, if you're on a holiday. or if you have exams, or you have a new job.. you're wedding is within a week.. etc.

You're an aussie but many people here treat American Independence day as a one shot, 1 day, 24 hour holiday. My parents planned dinner and a movie. I don't think it's unreasonable at all to /in for a game knowing you'll have a 1 day absence coming up.

If apthet is going to take Friday off from work and combine the weekend into a 5 day vacation I'm definitely with you, though, I missed Pokémon Ruby Mafia because I knew I had a 1 week vacation coming up.

Iconeum replaced into a game about a week before its wedding so we can policy lynch Iconeum here if you feel strongly about this

Fyi I myself try to avoid joining up beyond my capacity. My first game of forum mafia ever I had to replace into because I knew I had Boy Scouts events for the next month or so when I saw it in signups.

Youre very fluffy this game. Alas ive given up on the notion im good at reading you, but youre -very fluffy-

[Vecna]

Idk why Baezu isn't here.

I think Momo is scum trying to use our presence in the game to his advantage.
I also think that giving us the Day 5 IC removes any even slight motivation for scum to not kill us immediately.

Really, momo is capable of this level of play as scum? All I know from the slot as scum is heavy lurking. Am I this outdated? Enlighten me please.

[Vecna]

I'm willing to take the Day 5 IC and not get to play multiple day phases of the game if Momo is lynched today with us and MariaR hydra takes the universal backup.

How does that sound?

I do like the universal backup suggestion. The other two I really hate.