History Mafia Mini Theme - 1358 Game Over!

[Nexus]

DeasVail replaces iDanyboy. Thankyou.

[MattP]

WHAT ABOUT SHAMROCK

We can worry about Shamrock later, primary goal is to get Vash to talk right now

Vash, do something tonight or replace because you're holding things up >.> Sorry bro

[DeasVail]

[/b]Vote: ChaosOmega[/b]

[DeasVail]

ugh, I can't even use bold tags properly anymore.

Vote: ChaosOmega

[DeasVail]

I have read most of the game and will post thoughts later.

[scooby]

why did you think it was a good idea to post a vote before your thoughts?

[DeasVail]

It is doing something as opposed to doing nothing.

[DeasVail]

My reads:

IceGuy-

Town

because of his claim and following play, but I still think there is the possibility of his mass nameclaim suggestion coming from scum.

Bitmap-

Town

for continuing behaviour that he'd already been suspected for, or otherwise behaving in ways that scum would perhaps avoid. I agree with MattP that the signature change was less likely to come from scum as well, although I did share Amrun's confusion at first.

Michel-

Undecided

. I will try to think more about his play later, but right now I'm having trouble. I like his posts, but I don't read anything particularly unlikely to come from scum and aspects of his posting come across as a bit scummy to me.

I plan to go over his ISO and provide more detailed thoughts on him, but first, a question: Do you have any experience with scum rolefishing?

Amrun-

Town

. Based on a few little things that make me think she's town. Also, 207 was a non-scummy question that got a lot more attention than I expected.

ChaosOmega-

I didn't really decide on what I thought of him while reading, so I'll ISO and post thoughts now.

I get a slight town feeling if anything until 219, as the "Can we just lynch Bitmap?" seems forced.

His other posts support my slight town feeling though. I'm not sure if I'd put him as a town read, but he's not a scum read. Also Chaos, please say what you think of Amrun when you can.

DCL-

I originally said scum here, but now going with

town

. There are a lot of things that make me think scum, but the confidence with which he attacks Amrun in 301 seems beyond what scum would be capable of considering the situation. I can elaborate if I need to, but will not for now.

Shamrock-

Scum

. His posts have mostly been careful comments while never truly demonstrating town scumhunting.

In 14 he comments on an issue, but doesn't attempt to read/question anyone. Note the careful nature of the post.

43 is similar.

In 64 he is still arguing a point that doesn't have anything to do with his reads, while still being very careful.

His questions are for incrimination purposes only.

Being one of the people attacking Amrun for 207 is also reason for suspicion in my mind, and his attack on her is also flawed, as pointed out by Amrun in 260, but he does not concede.

His change of vote in 325 is probably what I find most scummy. His post doesn't really make sense for town to make. If he still had a scumread on Amrun, wouldn't he be more interested in why others suddenly find her town? Wouldn't he try harder to get her lynched instead of giving up due to the wagon not moving anywhere. However, I think his actions makes sense with him being scum considering the awkward position Shamrock-scum would have been placed in after Matt and Bitmap decide on Amrun-town. He would likely feel incredibly uncomfortable joining in and saying "yeah, Amrun's probably town", and continuing to push her would also probably seem like a bad idea to him considering the attention he has already received for it and the flaw revealed in his argument. The way to avoid these two things would be to do what he did.

MattP-

Town

, but I get all paranoid regarding him. How confident are you actually in your Vash read?

Vash-

Undecided

. My only real thought about him was that he could be town for trying to overcompensate for his inactivity. This would be scummy, except he actually had no pressure on him at all, so would he really be so ambitious as scum? How he loses steam and doesn't catch up properly seem a bit like town to me, but I'm not sure.

Quilford-

Town

mostly because of his early posting. What did you/do you think of Amrun?

Scooby-

Town

. He feels genuine.

Staeg-

Undecided

. He may be a scumread, but I can't really explain it right now, and Shamrock is the one I want to lynch anyway.

UNVOTE: ChaosOmega
VOTE: Shamrock

[Amrun]

omg dv <3

[MattP]

Go on with the DCL read please.

[MattP]

I just want Vash to respond why is this so hard

[scooby]

I have a bad feeling about DV.

I dont understand the initial CO vote. Its like he felt he needed to do something to avoid suspicion and precisly avoid the impression that he isnt doing anything. I dont see a townie doing that, it feels like scum trying to work under perceptions.

Meh, his following post is kinda okish, need to reread agian if I find something.

Still, not seeing the shamrock hate. Id much prefere a Sablehart lynch. Or an Amrun one if you guys could help me here...

[Amrun]

Why sablehart?

[MattP]

MSH, you've been walking on eggshells with your tone towards everyone this entire game, are you afraid to hurt someone's feelings?

[scooby]

too polite, non agressive, long posts that are hard to read, they dont feel sincere, politically correct, basically the definition of scum that tries to look townie but misses the real spirit, the fresheness of a logical scumhunter.

What sealed for me was the slip accusation some posts ago. It was obviously not a slip. I dont understand why Michael felt the need to bring that to the table.

[DeasVail]

What sealed for me was the slip accusation some posts ago. It was obviously not a slip. I dont understand why Michael felt the need to bring that to the table.

Do you find that this contradicts with your other thoughts on him?

[MattP]

Plus he asks a lot of questions that are just plain fucking obvious so that he looks like he's scumhunting

[Amrun]

I hated that too, actually. It was kind of like, "Slip, anyone? But no I'm not going to vote it. Let's hope everyone else jumps on first so I don't get myself in hot water."

[scooby]

What sealed for me was the slip accusation some posts ago. It was obviously not a slip. I dont understand why Michael felt the need to bring that to the table.

Do you find that this contradicts with your other thoughts on him?

I dont see why. The slip accusation is one a robot that plays mafia could make. It is not logical, which is why I dislike it.

[scooby]

I have a bad feeling about DV.
I dont understand the initial CO vote. Its like he felt he needed to do something to avoid suspicion and precisly avoid the impression that he isnt doing anything. I dont see a townie doing that, it feels like scum trying to work under perceptions.

Deavail, asnwer please

[DeasVail]

The slip "accusation" is actually one of the things holding me back from calling him scum, precisely because it is not very logical or well done, which doesn't fit with how I would imagine this polite, non-aggressive, michel-scum to be.

PEdit:

[Shamrock]

Shamrock-

Scum

. His posts have mostly been careful comments while never truly demonstrating town scumhunting.

In 14 he comments on an issue, but doesn't attempt to read/question anyone. Note the careful nature of the post.

43 is similar.

In 64 he is still arguing a point that doesn't have anything to do with his reads, while still being very careful.

The reason for my first few comments looking this way, if you're curious, is that it's been years since I played mafia and my scumhunting muscles are quite atrophied.

Being one of the people attacking Amrun for 207 is also reason for suspicion in my mind, and his attack on her is also flawed, as pointed out by Amrun in 260, but he does not concede.

How is it flawed? I think Amrun had already made up her (just realized I keep referring to you as male, Amrun - sorry about that) mind on Bitmap and was fishing for more reasons to lynch. This post...

You have no idea what your read on IceGuy is - it has fluctuated between scum, null, and town to fit whatever is convenient to you at the time. This is not an evolution of a read over time; between the posts I posted above, literally nothing at all happened.

Vote: Bitmap

... is not the post of someone still trying to make up her mind. Nor do her posts between that one and her switching vote to me provide any evidence of a shift in opinion.

His change of vote in 325 is probably what I find most scummy. His post doesn't really make sense for town to make. If he still had a scumread on Amrun, wouldn't he be more interested in why others suddenly find her town?

There doesn't really seem to be a "why others suddenly find her town" except that their intuition is that she's town. Which is a valid reason to vote or not vote, but isn't convincing me of anything - my intuition is that she's scum.

Wouldn't he try harder to get her lynched instead of giving up due to the wagon not moving anywhere.

We don't seem to have more than 4-5 votes for Amrun at the moment. If the wagon shows signs of more movement then I will jump back on board. For now, I see no reason not to put my vote somewhere useful.

However, I think his actions makes sense with him being scum considering the awkward position Shamrock-scum would have been placed in after Matt and Bitmap decide on Amrun-town. He would likely feel incredibly uncomfortable joining in and saying "yeah, Amrun's probably town", and continuing to push her would also probably seem like a bad idea to him considering the attention he has already received for it and the flaw revealed in his argument. The way to avoid these two things would be to do what he did.

I don't understand this. Is disagreeing with Matt and Bitmap on Amrun against the rules or something?

--

I'm somewhat sympathetic to the MSH arguments, but his posting style is clearly at odds with pretty much the entire rest of the game and I wonder if he might just be getting punished for that.

[Shamrock]

P.S. IceGuy has said virtually nothing of substance since the very beginning of the game. IceGuy, do you have any reads/thoughts to contribute?

[ChaosOmega]

Going on vacation.

Mod: V/LA until Sunday afternoon

Also Chaos, please say what you think of Amrun when you can.

I get a scummy vibe from her. It's pretty much entirely gut, though. I thought her response in RVS to MattP's vote felt forced. Her response to being attacked for her Bitmap pressure seems over-defensive.

You just don't like me and are happy to maybe find me a bit scummy and so are ramping it up.

That line especially sticks out. Are you trying to throw out his case against you by saying it's not based in facts, but a vendetta against you?

I think it's extremely unfair that some people get to know how Bitmap may or may not be confirmed town and others don't.

I know you've had this brought up before, but this strikes me as knee-jerk scum reaction. Town should be happy if a player gets confirmed as town, and scum get frustrated. Saying it's extremely unfair tends to point to the latter.

[Shamrock]

Oh:

Quilford-

Town

mostly because of his early posting.

What did you/do you think of Amrun?

I would also like to hear this.