Newbie 1992 | Game Over

[skitter30]

VOTE: datisi

[Datisi]

I guess.

VOTE: skitter30

Though I ask nobody else votes and we also take our time today. Groovy? Groovy.

[Maduisha]

Alright, no votes for now. What are your reasons to vote each other?

[Datisi]

Off the top of my head? All of clidd/word/Madu seem Just Town.

I haven't dug though associates yet because I was lazy. I'll do that sometime Soon(tm).

I know I had an interesting point about Mara claiming VT, but if scum already knew about the Masons before that point then it doesn't hold water. Anything else will have to wait a bit.

[Datisi]

Madu, do you think the last scum is between me and skit?

[skitter30]

I guess.

VOTE: skitter30

Though I ask nobody else votes and we also take our time today. Groovy? Groovy.

Ok

1. You're forcing a false dichotomy that doesnt need to exist, you're basically saying scum has to be in me/you and trying to make people take a side

2. Can you articulate why i'm scummy other than poe?

[skitter30]

@mod unfortunately i'm going to be vla without internet access thurs-sat

[Maduisha]

Madu, do you think the last scum is between me and skit?

I trust you, so that's why I'm interested in why does Skitter want to vote you even though she was gone for a long while and came back just when Clidd yeeted our remaining mason out the window to "save" himself. Either I was too quick to TR you, or Skitter doesn't see anything weird with Clidd's move.

And at the same time, as much as I think that move from Clidd was anti-town, the rest of his play up until now seemed town to me, so aside from him switching positions regarding Marashu, I'm inclined to believe he's town too...

Which leaves me Datisi, Word, Skitter... I think the last scum is there, yes.

[skitter30]

Clidd's move was bad, but it wasnt scummy, especially not if he has a history of doing similar things

Why do you trust datisi?

[skitter30]

I'm also like fairly transparently not partners with mara, which i think is obvious

[Datisi]

Re: skitter

asked you yesterday if you think scum could be in word/clidd/Madu. P sure you said you didn't think so. And right now I don't necessarily think so either.

I'm not forcing it. If I were, I'd be calling for votes on you right now. I'm not saying "let's take our time" to be lamist, I'm saying it because I intend to actually go through parts of the game and see if any of the 3 others even plausiblly fit as Mara's partner. It's not gonna happen right now, because I'm barely awake, but it's going to happen.

[skitter30]

@datisi you're going to have to argue that i lolbussed mara when you know i dont bus like that in newbie games, you've even referenced ome such game here already

[Datisi]

Yes. Hence "i will look at if anyone else fits".

[skitter30]

Madu, do you think the last scum is between me and skit?

False dichotomy ^

[Datisi]

Skitter, I'm pretty aware that if you decide I'm going to die, I'm probably going to die.

Today for me is probably more about trying to figure out who should be lynched tomorrow.

[clidd]

When I get home, I intend to close this case. We will win the game today.

[Datisi]

Madu, do you think the last scum is between me and skit?

False dichotomy ^

I mean, you're the one that voted me right out of the gate. And that was a question, not a statement.

[word321]

Im actually kind of with skitter this time. From what I read on Mara day 1 and 2, datisi makes sense as a partner, and unless this was all a machiavellian plan of skitter and mara about planting fake hints from day 1, hardbussing each other and betting every chip on skitt making to the end of game (and on a newbie, nonetheless), wich there is NO evidence whatsoever, I'd go for Datisi too.
And clidd, while we r at it. Im quite surprised nobody got suspicious of him. My solve would be a dat/clidd in any order.

[Maduisha]

Why do you trust datisi?

If you don't mind, I'll refer to the posts in which I explained my reasoning to Word when he asked me about it:

Spoiler:

I just said that I am bad at seeing partners and associations, I'm sorry. I don't know who's Marashu's partner, but I consider essentially everyone except Datisi (his behavior feels town to me from the beginning) and Malakittens (because of what I already explained). Yes, it's the broadest pool you'll find, but I have to admit that I am clueless at the moment.

Thats ok. Why exactly do u tr dats then?

Essentially this that I proposed early on during the game:

I'm reading Datisi as town after all this. My reasons are that he's not feeling pressured to make new reads even though he was accused of the fact that he's not pushing anyone at all being scummy in him. Not reacting is also a reaction, if that makes sense. He's also keeping the options open, but not in a fence-sitting way, since he has expressed two people he firmly believes as town and excluded them from the equation to further narrow the PoE.

And the anger thing, as I said in my reply to TRQ, I think is something scum would have breathed deeply and tried to keep hidden if it puts them further into SR territory for being out of character for their town selves.

Summarized: scum cares about appearances. Datisi is not acting in a way that indicates he values how he appears, or show desire of self preservation. Examples would be:

- He was faced with accusations about his behavior being different from his town meta and he did not try to alter it to fix that perception, nor rush reads to appear more towny.

- He did not hide is anger, which triggered the people that were seeing him as scummy to further read him as scum "because Datisi doesn't usually react like that." Again, scum cares about appearances and he did not care to dig his hole deeper.

- He does what he says. He established that he trusts Menalque and that he is inclined to sheep him. He did not care that sheeping people might look scummy later, he just put his trust on his TR, and when he said "vote GWu", he just did exactly that. Of course, he had his own reasons to suspect GWu, but the act of moving the vote was the act of trust in itself, because he wanted to flip both slots regardless at that moment.

That is all. I am leaving for the night now, because it is very late where I live, but the forum has been refusing to load appropriately so that I could finish this earlier and go to bed.

[Maduisha]

Im quite surprised nobody got suspicious of him.

I did after he forced Malakittens to claim. But right now I feel that I was being frustrated because I personally think that's a bad play if he's town.

[Maduisha]

When I get home, I intend to close this case. We will win the game today.

Regarding this... please, don't try to rush it. I hope you mean "today" as in D3 and not as in... you want to force a lynch in the next 24h.

[clidd]

When I get home, I intend to close this case. We will win the game today.

Regarding this... please, don't try to rush it. I hope you mean "today" as in D3 and not as in... you want to force a lynch in the next 24h.

I mean D3 as a whole.

[skitter30]

nd unless this was all a machiavellian plan of skitter and mara about planting fake hints from day 1, hardbussing each other and betting every chip on skitt making to the end of game (and on a newbie, nonetheless),

i don't really believe in bussing in newbies like that

[word321]

To expand on my read on mara and datisi:
Every interaction they had was a simple interation. They did interact during D1, but the objectives were clear and the development was few. Now, mara being mara that is no surprise with everyone and all; but the interactions wouldnt rule out a partnership.

Then, you have posts like 450, 618, 886 (with the added bonus of 872) and 1216, on day 1, all of wich deal with dat but in an indirect way, unanimously defending him in some way or another (mostly from skitter, but from trq too) or inquiring about him in the last post on clidd.

Then we have the introduction of Day 2, where he began giving this 180 turn; his vision in day 1, represented by 1061 and 1068, shifted radically on 1264, and even though datisi was nominally present on the list, he didnt make sense with everyone at the time. This is also the last time we hear about him on Day 2, except for a brief but important interaction on 1411.

On top of that, it seems to me mara liked to play with wifoms, specially on day 2; his change of attitude regarding skitter, clidd and me, even mad at some point are akin to trying to someone shining light in some direction, trying to hide the other. This is specially notorious with clidd and me at his last post.

This is all from an ISO, so I may have lost something there.
I havent rly analysed datisi on detail yet. The only notorious thing I have now is, mara was his first vote (hey, that's statistically relevant at least)


Now, on the case of clidd with mara, it is kind of self explanatory by itself. clidd had a weird attitude with mara the whole day 2, and it didnt exactly began with the mason thing, but with his reanalysis of him, wich would have potentially steered the whole town in another unfortunate direction. On top of that, we have the mason thin, wich as Ive explained before, had means, motivation and background to do as scum. He also pointed towards the SE slots on Day 1 and 2. In his defence is his first analysis on Mara, wich later manifested on an intention to lynch; it wouldnt make a lot of sense on day 1, but in this context it is more plausible of a bus, cause it came when the wagon was already formed.

[word321]

someone

somehow