Open 420: Medical Mafia - That's all, folks!

[Venmar]

You have satisfied my concerns already Robo based on your responses there.

Venmar on the other hand, and Jackal.....

This is twice someone just slipped in with a 3rd vote no case just sheepin along.

I am going to look at both Venmar and Jackal closely.

- How come this looks like OMGUS? Previously you said you are going to move on from me to RoboCopter because you were satisfied with me, but now that i place my vote on you i become suspicious in your eyes? What happened to you pursuing Robo? How come you are dropping previously made plans and are making new ones for those who have voted for you?

[RachMarie]

Mort tends to have tunnel vision. He almost always assumes I am scum even when proven wrong.

Meanwhile I want to hear more from Robo, now that Venmar spoke. I really do have a method to my madness even if it is not fully apparent off the bat.

I am a big picture person and I work hard to peg everyone as soon as I can, leaving room of course for some major scum tells. So it is not set in stone town or scum especially this early, however it gives me a good guideline of who is likely scum and who is likely not scum.

Mort, on the other hand, has a very straight for the jugular approach on one person and not let go til they are dead.

Yes I have been having RL issues and I am working hard to keep up with my games. Looks like I won't be going V/LA though, since my dad will not be able to come down after all before starting chemo and radiation therapy on Thursday.

What I read from this,

"I don't have a response to Mort so I'm going to deflect to Robo. I am scumhunting, you just don't know it."

The last part though i don't mind. Your activity level is non indicative of your alignment. I know your in a rough spot. Still calling you out though. Sorry.

Popping in to

VOTE: RachMarie

I've seen her as town and scum (I was also in that newbie game that Morton linked where she flipped scum) and am getting mostly scum-vibes from her posts so far.

This vote is pathetic.

@Mort: You really are throwing your vote around. What gives? You were voting Zach and then the next thing I know you are calling him town.

@ Venmar THIS post it feels very much from a town mindset not a scum one.

[Zachrulez]

Where on earth did I say his tunnel vision is scummy I did not. However if you look at the other game he so graciously pointed out, you will find that he pushed a fair bit on my predecessor (Field Armada), and he continued a pattern of tunneling on other players til he was lynched.

Both the games he and I were in he was town. I think he is town but not looking at the big picture and tunneling too much.

The problem is that you said he has a tendency to tunnel you regardless of your alignment, and he pretty effectively refuted that. You didn't say he had a tendency to tunnel in general.

[Zachrulez]

And also tunneling is when you tend to have the same suspect no matter information is presented to you to indicate they aren't scum or that someone else is. I get the impression that when you say he tunneled your predecessor and other players (plural) that he wasn't actually guilty of tunneling anyone because that shows an ability to shift suspicions as he gained new information.

[Time Traveling Scumhunter]

To: Denizens of Future 420
From: TTSH

Re: Zach's OMGUS and A Few Other Thoughts

Yeah, a player is posting under a self imposed post restriction as an excuse to do very little and it's not a scumtell at all!

As mort will argue later, this is just dumb. Obviously this entire account is designed to be played this way. The whole formatting is mostly a way to remind you that I am playing on a 24-hour delay. Annoying or not, it's not

scummy

. If you want to make the case for a policy lynch, by all means do that. But instead you're going to argue I'm scummy for it.

In reality, I think you're upset that I have the gall to go after

you

, the most established player in the game who is actually active. Your cries of "OH MY WORD, HE DOESN'T TALK ABOUT ANYONE ELSE" seem to provide evidence of this. I think as town you'd probably be likely to shrug it off, but here you feel like you're playing well, so why should a BAD (from your perspective) attack be able to succeed. Or something. So you want to punish me. Even though you don't believe me to be scum. In fact, I suspect you know I'm not scum.

Stuff about Zach: Blah blah blah blah, lots of stuff.

Stuff about anyone or anything else: Big fat 0.

<skipping some stuff>

This is really the first major trinket of anything I've really had to go on. My reads have been in flux because there's really been a whole lot of nothing going on, and I'm disliking what Time Traveler is doing because all he's doing is focusing on one of the most active players in the game, (IE: Me) which is going to have a net effect of encouraging players to continue doing exactly what they are doing.

I haven't really found anyone's lack of activity particularly noteworthy aside from that.

Note the complete disconnect here. He's pissed that I go after him, an active player who has actually done something scummy. Then he TURNS AROUND and says "oh. there's nothing noteworthy in this game."

Well gosh. Which is it?

Popping in to

VOTE: RachMarie

I've seen her as town and scum (I was also in that newbie game that Morton linked where she flipped scum) and am getting mostly scum-vibes from her posts so far.

Pretty scummy vote.

Where on earth did I say his tunnel vision is scummy I did not. However if you look at the other game he so graciously pointed out, you will find that he pushed a fair bit on my predecessor (Field Armada), and he continued a pattern of tunneling on other players til he was lynched.

Both the games he and I were in he was town. I think he is town but not looking at the big picture and tunneling too much.

This is a vaguely scummy defense. Because it's making the argument that he's a bad player (even though he nailed Rach on both times he tunneled), so he should be

ignore

. Not that he's doing it as scum because then she'd have to take a stand on the alignment of mort, but that his attacks should be dismissed out of hand.


Best Wishes,
Time Traveling Scumhunter

[Time Traveling Scumhunter]

PS. Avatar uploaded for your pleasure.

[Zachrulez]

In reality, I think you're upset that I have the gall to go after

you

, the most established player in the game who is actually active. Your cries of "OH MY WORD, HE DOESN'T TALK ABOUT ANYONE ELSE" seem to provide evidence of this. I think as town you'd probably be likely to shrug it off, but here you feel like you're playing well, so why should a BAD (from your perspective) attack be able to succeed. Or something. So you want to punish me. Even though you don't believe me to be scum. In fact, I suspect you know I'm not scum.

So that's what this is about. How established I am.

[Zachrulez]

Stuff about Zach: Blah blah blah blah, lots of stuff.

Stuff about anyone or anything else: Big fat 0.

<skipping some stuff>

This is really the first major trinket of anything I've really had to go on. My reads have been in flux because there's really been a whole lot of nothing going on, and I'm disliking what Time Traveler is doing because all he's doing is focusing on one of the most active players in the game, (IE: Me) which is going to have a net effect of encouraging players to continue doing exactly what they are doing.

I haven't really found anyone's lack of activity particularly noteworthy aside from that.

Note the complete disconnect here. He's pissed that I go after him, an active player who has actually done something scummy. Then he TURNS AROUND and says "oh. there's nothing noteworthy in this game."

Well gosh. Which is it?

Yeah this is a pretty big misrep.

[Zachrulez]

The nothing I was referring to was a void in activity, which doesn't even come close to saying that there's nothing noteworthy in the game et all.

[Zachrulez]

Popping in to

VOTE: RachMarie

I've seen her as town and scum (I was also in that newbie game that Morton linked where she flipped scum) and am getting mostly scum-vibes from her posts so far.

Pretty scummy vote.

The easy target becomes scummy.

[RachMarie]

I am sorry for the confusion I did not mean that he only tunneled on me, I meant he tunnels on players. However I think he is probably town.

[Robocopter87]

@ TTSH: You are just twisting Zach's words to make it seem like he has done something scummy. He is right, you have clearly tunneled only Zach this whole game and have not provided any useful information whatsoever.

I'm not saying that Zach is obvtown, I'm saying that your case on him being scum sucks. If you were to actually provide a decent case I would look into it. But right now you think Zach has some Ego problem when in reality its kinda obvious that hes frustrated your pushing your stupid case.

[izakthegoomba]

FightingShadow has been prodded.

[izakthegoomba]

Votecount 1.05

RachMarie (3) - Mortontfrh, Venmar, Jackal711
Time Traveling Scumhunter (2) - FightingShadow, Zachrulez
Robocopter87 (1) - RachMarie
Zachrulez (1) - Time Traveling Scumhunter
Jackal711 (1) - FuDuzn
FuDuzn (0) -

none

Mortontfrh (0) -

none

FightingShadow (0) -

none

Venmar (0) -

none

No Lynch (0) -

none

Not voting (1) - Robocopter87

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Jackal711 and Mortontfrh are V/LA until Thursday 5th July

The deadline is in (expired on 2012-07-19 04:21:01).

[Mortontfrh]

First things first, let's talk about this whole tunneling situation. Obviously I disagree that i'm tunneling, but the more important question is -

Why the fuck does it even matter?

Is tunneling scummy? Does it invalidate anything that i've said? If not, why did you even bring it up Rach? Why do you insist on attempting to debunk my character rather than my case. You say i'm tunneling, and maybe I am - But you're refusing to actually address issues that i've brought up in your play. You still haven't addressed the later part of Post #117 as well as Venmar's objection in the subsequent post as well.

Popping in to

VOTE: RachMarie

I've seen her as town and scum (I was also in that newbie game that Morton linked where she flipped scum) and am getting mostly scum-vibes from her posts so far.

Can you explain why you tried to self-meta yourself at a point in the game where you were under no pressure at all?

I am sorry for the confusion I did not mean that he only tunneled on me, I meant he tunnels on players. However I think he is probably town.

This is interesting considering you initially stated that I tunneled on you and didn't even talk about my play style in general.

@Mort: You really are throwing your vote around. What gives? You were voting Zach and then the next thing I know you are calling him town.

What in the world is this? I've changed my vote twice this game. I had my initial RVS, which I changed to Zach and then I changed it again back to Rach. Where do you live in when shifting my vote twice is considering throwing my vote around, especially when I give ample reasoning behind both of my votes. I also never even came close to saying that Zach is town, I said that Rach was a higher priority based on how scummy her reappearance into the game was.

P.S. - Both Zach and Jackal have changed their votes a lot more than me. Why do you only choose to address me "throwing around votes" when other people are shifting their votes much more frequently?

[RachMarie]

@ Robo

TBF Mort does NOT change votes much.

ATM I feel that Venmar and Jackal are the most scummy, however caveat with Jackal is he always seems scummy even when he is VT or a PR. uggh.

I am going to look at ISOs tonight and put my vote on somewhere more solid. I am feeling more and more like Robo is probably town.

[Mortontfrh]

First things first, let's talk about this whole tunneling situation. Obviously I disagree that i'm tunneling, but the more important question is - Why the fuck does it even matter? Is tunneling scummy? Does it invalidate anything that i've said? If not, why did you even bring it up Rach? Why do you insist on attempting to debunk my character rather than my case. You say i'm tunneling, and maybe I am - But you're refusing to actually address issues that i've brought up in your play. You still haven't addressed the later part of Post #117 as well as Venmar's objection in the subsequent post as well.

[Venmar]

@ Robo

TBF Mort does NOT change votes much.

ATM I feel that Venmar and Jackal are the most scummy, however caveat with Jackal is he always seems scummy even when he is VT or a PR. uggh.

I am going to look at ISOs tonight and put my vote on somewhere more solid. I am feeling more and more like Robo is probably town.

- I await your reasoning for why i am scum...

[Robocopter87]

You did not answer the question in its entirety.

When I say "throwing votes around", I mean, "Dropping reads fast"

You were voting Zach, then suddenly you voted Rach and called Zach town. Why did you do that?

[Mortontfrh]

I just explained that I never called Zach town. Were did you get that mindset from?

Also, is this not a succinct enough of an explanation for my vote change?

I can see where you're coming from in your most recent posts, I just think it's more likely that you're backtracking out of your contradiction rather than actually having that mindset going into your vote. Regardless the chance that you're being genuine is enough for me to get back on board Rach, especially with her awful reappearance into this game.

[Time Traveling Scumhunter]

To: 24-hours in the future
From: TTSH

Re: Zach's motivations and his attempts to muddy the water

So that's what this is about. How established I am.

It's about your thiny veiled OMGUS vote and what your motivations are for doing it. In this case, I think you're upset that I nailed you as scum for what you don't think was scummy. You think you've been active, and you think you're the most established player here, so you lash out in pique.

Contrast that to what I think you'd do as town, which is to roll your eyes at me and move on.

The nothing I was referring to was a void in activity, which doesn't even come close to saying that there's nothing noteworthy in the game et all.

Popping in to

VOTE: RachMarie

I've seen her as town and scum (I was also in that newbie game that Morton linked where she flipped scum) and am getting mostly scum-vibes from her posts so far.

Pretty scummy vote.

The easy target becomes scummy.

Now you're just throwing stuff out there to try and muddy the waters. Because this comparison fails (take notice of how I am about to describe why it fails rather than just say "big misrep" as if that somehow explains everything).

First, it fails completely because while my criticism was that you just wanted to lynch easy targets, my own actions have been completely opposite as I've gone after you for your scumminess. The expectation of town-zach is not that I think you'd ONLY ever go after hard targets. It's just that I think you'd probably not focus on easy ones. Unless you think you're an "easy target" this reasoning doesn't need to go any further.

Second, I didn't follow my commentary on the scummy vote with "My vote is because he's not advancing the game" as you did because my goal isn't to get lynches without actually taking responsibility for a bad lynch.

Hopefully I'll see some good stuff in a few of my hours of people noting Zach's scummy behavior here, but these posts are the last I've read.

Have a nice day,
Time Traveling Scumhunter

[Robocopter87]

I could've sworn that sentence under Mort's Rach vote had something to do with Zach being more towny. Upon ISOing, I find that this is not true, he never said a word about Zach being town.

[Zachrulez]

To: 24-hours in the future
From: TTSH

Re: Zach's motivations and his attempts to muddy the water

So that's what this is about. How established I am.

It's about your thiny veiled OMGUS vote and what your motivations are for doing it. In this case, I think you're upset that I nailed you as scum for what you don't think was scummy. You think you've been active, and you think you're the most established player here, so you lash out in pique.

Contrast that to what I think you'd do as town, which is to roll your eyes at me and move on.

I could think my actions are not scummy because I'm actually not scum. Novel concept I know.

The nothing I was referring to was a void in activity, which doesn't even come close to saying that there's nothing noteworthy in the game et all.

Popping in to

VOTE: RachMarie

I've seen her as town and scum (I was also in that newbie game that Morton linked where she flipped scum) and am getting mostly scum-vibes from her posts so far.

Pretty scummy vote.

The easy target becomes scummy.

Now you're just throwing stuff out there to try and muddy the waters. Because this comparison fails (take notice of how I am about to describe why it fails rather than just say "big misrep" as if that somehow explains everything).

First, it fails completely because while my criticism was that you just wanted to lynch easy targets, my own actions have been completely opposite as I've gone after you for your scumminess. The expectation of town-zach is not that I think you'd ONLY ever go after hard targets. It's just that I think you'd probably not focus on easy ones. Unless you think you're an "easy target" this reasoning doesn't need to go any further.

Starting here, I don't scumhunt this way, so your entire analysis in this regard is faulty. I indiscriminately hunt for scummy play, I don't take into account whether the person committing the actions is an "easy target."

Also going to note that attacking someone for going after an "easy target" is lazy play. It's a very easy thing to attack. (For example, I could villify everyone on the Rach wagon as going after an easy target since her wagon has formed while she's apparently had real life issues if I completely ignore that her play has actually been scummy and that the wagon is warranted.)

Second, I didn't follow my commentary on the scummy vote with "My vote is because he's not advancing the game" as you did because my goal isn't to get lynches without actually taking responsibility for a bad lynch.

Are you assuming Jackal is a bad lynch? How would you know that exactly? Also how can you possibly know I'll avoid responsibility for a lynch I am on? This is magical knowledge of the future you are ninjaing into the discussion where you hope to lynch me on hypothetical arguments regardless of whether they actually prove true.

[izakthegoomba]

Jackal711 and FuDuzn have been prodded.

[FuDuzn]

Ah my apologies, kept forgetting to post in here.

I still think that Jackyll is the way to go here, but I really don't like this Time Traveling Scumhunter guy(or gal). It is one thing to prod one person for reactons and such, but you are almost exclusively focused on Zach. I am still on the fence about Zach, but I am not sure wat TTS' intent is here.