Touhou: Mafia in the Land of Fantasy (Game Over)

[Messiah Complex]

Jesus, so what happens when we do flip town? Mollie you falling on a sword for that, or is the same thing that happens anytime a mislynch occurs, people move on to the next candidate?

[GoodCop_BadCop]

A man will also concede he's likely wrong on one or two, but lynching the list will pay dividends in the end.

Valar moghulis

! We win together, even as shades.

Assuming you live a long and fruitful life Mr. IC. you need to have a plan B because if you base all of your reads on the fact we are scum, your ENTIRE D1 play will be blown out of the water when you see our flip.

So humor me for the sake of town and come up with something that assumes GCBC is town.

~GC

[bubbajack8]

Bubba, Mollie barely knows me and I doubt her ability to read me. I used a game we recently had together as an example.

I saw. I asked her a question. She has 2 unanswered questions from me.

I'm sorry you feel that way. I did. It was.

He said he wouldn't respond to me about anything and yet is willing to talk about me in a condescending way. Why do you think its town?

~GC

Trying to trap me to a scum read? Really?

1. It was a joke.
2. I don't scum read what look like jokes to me.

[Jaqen Hghar]

A man will also concede he's likely wrong on one or two, but lynching the list will pay dividends in the end.

Valar moghulis

! We win together, even as shades.

[Kagami]

Will the Bastard of Lush kindly remove his nailless finger from a man's arse? A man feels it now. A man thinks he knows why there are too many scum in this game. A decent portion of scum are playing the strategy of too obvious to be scum ~ therefor not scum because site meta dictates players get free passes for thus. An excellent strategy as that make all who see things differently look scummy. A man doesn't think this is MB either the claims of thinking thus are just another facet to the strategy to cover for their "thoughts" of too many scum.

A man now reads these ones as scum

GCBC
Varsoon
Kaze
Lush
Katarina

This is def wrong on varsoon, he's town and I'm quite sure of it.
I still think lush is town. The "we have to lynch one of these three wagons bit" falls deep into the uncanny valley of scumminess.

Trying to figure out why messiah is scum now.

[bubbajack8]

TLDR; Because Mollie said so.

[Kazekirimaru]

kaze has a smug superiority about him that I think kind of leans town. are you reading him as scum? he is the type of player that I can get weird on but not right now.

Oh, get weird on me. <3

A man just explained what he thinks the team scum strategy is. A man neither thinks you slipped on purpose if he's right about that nor has he seen a boy following along with that strategy. A man sees Varsoon connected to both GCBC and the others for the too scummy and his scum meta of sitting a bus for a while with someone not being listened to. A man sees Kaze and Lush playing the too obvious route. A man sees a Kat oddly staying well clear of the other 4.

A man concedes that a boy's first post of this game is likely why he believes all revolves around himself

A man needs to take an icicle and place it betwixt his ribs.

[Jaqen Hghar]

A man neither thinks you slipped on purpose if he's right about that nor has he seen a boy following along with that strategy.

A man just got through saying he sees a boy as a stand alone complex. The only player on a man's list tied to a boy is Varsoon, and that's because of Varsoon.

[Jaqen Hghar]

That would make a man's side too cold

[Kazekirimaru]

This is def wrong on varsoon, he's town and I'm quite sure of it.

"Quite sure?" I like "Quite sure." Tell me more about it.

[Lush Life]

Jesus, so what happens when we do flip town? Mollie you falling on a sword for that, or is the same thing that happens anytime a mislynch occurs, people move on to the next candidate?

well I will look at the incredible effort you put into your posts. and the timing and wonder they had to be beetlejuiced.

and what that says about your partners!

[GoodCop_BadCop]

You said Kat is tied to us... Talk about "A man sees Kaze and Lush playing the too obvious route."

What is the obvious route?

~GC

[Kagami]

This is def wrong on varsoon, he's town and I'm quite sure of it.

"Quite sure?" I like "Quite sure." Tell me more about it.

I've played a fair number of games with varsoon, just as I've played several with you. Experiential meta tells me varsoon is town and you may well be scum.

[Kazekirimaru]

I've played a fair number of games with varsoon, just as I've played several with you. Experiential meta tells me varsoon is town and you may well be scum.

That was underwhelming.

[Jaqen Hghar]

Too scummy to be scum, but being scum all the same. A man said Kat is distancing from the other 4 on the list. A boy is still a stand alone.

[Kagami]

I've played a fair number of games with varsoon, just as I've played several with you. Experiential meta tells me varsoon is town and you may well be scum.

That was underwhelming.

So what do you think about tsukasa, my adorable sister?

[GoodCop_BadCop]

Experiential meta tells me varsoon is town

Which part? Elaborate please.

~GC

[Lush Life]

what were your questions specifically to me bubba

[Kazekirimaru]

Too scummy to be scum, but being scum all the same. A man said Kat is distancing from the other 4 on the list. A boy is still a stand alone.

lol

So what do you think about tsukasa, my adorable sister?

I think it's a Saki alt.

Last I checked they were using a lot of words to basically say they were going with the flow. Eh. Null-scum. You?

[Messiah Complex]

Jesus, so what happens when we do flip town? Mollie you falling on a sword for that, or is the same thing that happens anytime a mislynch occurs, people move on to the next candidate?

well I will look at the incredible effort you put into your posts. and the timing and wonder they had to be beetlejuiced.

and what that says about your partners!

You are tilting at windmills here and if you are town you are destroying what could have been a beautiful relationship in this game. If you are scum then by all means continue down this path and you will surely help town win after our untimely death.

[Jaqen Hghar]

Will the Bastard of Lush kindly remove his nailless finger from a man's arse? A man feels it now. A man thinks he knows why there are too many scum in this game. A decent portion of scum are playing the strategy of too obvious to be scum ~ therefor not scum because site meta dictates players get free passes for thus. An excellent strategy as that make all who see things differently look scummy. A man doesn't think this is MB either the claims of thinking thus are just another facet to the strategy to cover for their "thoughts" of too many scum.

A man now reads these ones as scum

GCBC
Varsoon
Kaze
Lush
Katarina

This is def wrong on varsoon, he's town and I'm quite sure of it.
I still think lush is town. The "we have to lynch one of these three wagons bit" falls deep into the uncanny valley of scumminess.

Trying to figure out why messiah is scum now.

Quickly now, would a girl's experiential meta tell her this is town or scum Varsoon?

AJ THE EPIC : 25 POSTS TOTAL : TOWN.

WHY:

His plays are consistent and have good trajectory. His reads are very genuine and he’s town-oriented about getting wagons pushed, rather than opportunistic. He dispels bullshit and tries to cut through the fluff of the game with logic and rhetorical appeals. Overall, he’s helpful, justifies his votes/thoughts, and both MS and I agree on this read, so it’s probably on the money.

Spoiler:

33 : Vote on NS is good here, because NS is yet to be confirmed IC and the content from NS so far hasn't been very helpful. I also pressured NS early and had NS not confirmed IC, I'd probably still be doing so. Still, this vote could use a bit of articulation and poise, rather than just jumping in on an NS wagon (which was an easy one to be on at the time). I've come to see this as early pressure, though.

247 : Huge leap in posts here, which shows me AJ doesn't always have this game open. I like that he tries to cut through the perceived artifice of reaction tests so far. He actually articulates his scum-reads here which makes me feel much better about the slot, and his points are well-founded in logic and show that he's actually reading the game. Still unsure if he's active-lurking and took this moment to analyze easier wagons and press them forward, but standing in opposition to the TD wagon is interesting and rings true as town in my books.

279 : Vote analysis to support his reads is solid. The fact he actually writes about it is good, since some of his analysis seems to contradict his earlier posturing of TD feeling genuine.

509 : Explains his Nick vote and does what can be interpreted as a little chainsaw/buddying, but I'm seeing it as planting his feet and dispelling the no-where-moving TD wagon. Right here, it feels that AJ wants to push the Nick wagon harder, and is reiterating his case while pulling attention from wagons he perceives as dead.

513 : Reigns in why he thinks the TD wagon is bad. There's a few jumps in logic from here to there and his reasons for being pro-TD are largely meta-influenced, which I really don't care for. Seems a bit defensive, but I think it's an important articulation to make, given that he's been a bit everywhere earlier on his TD reads.

872 : The fact that he calls us out on our questions bugs us a little, especially given the reasons why we asked them. I felt like I was being shot down here, but what's really important to notice is the attack on us asking about dissonance while we've got a lot of it. Again, this reflects that AJ is keeping up with the game, but also introduces that he won't stand for hypocrisy, which is interesting. All in all, it rings as a pretty weak assault on me, but does address issues that AJ personally has problems with.

878 : Probably AJ's best post. He provides a solid quote-by-quote case and even articulates why he believes things rather than just spouting the dreaded IIoA. What I like about this is that it represents two things from AJ--Solid reasons for swapping his vote and compassion for who he sees as fellow town. He spoilers specifically for Venmar's sake, but it's also in-line with how he feels about the game being bogged down (see his 872 and the much earlier spoiler post addressed to B&B).

883 : Shoots down bad (anti-town) ideas on the spot, rather than engaging in discussion of them.

941 : Interesting commentary on reflective gameplay. The attention to the hypocrisy in the Mala play is consistent with his points against us that I mentioned earlier in this ISO, which makes me believe that this is town AJ holding onto his ideals for scum-hunting rather than Scum-AJ pushing a mislynch.

992 : This is the sort of thing I like to see from people I'm reading as town, it's an approach that I call 'wagon brokering'. AJ wants to support only wagons he believes in, and is willing to come to a meeting point with other active players on that. It rings of town being town-minded while still pursuing their own reads, rather than scum who'll jump on and support wagons they haven't shown they believe in previously.

1203 : It's worth noting that AJ is a bit more conversational with who he's reading as town. He's more assault-based on people he's reading as scum. Here, you can see how this rhetorical approach has shifted with my own slot. Furthermore, he supports his Mala wagon and comes back to it with more evidence, which is pretty town to me. He wants to convince his town reads of his scum reads. That's town to me. Scum tend to put out their 'scum reads' and hope people jump on them regardless of PoV on alignment OR scum just parrot popular wagons. This approach by AJ allows him to consolidate who he thinks is town and scum, and to catch people who would jump on his Mala wagon/logic and use it towards a lynch.

1247 : Interesting appeal to Pathos when discussing wagon-analysis. Gotta agree, though. Scum-slips are null.

1251 : Echoes his thoughts in 883 and provides good trajectory/consistency here.

1328 : Is engaged in the perceived artifice of Mala's response, which is really more of a point-of-view thing than anything else. Some people are just shitty at getting their frustration into words and others are so masterful at it that they can fake it. Talking about perceived emotion is pretty null. This jumps in the face of AJ's earlier desires for mafia to be a cold, calculating game rather than an emotional one, since it's such an approach that scum can exploit. The best thing about this post is that AJ realizes the Mala wagon is going nowhere, but he holds his scum read and shifts gears, which is evident in his later Rach vote. This, again, is consistent with earlier play, when he dispelled the TD wagon--or, at least, called it dead. AJ is the kind of player who wants town to agree on something, rather than polarizing them by pushing his wagons despite appeal and tunneling hard. While that -could- be interpreted as scummy, it certainly isn't here, because AJ holds onto his scum reads rather than outright discarding them and he only really seems to broker wagons with his town reads, rather than trying to get anyone and everyone to jump on them (I'm looking at you, Trust Fund, you shitlord).

ANDRIUS: 31 POSTS TOTAL : SCUM
WHY :

Lots of noise, fluff, and a false sense of engagement with the game. Every ‘catchup’ wall is nonsensical, ridiculous, and doesn’t provide town with new info. Andrius just agrees with other players, or doesn’t, and any sentences longer than one or two words of the former are him hyperbolizing and strawmanning the shit out of whoever he doesn’t like. MS points out that this is different from his play in Xenoblade and that he starts contributing a bit too late in the game, but also has him as null-scum, where I’m reading him as hard scum. He just wants his scum-picks lynched and doesn’t care who does it, and makes a lot of noise about it without actually engaging town at all. Furthemore, he’s a real asshole towards our conf-town and claimed PGO and has pretty much suffocated NS/established he doesn’t care about what NS has to say.

Spoiler:

635 : Second post but offers nothing up for town other than anger-tell? Okay.

648 : Fluffy image posting that isn't even behind spoiler tags. C'mon, Andy.

650 : An RVS post 650 pages deep? Please. Justification for the Nick vote is lacking and horrid, but then it turns out to just be distraction and noise as he turns to his SoS points. More use of images, which is distracting here and unspoilered. Makes a lot of reads based on posts without actually explaining -why-. He unvotes and votes people left and right despite it being a catchup post, gives no real substantive evidence behind his reads other than quoting a line and agreeing/disagreeing with it, and his wall is just generally hard to get through. The step-by-step following of his re-read allows for him to have a false sense of consistency/trajectory if he wants, and to manufacture this idea that he's progressively changing reads on people when there's no evidence if he is or isn't. Ultimately, a very anti-town post that's disorienting and could easily hide him as scum.

652 : No excuse for his earlier post. I wish he'd follow the format I'm using. Sigh. Seems to be lighthearted/joking when putting RACH in all caps, twice and how he says WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU? as one of his read tiers.

657 : More noise, hard to decipher back and forth here, ultimately breaks down to "B&B has hydra dissonance and doesn’t get along with Ffery, I want my scum-reads voted on, do my work for me".

665 : Gets really loud and annoyed with conf-town. This is distracting to the max, and also really pushes down our conf-town, which is suffocating in a way that rubs me wrong all over the place.

666 : Engages in discussion of replacing out, which is secondary to the core of the game.

694 : Noise and fluff of the highest degree. We get your point, Andy. You don't need to have a 2-page-scroll post with funny images to make it. Also, he fucking assaults a player and calls them garbage.

1044 : Epitomizes his play here. He has reads that aren't articulated, and when he disagrees with people he just posits a 'stahp' rather than actually bringing in a counter-argument. He uses humorous images and hyperbole to make weak points and ultimately doesn't contribute anything substantive to town. Calls people weak, discredits players left and right, proposes himself as a part of a townbloc (I think that's what he's doing with the bat symbol brotherhood thing?). He even capstones it with another TLDR readslist on the fly, which isn't helpful for town in the least, since none of his reads are articulated outside of "THIS IS BAD" or "I AGREE".

1057 : More discrediting, avoiding blame for issues of his posts being indecipherable/confusing, and he suffocates town voices, esp when he writes "and i give zero fucks as to what you think at this point [...] now stop talking"

1060 : COOL DONT SPOILER THIS OR ANYTHING JUST FUCKING FLUFF THE THREAD INTO INCOMPREHENSIBLE BULLSHIT, THAT'S FINE SPOILERS ARE FOR NERDS AND FAST CARS ANYWAY

BEAUTY AND THE BEAST (HYDRA OF MOLLIE AND MAJIFFY) : 221 POSTS TOTAL : TOWN
WHY:

B&B has a very conversational and minimalistic approach to singular posts that make it a bit more difficult to read the Hydra and do a Post-by-Post like this. Despite that, B&B’s had very strong, well-backed reads throughout the thread, is quick to call out and dispel faulty logic, and is generally helpful and outspoken about their stances on other players. MS and I agree on this read, and MS is quite excited about it because B&B town had sniped 2, one of the scum that he had mistaken for in Xenoblade.

Spoiler:

69 : First substantive post from the Hydra. I didn't like the very RVS-esque earlier posts, since they didn't really add anything to the game, but this one is solid. It makes a few decent points (gamblers fallacy, taking the mantle of reading rach, etc) but is also a bit distanced in the way that Andrius' walls are. However, this is a useful post that shows some level of logical and personal engagement with the game, at an early stage.

84 : Fluffy, but fills the bill of wanting someone to talk to. Still, I don't like this kinda shit. Coupling some fluff at the end of a substantive post, sure, but having posts solely to talk about things not related to the game? Distracting.

105 : Poorly elaborated vote on TD. At this point, I'm reading B&B as scum, because of the fluffy content (images, videos, outside discussion) without much cutting to the core of the game, which is what I'm used to from this hydra.

127 : Is a good engagement and ripping apart of TD's 'logic'. It's a nice attack on a scum-read and rings pretty genuinely to me.

233 : At this point, I feel that B&B was just pushing TD's wagon to have an early wagon to analyze. I was scratching my head over it, but given how non-committal/directly confrontational B&B was with TD, it makes sense and doesn't feel like scum pulling back on a failed wagon, but instead like a town strategy to push a shit wagon and then dispel it for wagon analysis.

275 : The first B&B post that I really like. It's hard to do a PBP sort of ISO on this hydra, but this post has some good content. B&B pushes players, especially scum-specs, with questions that aren't leading so much as requiring elaboration for poor play. In retrospect, did I ever answer this?

287, 298 : Solid line of questioning, again.

311 : Uses quotes (which were earlier shown to be important to the Hydra) to explain distrust/dislike of a player's slot.

313 : Couples questioning with the quote thing I just mentioned. Very reasonable play that's in-line with the ethos that B&B's been playing by all game.

319 : Critical engagement and good questioning coupled with a bit of fun prodding and useful analogy for B&B's PoV.

326 : Reads to me as frustrated town-B&B explaining to someone why a tactic doesn't work as either alignment.

340 : A really good elaboration of 326. The thing I like about this is that it uses bold to direct and drive the questioning/argument and then critically engages Trust Fund in a way that justifies B&B's points earlier.

455 : Gives a pretty genuine Rach read that speaks towards Rach's meta bit but also uses context from this game. The fact this isn't out of the blue, but as an elaboration of earlier ideas is really strong for me.

465 : Justifies some of the points I'm going to make against B&B in my overall WHY section.

768 : Glad to still have Mollie with us (and hopefully I can get her in a skype game sometime, 'cus dat voice~). Clears up some confusion over earlier butting of heads and drives forward B&B's position on a lot of players in a way that actually explains and articulates why. This is good because it echoes thoughts throughout the game, addresses town concerns, and makes B&B's positioning more coherent.

895 : Engagement with Nick's list speaks a lot towards the slot's own trajectory and how they engage in the game. It's clear that B&B is interested in conversing over reads, and isn't afraid to disagree on points. This is the post that really paints B&B as town for me, because it shuts down completely the reads that B&B personally doesn't agree with (from interactions evidenced earlier in the game) and it questions and explores the more mutual reads in a way to broker wagons.

1196 : This is the sort of substantive post I like from B&B's slot. It posits a position, elaborates on it, and provides articulated rationale behind why they'd vote for certain players.

BORKJERFKIN : 34 POSTS : SCUM
WHY:

He somehow always knows when people are replacing in despite them not posting yet, he always writes in an annoying non-default color, and he’s really doing a lot that I think could get him banned. His setup speculation at the windup of the thread is disturbing to say the least, and I swear he’s been editing his posts, which is –definitely- against site rules. It’s a bit hypocritical, given that he’s being really hard on other players for comparably minor infractions. The other big thing is that he doesn’t post any damn content, just constantly puts up vote-counts, as if he’s somehow doing town work by keeping us up to date. Ultimately, this low content while calling out other players despite appealing as town and breaking the rules just rings really scummy to me. MS and I both can’t comprehend why no one has voted him so far.

Spoiler:

Hehehe, I'm such a shitlord. Sorry, had to make a part of this long thing a bit fun to read. Honestly, I <3 you, Bork. Thanks for being such an awesome mod, keeping up with vote-counts, and writing flavor that's really innovative and representative of the source material.

MS edit: lol that gave me a laugh

BROSEIDON : 28 POSTS : NULL-LEANING-TOWN
WHY:

BRO critically engages with the game on a couple of levels, and he uses meta as a means of gauging his peers here. That said, he’s aware of how others might try to manipulate that—especially given the meta from Xenoblade. He’s consistent in his reads, isn’t scared to push a case he personally has evidence for/believes in, and he’s done a lot of his own work. Still, MS feels like there’s too little content to put him in the Town bucket yet, and I agree. There isn’t much active engagement, as most of the worthwhile posts I’ve seen from BRO are in the format of catchups. Plus, it doesn’t help that I’m a bit paranoid about his play. It’ll be easier to determine his alignment when he’s able to be more active and in direct conversation with the game, but he’s been consistent and pretty town so far.

Spoiler:

59 : Strong introduction that posits his own feelings on the PGO circumstances. This level of engagement is nice and serves a good juxtaposition of other players who came into the game late without much substance to put onto the table. He also wants to see more from our slot, which speaks towards a bit of a meta approach I figure BRO is working with. He read me as scum right away in C&H Mafia and I get the suspicion he's read my scum-game in Open 512, but he was also in Xenoblade with me, so I figure he wants a lot of content on my slot since he's had a pretty extensive history of reading me. This also informs how I feel I can engage in his reads, and makes me a bit paranoid that scum-BRO would try to use meta-'evidence' to push a mislynch on me/buddy me to winning (an echo of what happened in Xenoblade between me and GiF).

267 : First substantive, highly-engaged post from BRO. He posits skepticism and his townier reads, which give a solid foundation for some later trajectory-analysis that can be done. He's pretty in the open about how he feels about players, which speaks a good deal towards him being town. The concerns he voices for activity ring true with me, and, if anything, 267 is one of the most genuine posts in this game.

292 : Interesting engagement with Venmar that really gives him a bit to think about and respond to. This echoes how BRO has been engaging with the TD wagon so far, and those earlier posts (271-285) speak a lot towards BRO's foundation of expectations from playing with people in the past.

584 : MS and I are a little iffy about BRO's reasons for reading us as town. I feel like he's buddying the Varsoon head and really only engaging with it, which makes sense, since the reasons for why he has a town read on us are ones that appeal to the meta of the Varsoon head. On one hand, it feels like he could be buddying me, but on the other, it makes a lot of sense coming from the way BRO speaks towards and shapes his play around meta. I am being way more pragmatic and cogent in this game, and that's largely because of how I've grown as a player on this site. I already spoke towards making use of this approach earlier when I was being drilled for helping B&B out (or at least trying to).
MS edit: what this means to say that me and Varsoon have different theories on why BRO reads us as town @first sentence
Also strong plat my friend is a diamond

588 : Good wagon brokering, although I feel like he needs to articulate his cases a bit more here. Just being fine with Mac, Rach, or Mala feels a bit opportunistic, given the flow of the game.

605 : The switch to SoS and the subsequent 606 is what makes BRO seem way more town for us. He splits away from a wagon that could be considered opportunistic/too easy and pushes one of his own, providing evidence that makes a lot of cognitive sense given the approaches BRO has made use of so far in the game. It shows really strong sense of finding scum on one's own, rather than parroting other players, and actually provides rationale for the logic there, rather than having just accusations.

758 : Speaks to a lot of the criticisms he's received so far while breaking down why those criticisms are unfounded/wrong. Again, the switch to the Mastin case echoes his SoS switch in many ways and makes use of the same attention to rhetoric and bolding phrases and words that ping scum for him.

1127 : Another catchup, which seems to be how BRO is engaging in this game. It's an approach that allows scum some affordances of false use of Kairos in order to seem more town (see, Andrius), but BRO doesn't manipulate it in that way. What's important here is that he stands by his earlier mastin read, keeps his vote where it is, and is confident enough to have it stay there later when he V/LA's. If anything, this shows that BRO is dedicated to this read being scum, but also is willing to engage in discussion of -why- he thinks so, rather than blindly tunneling.

DESPERADO: 46 POSTS : NULL-LEANING-SCUM
WHY:

This is actually one of the reads that I’m deferring to Metal Sonic. I see his posts as pretty null and tunnel-oriented while still sort-of engaging with what other players have to say, but Metal feels like the case made against us is a strong push for a mislynch without information and that the small number of posts/content ratio is what’s making him harder to read outright. As a note, he has 46 posts here, but most are double-posts and sometimes triple-posts. Get that fixed, Desperado.

Spoiler:

701 : Late entry to the game, but only does ISO work on a handful of people. The vote on Rach isn't very articulated, and previous anti-Rach people have already made these points in much more detail, I feel.

707 : Coherent and skeptical positioning, explains also why he's so late to the party.

1004 : Here's where I have a bit of a sour taste in my mouth. Desperado's been pushing this Rach wagon like no one's business with very little substantive work done other than saying she's Rach and she's scum. The thing that busts my balls, though, is when he says Rach's flip will confirm me as scum. What? How? It seems like too large a jump, especially given that Desperado hasn't mentioned me at all so far in his posts outside of a single instance of talking about waffles. (For the record, I prefer pancakes, but waffles can be pretty dope from time to time) This gets echoed in his 1011, too.

1038 : There's been objections to the Rach wagon so far, so it's interesting to point out that here is where he defers to Nacho. I think that Desperado is town-reading Nacho and either wants an out for his Rach case so that he can push someone else, or, if Nacho's logic isn't sound, he'll continue to push now that he's certain there won't be outspoken Nacho opposition--which, for the record, is some powerful shit.

1335 : The talk of my Calvin/Hobbes AtE here is actually pretty damning evidence. First of all, it allows him to retrospectively and subtly push on me without making an actual case (see: Desperado's play against me this whole game) while appealing to the real meta-heads who are on the fence about me (See: BROseidon, especially). What splits this from the way BRO goes about Meta is that Desperado is using it to call suspicion onto my slot. It's an inaccurate portrayal, because I've made use of the same appeals and rhetoric as both scum and town (See: Open 489 "You Are Not Cats" as well as "Calvin and Hobbes Mafia"). Of course, on a personal level, I feel like using Meta to make these sorts of arguments against players is useless and far-and-away exploitable by scum, so I'm a bit biased on this front. Still, my meta spits in the face of the accusation, and it really feels like Desperado is testing the waters with pushing a mislynch on me. He later cites ‘commitment to the role’ as reason why he’s paranoid, pulling back a bit on the insane anti-FTL claims he’d put forth earlier. I think Desperado doesn’t realize I commit pretty damn hard in most of my games, regardless of alignment. I replace out when I can’t commit.
MS edit: Desperado’s push on us because of “paranoia” sounds like an excuse to push us without having any real reason. I was in that Calvin&Hobbes game too along with Vars and Desp so I see where he’s coming from but the fact that he only read the Varsoon head and provided no comments about me makes his push scummy imo

GHOSTLIN: 31 POSTS : TOWN
WHY :

I’m actually null-lean-town on this one, but MS is wholly convinced that Ghostlin is town, so I’m deferring to him here. There are a lot of points where I personally feel that Ghostlin is taking a town consensus before moving forward with a wagon, but I can also see a lot of personal reasoning being put out for those votes and a lot of unwavering, solid reads being put down rather than the typical ‘scum-confirming-a-townie’ move. I’m skeptical of certain plays, but, like I said, Metal Sonic left it at “Ghostlin is town, with very town plays. There’s really nothing else to say about it.”

Spoiler:

143 : Another really spectacular intro posts from a town-read of ours. What makes this post good and town is that it addressing game-flow and issues so far in a unique way, but it also forwards AND articulates new ideas, especially Ghostlin's case on TD and reasons for putting a vote there.

157 : Speaks to some early suffocation coming from the IC slot before his confirmation. This post is so damn town motivated, it makes me smile.

160 : All the cool kids are posting images. I should get on this. Seriously, though, it's a distraction and while fun, isn't necessary.

383 : This is a pretty interesting post where Ghostlin rescinds reads and moves forward in what I am reading as a town way. Notice that Ghostlin first speaks towards how previous scum-reads have turned out to be townier than expected and then Ghostlin posits where other players now stand for him as well, using specific posts as evidence towards that.

516 : This feels like a logical extension of 383, but I'm a bit worried about how passive it is at points. Ghostlin voices several town concerns, but doesn't really go on a limb here.

829 : Finally, Ghostlin really makes a case on someone. It's a bit of a weaker argument, to be sure, but it's something. I don't like how Ghostlin offers Rach up as a sacrifice, though.

1133 : This, I like. In fact, I really like Ghostlin's engagement with the game between here and 829. It represents Ghost really engaging in critical conversation that mutes out and kicks to the curb poor logic and misreps.

1134 : Don't like the idea of wanting the IC dead. I understand that NS's posts are lackluster, but c'mon.

1143 : Hints towards wagon analysis of the mastin wagon, but doesn't go too in-depth. Town-confirms more people, too, but has some articulation as to why.

1462 : Another good content case and post from Ghostlin. Dispels more anti-town thought than I can shake a stick at, but also makes me feel waaaay better about earlier play from him. The comments on NS are pulled back, and previous moments where it felt that Ghostlin wasn't really paying a lot of attention are turned into points made against various players and in justification of a new wagon.

MAC : 35 POSTS : NULL-LEANING-SCUM
WHY:

Mac’s got a lot of one-liners and pretty unhelpful posts. He’s staying off the radar and not really contributing much to the game, which has us more than a little concerned given the amount of posts we’ve had D1. Still, there’s the fact that Mac’s also had limited access, so I feel like that’s worth addressing. I really want to see a lot more content out of the slot, because it isn’t like Mac is failing to engage in the game. There are responses to plenty of issues while they were happening, but the transition between wagons is jarring and Mac’s content is really lacking articulation. Also, there seem to be a lot of times Mac is testing the water or appealing to Meta for reads, which doesn’t sit well with me at all.

Spoiler:

119 : Mac catches the same thing I was picking up on here--it felt like TD's anger was a bit artificial. Still, I think I tested the waters and figured things out in a way that got more answers then being straightforward and just asking.

138 : I agree with this vote at this point in time in the game. It makes sense, especially to me, given how I was interacting with TD around the same time.

168 : I don't know who did this first, but I call this the JMO slip. JMO does this shit all the time, where the second his wagon builds some kinetic force he swears and gets all huffy over it.

261 : Appeal to Meta.

855 : I feel like there should be a lot more content here. It's just 'nope's and deflects.

1342 : OMGUS of sorts, feels misrep'd, doesn't bring a good case in response at all.

1462 : Meta appeal is in line with the earlier one, but also feels very opportunistic in the vote. Parrots concerns about Nacho's absence.

MALAKITTENS (REPLACING NHAMMEN) : 73 POSTS : TOWN
WHY:

I originally hated this slot and wanted it pretty dead, especially given how ludicrous the wagon on me seemed. Well, of course, that was until I realized that Mala was making use of the same polarizing approach to the game that I often take as town. I explore this more thoroughly in my Post-by-Post, but Mala really plays with the cards a bit closer to her chest, and pressures players without remorse. After seeing how Mala handled me, I came to understand her process a bit more and I’m personally null-leaning-town on the slot, with MS putting the slot down as a solid town. MS says that Mala tends to have difficulty reading him, and that Mala’s pressure on us reflects an effort to get a definitive alignment-indicative response out of us so that Mala could be more assured of her read on us. This falls in line with my own note that Mala looks a lot more like a player rooted in Meta, and with that in mind, the pressure on our slot makes sense in more than just an approach to read one head or the other, but both.

Spoiler:

734 : Expresses and builds a bit on the whole B&B scum thing from when Mala replaced in. At this point, I was feeling that Mala wasn't articulating votes nearly enough and the fact Mala didn't address Nhammen's play at all really worried me.

741 : Appeals to Meta. C'mon, you know how I feel about this already, I don't wanna talk about it.

749 : I already talked about why this vote was bad in the thread. A reason why I'm not quoting very many of Mala's posts so far is because I already engaged them.

756 and 767 : Feels like non-committal catch-up posts that largely just agree/disagree with people rather than positing individual info/going out on a limb.

968 : There's a lot of associative reads like this that make me feel like Mala was trying to springboard onto other reads without looking like she just dropped the case on me.

1033 : This is where shit really hits the fan. Mala was one of my biggest scum-reads up to this point, and it was my interactions with Mala that make me read her as town now. Specifically, she seems personally upset and offended with us and is a bit stubborn with the perceived slip that we made. I've hung on to reads of my own until I got something substantive out of them before (See : TD, in this game) so, when I really started looking at Mala under the same lens Mala was likely looking at me, the motivation for her case was a lot clearer.

1291 : It's here that Mala and I both realize what's going on between us. What was originally Mala trying to expose me via a slip--in other words, get me to react in a way indicative of alignment--turned into a player versus player argument that wasn't conducive at all towards town's victory in this game. The fact that Mala was so ready to replace out and make a truce really speaks towards Mala being town, especially given that I saw Mala making use of a lot of the same strategies I do and if I was scum, I'd milk a player v player situation for as much chaos and noise as I could get out of it, because to most people it'll read as annoying/null rather than scum-indicative. Instead, Mala completely disengaged, which read to me that Mala was seeing me as town, didn't get the scum-response she was expecting, and was ready to move forward with the game rather than exploit a situation that could've lasted for dozens of pages (See : 2 and B&B's back and forth in Xenoblade).
MS edit: I have seen Mala in HunterxHunter Mafia(Varsoon wasn’t in it) and as I’ve said many times before in this thread that Mala tunneled and read me wrong. She got lynched(the only mislynch in the game) so it goes to show how her pushes may not be so ideal as town.
1293 : I can't really give credit to Ghostlin for dispelling bullshit and not give this point to Mala. Here, Mala instantly shoots down the idea of a scumslip and even

subconsciously admits to being town

by asserting that she speculates on the number of scum in a game, too.

1321 : While I like the vote on Andrius, I also don't like the reasoning. Still, it's incredibly consistent with Mala's earlier appeals to Meta, even though it does pretty much incriminate Andy solely on the basis of meta.

1417 : Further echoes of my own thoughts, which is pretty uncanny. This is what makes me thing that Mala take a similar approach that I do, despite being a hydra.

1428 : Expresses the same frustrations I do revolving around reading Rach. I think it's super important to note that Mala gives Rach benefit of the doubt and will judge her on later play (which apparently is more substantive) rather than pushing what could be a very easy day one mislynch.

1590 : Explains a lot of the thought processes asked of Mala and is a generally helpful and insightful post into Mala's process.

MASTIN2 : 30 POSTS : TOWN.
WHY:

MS has Mastin as null-leaning-town, but I really make the case for his towniness here. There are points I find a little dubious, but almost every single Mastin post is amazingly useful and speaks a lot to his positioning and what he thinks while being super-compliant and open to town’s input and questions. It simply isn’t a scum approach, due to the level of articulation and highly consistent, self-assured play. His contributions and good reads list are things MS and I agree on, and the fact that we both have a very similar approach of detailing a reads list and providing substantive evidence to our claims is what really appeals to me.

Spoiler:

240 : Explains his late entry and says he'll catch up. He actually delivers in his very next post, which makes me trust him.

448 : A really good outlying vote and a post that brings a lot to the table. Mastin's clear about identifying his own process and why he's voting here, which speaks a lot to towniness.

692 : Elaboration on his earlier vote, but provides good transition to the nick one. He's very compliant here and even speaks to why he feels his play might be weaker early on in the game.

705 : Really good wagon brokering here. Argues his reads in a strong and concise manner that speaks towards a willingness to co-operate, find scum truthfully, and stand by his own opinions.

715 : Offers a really compelling post-by-post on Rach that actually... makes use of... logic? Holy shit I didn't think it could be done.

966 : I could really talk about how Mastin is town all day err'y day. The posts leading up to this one are glorious and compliant and show cognitive wheels spinning, but this is really the apotheosis of Mastin's play. Mastin brings in a huge reads list, and breaks down every single read in a comprehensible way that reflects consistent trajectory and comprehension/engagement in the game.

1033 and 1399 : Both of these reflect Mastin dispelling accusations in a calm, collected, and cognitive manner. He appeals to logic, makes good arguments in response, and really out-performs weak accusations and ideologies.

1587 : Here come the reveals that Mastin's been holding. While I originally thought this could be a really scum way of Mastin getting town consensus before making a 'reveal', his reveal here actually speaks a lot towards work he's been doing throughout the game and reflects a lot of the stances he's had. I see this as further articulation of his earlier reads, which, by this form that I'm using right the fuck here, I clearly agree with as a town process of sharing info. I think it's a little troubling that Mastin tries to link a definitive scum team, as I personally feel that finding one scum is enough on D1, but he's doing his thing and that's awesome. I tend to never look for associations on D1, since bussing is actually quite common and scum is capable of anything. The fact that Mastin dropped this load of text and then -stayed around to talk about it- really speaks towards his towniness. If I were scum, I wouldn't stand by my wall, I'd let idiots clamor all over it and kill themselves picking through. No--Mastin's here for clarity and is pushing stridently and compliantly towards getting town on a good scum consensus.

NACHOMAMMA8 : 37 POSTS : TOWN
WHY:

I originally was a bit more than paranoid when Nacho took a while to really get into the game, but I had to remind myself that’s just how Nacho tends to approach games in general. When he does get down to brass tacks, he’s very concise, open with his logic, and strong with his reads and his pressure. Metal Sonic also agrees and posits that this is definitely Nacho’s town game.

Spoiler:

531 : Nacho's real entrance to the game, where he mostly just cryptically calls people town left and right, then leaves after voting Venmar. It's... really suspicious.

642 : Really drills his scum-reads, which is a really solid Nacho move. I'm used to seeing these really harsh one line quips from Nacho that get to the core of what he feels is wrong in people's play, and that's super-evident in this post. The transition to the BRO wagon makes sense in that context. Pressure is good here, and very town. Nacho is pursuing his own reads, rather than testing the waters and playing coy.

995 : Ach, Nacho is such a headache for me to read because he does stuff like the former post I linked, then pushes votes like this one without giving reasons or articulation or even transition and blah.

1485 : This is the post that made me really fall in love with Nacho in this game. He addresses all of my points, which is something I had given up on happening. This speaks to a few things: Nacho is mindful of town, and isn't just glossing/skimming the game, which becomes really evident when he gets articulate. Nacho is also seeing a lot of the same things I am--namely, my shift in thought on Mala and my feelings that TD's frustration felt a bit artificial. This post really epitomizes most of Nacho's content posts throughout the game, too.

NICK THE NAME : 50 POSTS : SCUM
WHY:

I have Nick as null-leaning-scum (more of a benefit of the doubt affordance), but MS is convinced he’s dyed-in-the-wool scum. He’s been really inconsistent in his play across the board, and his reads-list has been pretty betrayed by his own play later. He seems very intent on getting hydras all mislynched, and this is what really rubs MS the wrong way, who cited posts like 441 and 538 against us as evidence for this. I feel like the disparity in his play, the lack of being able to cognitively map him, and his swapping between early votes on just-born wagons to testing the waters with Rach is troubling, especially in light of how defensively he’s been playing this game.

Spoiler:

61 : Explains a terrible, reactionary vote here. Even concedes that it might just be a different approach in playstyle, but never makes clear -that's what he is pressuring-. His vote feels like a genuine get-lynched kinda vote here.

102 : Another vote of reaction-levels, and here with frustration as the only discernible reason why. It's not a very town transition in votes or rationale for either.

201 : you know what this game needs? More IC bashing. Don't encourage or challenge the slot to create content, noooo, that's bad town. Just tell NS that his play was shitty or bad or dumb and suffocate his voice.

218 : Another jarring leap in vote. Nick seems to play a very reactionary game, and since he's given no real reads so far, it's not like I can call him scum for it. His 533 addresses this concern, so, eh?

232 : The logic presented here rings true for Nick, which makes his push make a bit more sense, but I wish it didn't have to get questioned out of him.

748 : Finally does something other than putting suspicion on hydras and pushing/defending his mac vote. I like this engagement, but this is a bit early to be town-reading mala, imo.

873 : About time you got some articulated reads on the table. Could use this as evidence of town gauging, but the reads speak against it. Gotta love how he's got hydras all grouped in his scum/null scum slots. If he just has frustration/difficulty reading hydras, he shouldn't have them all there. His vote on me isn't very well articulated and actually relies on the fact that I was playing logically based on my misunderstanding at one point. Also don't like his point on Mastin. His scum-reads outside of mac aren't very substantive and his town reads are all based in

feels

and

looks

.

938 : A really bad case on Mastin, who I'm reading as town at this point. Nick's points are a misrep/strawman on Nick's part, perception of a 'slip', and interpretation of lying without giving proof otherwise.

969 : Nick, this sounds a lot like an unfounded OMGUS and I don't know if you're painting it in such a way to avoid responsibility, or if you're legit making a case against someone because his reasons for voting you aren't as articulated as you'd like. Mastin isn't even being exploitative, he's actually really well plotted out if you read him. Having difficulty wrapping my head around town motivation for Nick's case on Mastin.

1022 : Despite practically town-reading Rach earlier, Nick's quick to throw some fuel on the building Rach fire right here without committing a vote.

1386 : Gotta call everyone scum, dont'cha?

1504 : This last post is more of what I've seen in 1022. It's like Nick's testing the waters too much with the Rach wagon. If he supports it, he should vote it, and get a damn reaction from it, or something. That's how Nick was playing in his first dozen posts, but it's completely gone here.

NOTSCIENCE: 146 POSTS : TOWN
WHY:

Confirmed Innocent Child role. Also, NS’s play here is very akin to his town play elsewhere on-site. It makes me really upset that people are trying to suffocate his voice. You know who you are, shitlords. I see you postin’ round thread, with NS suffocation and I’m like,
Fuck You.

Spoiler:

MS edit: oh look a picture

RACH MARIE : 18 POSTS : NULL
WHY:

Metal Sonic has Rach Marie as scum, but I’m really seeing this as her town game. I’ve –never- seen Rach post a reads list, so I’m pretty damn bewildered, but what makes me sold on the fact that she’s town is how much people are trying to justify a lynch on her without using any info. They just keep saying she’s useless and stifling her voice while simultaneously testing the waters to see if the wagon’ll just explode. It’s infuriating to see her slot handled that way, and she does bring a bit of it on herself, but it feels like a lot of the people that want to see her lynched want it for all the wrong reasons.

Spoiler:

I was going to do a PbP for Rach, but it'd be so meta-based and IIoA that I threw it out right when I got started. I can't read Rach's posts worth a damn, and it always feels like she engages games in this way. The way other people interacted with her wagon, though, that's what makes me think she's town. Also, Nacho and Mastin make pretty good and unbiased points on her.

SKULL DUGGERY : REPLACED OUT : NULL
WHY:

MS was reading the slot as null without enough content and I saw Skull as town with appropriate content for the areas when Skull was still catching up. Still, the replace out rings a bit town as me, but MS insists it’s a null read that we should make and just start from the ground-up with whoever replaces in.
MS edit: yeah she’s hosting a game so she’s pretty busy but in Calvin&Hobbes (with varsoon, bro, and desperado) she was able to put a signboard over her head that says “TOWN TOWN TOWN”. I don’t see that here which makes me sad

SOUND OF SILENCE : 183 POSTS : TOWN
WHY:

This hydra is one of the other slots that both MS and I agree on the alignment of fully. I was skeptical of the play coming from the hydra, but it was addressed and now I’m fairly confident in reading it. SoS has a very minimal approach, especially in the early game, but is town in how they handle inquiries and pressure. There’s a good deal of consistency and forging individual reads rather than going with town consensus.

Spoiler:

234 : This is a pretty damn usual line of questioning that I expect from this hydra. It's non-committal, and cuts to the core of what's being asked.

488 : Gives Varsoon a boner.

492 : This is where I immediately saw the slot as town. It rings really true with the play that's been implemented by the slot so far. I don't know how, but this hydra is like a damn Zen master, empty yet able to effectively strike blows and corral its targets.

596 : Scum SoS would have a vote here. Town SoS seems to build suspicion and let players answer for themselves rather than exploiting a case and pushing a potential mislynch.

955 : Reads list is very in-line with SoS's play so far. It doesn't need to justify anything, but also doesn't contradict earlier play and shows a logical progression from the start of the game based on SoS's interactions.

1099 : If I am reading correctly, this is the first serious vote from this slot. It goes to show how conservative SoS is, which speaks a lot to the town approach both MS and I are perceiving from the slot right now--SoS could easily be exploitative and use that minimal approach to cloud information, positioning, etc, and mislynch for days. That's not the case. I see very clearly every move SoS takes and it isn't fluffed up with rhetoric and bullshit. SoS is playing a very thoughtful, town-minded game here.

1139 : This shows how serious SoS takes the game, if no one was following it to this point. There's direct engagement with me, and, through our exchange, SoS changes their mind on the slot, which I feel is pretty compelling and town to do, given how easy of a wagon I am to push today.

1158 : If nothing else compels me to read this slot as town, this does. It not only engages directly and answers a question with a helpful, pro-town response, but also gives much-desired elaboration on certain reads that's consistent and concise. This approach gets echoed a lot in later posts, too.

THEZMON221 : 64 POSTS : SCUM
WHY

: I re-he-he-heeaaaly hate this slot’s play. He takes town consensus left and right, sheeps whatever wagon is going large at the time, parrots what other people say (even tries to act like his points are genuinely his), and suffocates any arguments that are posited otherwise. The worst thing is that he admits to all this, too. MS also feels that the play from this slot is bad, and will not object to a lynch on him.

Spoiler:

506 : A bit late to be exploiting my posts for a mislynch, isn't it? No info is given in response to my posts, but just broad, victimizing speculation.

510 : Doesn't seem to have experience with the Rach. Caught between a Rach and a hard place? Whatever gets his Rachs off. This post certainly can't stop the Rach. Okay, okay, I'm done. Really, though, I hate his buddy/corral of Muffin Man here and in the previous post. It's ugly.

629 : Gets so defensive with me, which is kinda cute, but not endearing in the least. Honestly, he assaults my character (you didn't read my posts approach), and somehow thinks his reads-list doesn't just parrot town sensibilities? Okay, sure. He even provided the qualifier of feeling weaker about scum, as if those reads could shift drastically given new evidence. Sounds real confident, individually progressive, and town. Wait, no, it's actually the opposite of that.

647 : I hate all the distance this slot keeps making with "You don't know/understand".

671 : DING DING DING DING YOU ARE OUR ONE HUNDREDTH CUSTOMER! PLEASE TAKE THIS AWARD FOR BEING YET ANOTHER PERSON TO DISCOURAGE NS AND TELL HIM HIS PR PLAY WAS BAD! OH, YOU KEEP IT UP CONSISTENTLY ALL THE WAY TO POST 712! YOU SURE ARE HELPFUL, WITH LINES THAT POLARIZE THE IC AND IMPLY THAT -ALL OF TOWN- AGREES HE IS AN IDIOT! YOU SURE ARE GREAT! ALL HAIL THEZMON!
MS edit: holy shit what is this
But I also do feel that #655 and #647 (and more) were horribad

939 : Slips off my wagon when it's going nowhere to pursue an even easier one to push through to a mislynch? Oh, but I bet the reasons for it are soundly town and not something like, "I'm going to totally sheep Molliffy here, since it gives me the perfect reason to hop ships to a different wagon." Because, you know, that would only be like open admission to swapping to a wagon that you got consensus on before joining in scum-reading and then hopping when you saw an opportunity to do so! TheZMon would never implement such level-1 scum play! (Yeah bitches, the levels are back.)
MS edit: I don’t know what Varsoon does with his level1-2-3-4 town/scum play thing and I don’t wanna know xD
957 : It's a cool thing that you try to distance yourself from the scummy play of your slot earlier by being an insufferable elitist about it. Give me your number later cool guy, I want to go on a date and throw my drink at you and skip out on the bill. You'll probably call me scum for that, too, but won't hop on my wagon until a recognized townie does so. It's okay if you ironically refer to your play as scummy.

1015 : You're okay with any mislynch, that's good. Oh, hey, hold on, what was that? "But nick is a bigger wagon and more support has been garnered for it." Where... is the town motivation for sheeping the Nick wagon again? I know you parroted reasons why -other- townies want Nick hung, but why do you get a pass when you're clearly playing Level 1 Scum? Well, at the very least, you're trying to consistently stay on a wagon that you support, rather than throwing your vote onto whatever wagon has mass-appeal, right?

1017 : "If the nick wagon shows stalling, then I'll consider the switch." Oh, nevermind, I guess you

are

doing what I just said.

1354 : Well, at least, at the very least, TheZmon doesn't see it scummy when other people do the same thing as--"You go from championing a wagon... to immediately jumping ship the first logical sign of reasoning for mastin being town shows up? Anybody else get some whiplash here?" Okay, fuck it, I'm done. I give up. You're clearly yanking my chain or something. I bet you later go on to vote Rach, call more players useless, suffocate the IC, and tell people they are awful, don't understand, and CANNOT argue against you, for reasons that are poorly founded and contradict your play up to those points.
MS edit: Vig thezmon pls

TIPHANE DEATH : 76 POSTS : TOWN
WHY:

Our interactions with TD let us really see that his actions were motivated by a town polarization/frustration against me rather than scum motivation. His votes kinda fly all over the place, but he’s very detailed in what brings him from one point of mind to another, and his votes tend to be pretty outlying and individual. MS is reading the slot as town with me, so it kinda locks it in for me right now.

Spoiler:

I’m so tired of this post-by-post and it’s 3 AM and I’ve been working on it for 10 hours now. No one is probably even going to read what’s behind the spoilers, either. Also, it’s fucking hard to do a Post-by-Post-Analysis on a player like TiphaneD, who posts so across the board with one-liners, quips, and so on. I feel like I already engaged in some significant interaction with him in the early-day that gave me this read, and he’s been living up to it so far.
MS edit: 9k words lmao

TRUST FUND : 178 POSTS : SCUM
WHY:

Trust Fund’s contributions to the game are high-noise and low content, often sheeping out popular and pushable wagons such as Mastin, Skull, and me. Post 1077 really epitomizes this, as the kill list goes for days on people who town is iffy about/has a current scummy read on. TF doesn’t broker wagons or even do significant scum hunting, but just sits in the thread, gut reacts to posts, and passes off reads that magically change and come out of nowhere when it’s convenient to the hydra to have someone in the scum or town slot. MS agrees on the points about insubstantial and loud contributions and posits that TF has a lot of fluff and he has no clue who Sasha is.
MS edit: I later realize that sasha is cabd
If that is the case then cabd has lots of explaining to do(because this is poor considering my high expectations from him)
Vars Edit: I think Sasha is supposed to be Syrana?

Spoiler:

VENMAR : 94 POSTS : NULL-LEANING-TOWN
WHY :

Venmar’s frustration feels pretty town to me, to be honest. While I don’t agree with most of his points, especially the ones against Mastin, it feels like Venmar sees himself as a bit isolated and unrecognized as a voice in this game, despite his high output of noise. If anything, his play reminds me of myself in Xenoblade. MS is unsure if to read him as null-leaning-scum or just village idiot/town.

Spoiler:

ZMUFFINMAN : 86 POSTS : NULL-LEANING-TOWN
WHY :

MS insists that Zmuffinman is town, citing his strong town contributions, willingness to engage with the game/players in it, and his helpfulness to people so far. Personally, I haven’t had any interaction with him so far, so I’m null on the slot, with some hints of scumminess and some of towniness, especially since I don’t know how to really interpret a lot of the posturing happening here. Still, I’m gonna defer this one to MS, because he’s a bit better at reading people who we haven’t directly engaged with, whereas I feel like I’m more on the mark when I’ve gotten the chance to talk to someone.

Spoiler:

[Kagami]

Experiential meta tells me varsoon is town

Which part? Elaborate please.

~GC

General tone, certain stances and viewpoints that vary markedly. I can't really be too specific without talking about ongoing games.

Too scummy to be scum, but being scum all the same. A man said Kat is distancing from the other 4 on the list. A boy is still a stand alone.

lol

So what do you think about tsukasa, my adorable sister?

I think it's a Saki alt.

Last I checked they were using a lot of words to basically say they were going with the flow. Eh. Null-scum. You?

She's not a saki alt. I meant that she said the same thing as I just did without attracting your scrutiny. I agree to Null or null-scum, though.

[Kagami]

Jesus, that's a long post. I'd say scum-varsoon.

[Kagami]

And I appear to be right.

[Jaqen Hghar]

I'm not going to point out the several times that GCBC has implied that I am scum, called me stupid, etc. Instead, I'm going to focus on points that I haven't answered already, and quote points that I have. GCBC has spent some time arguing that I can’t point to where he misrepresented me, despite the fact that I did in my original case on him. I wasn’t overtly specific about each post I made, next to each post he misrepped, but I don’t need to be, because in the words of GCBC himself, “THE WHOLE WORLD CAN SEE AND READ.” When I say X and GCBC writes that I said Y, I can write, “That’s not true” and I expect that I don’t have to point out how Y is not X. Alas, here goes:

-My Original Case on GCBC, Including Where he Misrepresented Me, as It was Always a Part of My Original Case and I Have No Clue Why GCBC Has Been Acting Like It Wasn't There:

Spoiler:

With the failure of the Pieguyn wagon to take off, GCBC surely was looking for a different mislynch. He's been walling with the IC all day as a distraction that's largely anti-town (all while trying to dress it up as a failure on the IC's part and as a huge town effort on his own). His rhetoric has betrayed him as scum, his play is scummy, and he's a jerk.

Sheep me for great victory.

The best part of the GCBC walling is that he's been constantly trying to get the IC to vote for someone he thinks is an easy mislynch. This serves two purposes--it lets him fuel a mislynch with the notion that since the IC is on it then it's a good lynch, and to further discredit the IC once the flip becomes town. This way, he can keep the IC around, avoid getting scum-read, and make the IC take blame for his own agenda.

It's brilliant, but your plan had one hole, GCBC.
Varsoon is in this game.
Wiggling can commence now.

Pieguyn's play has been admitted as weak by even Pieguyn. He's an easy target, and the votes on the Pieguy wagon reflect people noticing and pushing that. I mentioned this, noticed it, and that's when GCBC decided that I was a threat. He's made me his foe, and has been rallying for my lynch while still sitting on the Pieguyn wagon. He's in the buttery part of that wagon too, right where scum has a good opportunity to jump on and avoid the blame for hammering AND starting the wagon, all while seemingly presenting a case. Pieguyn's not even around to respond to the 'pressure' that GCBC has retconned his push to represent (as seen in the recent posts by GCBC). All of this points at scum who's holding out of the mislynch of the day (Pieguy) while rallying for another in case that goes tits up. Why not just get off the pie wagon to vote me and push a case on me if I'm his scum-read? Once again, GCBC is being scummy with his voting and is trying to get others to start the push and votes, so he can slide on in a way that won't reflect poorly on him once I flip.

Like I said, clever--but not enough to slip by me.
See, that's the most beautiful thing about the uninterested gambit. I can wait for a scummy player to push for my lynch for scummy reasons--they're silly and somehow think I haven't been reading, or that I won't put up a fight or counter-case. You've walked right into my trap, GCBC. You're caught. Give up.

GCBC, that's no good indicator of your alignment. Just like a trust-tell (something that I have extensive experience with), it's only good until you abuse it, when it's great. How do I know you're not cashing in on your 'mollie-always reads me correctly' card in this game? I don't. Therefore, it's worthless as a strategy and only works to leverage you power against scrubs. Why would you want to leverage that sort of power, or convince us that you're town in such a way?
Town wouldn't need to. Scum would.

Wiggle~Wriggle~


P-EDIT: Never said that the IC is scum--that's another misrep there.
In fact, your entire reply reeks of not actually following the argument I put forward and/or an attempt to trivialize it.
Why would you want to not actually read my argument or trivialize it?
Because you're scum.

Wiggle~

P-P-EDIT: More discrediting/trivializing. Every word serves a purpose. You forgot that. That's why your rhetoric has betrayed you.

You've walked right into my trap, GCBC. You're caught. Give up.

Also when you pad your posts with literally 100% useless shit fluff like this, do you expect your post to somehow be more convincing? Or larger? Or, you know, less damning?

Oh hey look I can do it too~

Another note on this--chill out. It's a game. Of course I'm going to have fun with it. All words serve a purpose, but more than that, if you consider flavor, asides, and anything not wholly related to 'the game' to be '100% useless shit fluff'--keep it to yourself. Elitism has its place, but we're playing a party game on a forum with a little noose and a gun in the banner. Relax.

Your citation of fact is exactly the sort of thing that scum-you would use, as you've just admitting by claiming you'd burn the floor you stand on for a scum win. You'd go to any length to win, and so it makes plenty of sense that you'd make that play. Your. Rhetoric. Betrays. You.

You're playing the game. See how you just leveraged that Mollie has scum-read you in this game, thus making yourself seem more town? By writing...

So, if shes scumreading me, and I'm scum, I'm stating that her read on me will be correct by the end of today.... why, exactly? What''s my motive? To pray to Arceus that she will 180 her read? With a good percentage of the player base townreading me?

...you are making an argument for that sort of play as against your wincon as scum. This is why I claimed scum when I was manipulating the Trust Tell. Players would figure that I wouldn't do something so against my wincon as scum, and that I must be town for it. It works due to the logic exhibited by town who expect low-level play.

Furthermore, if Mollie does ultimately town read you, you can ride that to the bank. If Mollie waffles on you, you can use that as leverage to push a mislynch on her later in the game because you know she's a powerful opponent of yours.

Most players are too wrapped up in your web of lies to figure this all out,
But I'm on the outside and I'm looking in. I can see through you--see your true colors. 'Cause inside you're ugly. You're ugly like me I can see through you. See to the real you.

The Dram and Action Dan votes on me are awkward sheeps to say the least. I don't quite follow their hop to my wagon, but since I've nabbed my scum verdict, I'll be chasing him all day.

You sure about that? Here is what I saw from his posts.

I make a post saying I am town (because I am and I know that despite others not having the same luxury). Varsoon says, "How can you say that? Only one person is confirmed town". Which I found odd-scum-odd because...

A) He CONFIRMED HIMSELF as town in his first post AND his second post using the explicit words "However, I'm town, so there's no use in voting me, as

I am now confirmed town.

." And I know he was specifically referring to Jacquen as being confirmed town, or at the very least should have considering how he has been posting.

B) If he were town, he should realize that as town, in a game with an IC, you should know that two people are town (yourself and the IC). It is an INTEGRAL part of scum-hunting. But if he were scum, he would have to pretend he was town (like in his first posts) and the realization wouldn't come natively.

C) I never said I was confirmed town. What I said was Jacquen was tunneling on town which I know to be a true statement.

THEN comes the back tracking when I call him out... (paraphrased in my own words)

GC - Remember when you confirmed yourself town? Why are you saying there is only one confirmed town? You must be scum.
Vars - Oh uhh no, really you can know your uhh own alignment sure, but you cant uhh expect people to trust you. (coming from someone who got banned for a trust tell - oh the irony)
Vars - YEAH you are being dense. I can of course claim town, but you cant use it in an argument. YOU are being weak and anti-town.

What happened to?

I'm gonna slap you nerds with the nitty gritty:

I'm not going to participate in this game very much.

Then comes an onslaught of posts after I call him out. And then comes an admission of a "gambit".

My take: He wanted to chill out D1. Got caught up in the moment trying to help garner support for my lynch and slipped from his fake-stance put forth at the beginning of the day. Now because I actually have a decent case for Varsoon-Scum, he is scrambling and has dropped his "I'm not going to participate in this game very much" because he is in repair-image-mode.

Hey Varsoon! Since you like OMGUS so much...

VOTE: Varsoon

This is a good lynch.

~GC

The basis of your read on him is his claiming confirmed town. Point B if I understand it correct.

I don't see how his cockiness on how he self-confirmed himself as town is a scumtell, that's not really alignment indicative. Read his Signature even.

That's how I interpreted his early posts.

You really need to re-read my post.

In simple terms, Varsoon said only one person is confirmed town (The mod-confirmed IC). When in reality if you are town, from your point of view, there should be two confirmed town. Varsoon isn't town, so he forgot that point when he made that post. This is aside from the hypocritical posts where he confirmed himself town and

then

said only the mod-confirmed IC was confirmed town.

Mollie, even confirmed town can throw games. Just because they are town and everyone knows it doesn't give them a crystal ball.

Your degree of misrepresentation in these posts alone is staggering.
1: You're twisting my gambit of seeming uninterested and catching you into something to scumpaint me. You're trying to deny me agency, which is to assume that I couldn't possibly be doing what I said I was doing. This is a scum tactic. You're attempting to disarm and devalue my arguments and approach. You're also going on as if I'm lying and making a push at disenfranchising my voice.
2: You've completely disregarded the post where I posit that the only way to be truly confirmed to the rest of the game's players is via the moderator. Of course, that post wouldn't be very helpful since it blows a hole in your entire misrepresentation of the facts of our exchange.

You're trying to doctor yourself up as a 'winner', and me as an illogical, lying, scummy loser. The truth is that you're (very obviously) lying about our interaction in order to simultaneously devalue me as a player and push a wagon on me. You've committed the fallacy of presenting a strawman. This comes in the form of you re-writing our dialogue to make me seem like a bumbling, backpedaling moron and painting yourself as a calm voice of reason and cogency. In short, fuck you. I really want to replace out of this game, and have done so when people've been this way before, but I'm going to stay in it. I won't rest until you're dead--and not because you're an asshole, but because you're scum.

Could everyone who is not on my wagon or GCBC's wagon please shift to voting for one of us?

I want him dead or I want to die. Either way, one of us should not come out of this alive.

-

In the case of ‘Hurling Sexual-Preference Epithets’ (Post 1378)

:

Spoiler:

instead of insulting the people who've called you out.

Says the man who hurls sexual-preference epithets... Contradiction #1024?
~GC

This refers to my earlier remarks in Post 1350.

Why is this scummy?

Instead of continuing to engage my points, GCBC continues an insult-contest, insulting me as a 'man who hurls sexual-preference epithets'.
GCBC also devalues what I have to say by the added hyperbole of 'Contradiction #1024' (meaning that this is my 1024th contradiction) as well as acting as if he shouldn't stop insulting me solely because he perceives me as insulting him.

Why is this wrong?

'Rainbow Wizard' refers to this painting in the popular dating sim, Katawa Shoujo. Several jokes surround the nature of the painting, but the primary focus of these jokes is that the painting itself is a fiendish creature bent on cruelty. This is because the painting seems to stalk you through the game. Images such as this one were made, and the Rainbow Wizard is even a boss in the fan-made Katawa Shoujo Lite game. I used the words 'Rainbow Wizard' to refer to GCBC due to his fiendish and cruel nature of stalking me throughout the game, and how I was trying to avoid making it more than it actually was at the time by refusing to go point-by-point with him.
'Gandalf The Gay' refers to Dumbledore of the Harry Potter franchise as well as the actor Ian McKellen (who portrays Gandalf in the Lord of the Rings films). This serves the purpose of poking fun at the way in which GCBC has been acting like he has wizardly knowledge of the truth of things, while serving the purpose of a whimsical rhyme within my sentence. While Dumbledore has been confirmed as a homosexual by the author JKRowling and Ian McKellen is a gay rights activists and self-proclaimed homosexual, I don't understand how anyone could find being referred to as one or the other as an insult, but more on that... now.

With these dual layers of reference to relatively obscure titles, I was taking part in the further dance that GCBC and I have been engaged in. GCBC wrote that I used big words in order to mask the fact that I didn't know things, so as a further representation of using things that GCBC considers in this fashion, I used these two little-known references to continue that ongoing interaction. Of course, he didn't understand either one, and assumed that I was insulting him instead of referring to him as an irreverent bumbling old wizard man who's purpose in this game has largely been to send ill-will my way, ultimately ending in my death if anyone takes him too seriously.

On the topic of interpreting either of those to be an insult using a 'homosexual epithet', neither were, and by entering the dialectic where you assume that they are, you are further propping up the notion that homosexuality is an insult. I never intended it as such, and it's clear from my post that I wasn't using homosexuality in order to devalue GCBC's character or play at all. If anything, you shouldn't be offended to be called a homosexual at all, especially in the case that I provided, where the only interpretable instance of homosexuality being mentioned was in likening GCBC to Ian McKellen/Dumbledore, and in that case, both men stand as proud and strong figures for the homosexual community as well as generally wonderful people independent of their sexual orientation.

-In the case of 'Using Big Words I Don't Know the Meaning Of' (Post 1361):

Spoiler:

Why is This Scummy?

Here, GCBC insults me while simultaneously trying to devalue my play by insinuating that I'm hiding behind a layer of 'big words that I don't know the meaning of'. The word particular that he is referring to here is 'strawman', as it was the one quoted. Oh, it's also a lie, since I do know the meaning of every word I use, which leads into...

Why is this Wrong?

The notion of using 'big words' is already a failed one. This is an English board, and therefore, I expect everyone to be able to identify and understand whatever words that I choose to use. The argument that I'm putting forth more elaborate rhetoric in order to mask the fact I don't know things is laughable, mostly because it would be incredibly transparent if that was the case, and would make for a poor rhetorical decision in the first place.
As for the 'Strawman Fallacy', I posted a link explaining what it was in my post 1108, then provided exactly where GCBC was strawman-ing me.
When I provide the example of where you're doing it, and I provide a link to a page that describes it, you'd figure that I know what it is.

-In the case of 'Varsoon Thinks Claiming Confirms Him (as Town)' (Post 1243):

Spoiler:

Why is this Scummy?:

GCBC has constantly been reiterating this notion that I believe claiming confirms me as town. By writing that 'Varsoon thinks', he belittles my intellectual process by presenting the notion that I wildly believe in something as wrong as a claim clearing a player. He’s posited that I must be scum because I don’t consider myself confirmed town. Furthermore, it's a straight-up lie, because...

Why is this Wrong?:

In post 978 I explain that the only way to be truly confirmed is by the mod, and that a claim never will change that. This holds true throughout. What GCBC is likely hanging on to is my early posts in the game where I claim town and call myself 'confirmed town' for it. This is a clear joke, and a reference to how I used trust tells such as that one in the past. GCBC is also likely referring to my post 1110 where I full claim to 'further confirm myself as town'. The rhetoric in this sentence alone reflects the fact that my use of 'confirm' and GCBC's are not the same. The 'confirm' the GCBC is trying to act like I am putting forth here is the absolute--as in, I would absolutely be confirmed, as if by a mod. However, I use the adverb 'further' to modify confirm, because I am using the verb 'confirm' as an process. I believe that my claim makes me seem more town, which further confirms me in this way. Even if I die, it further confirms me in this way. GCBC has been acting as though I've meant that my claim holds the same power and absolute nature of a mod-confirm, although it's obvious from my use of the adverb 'further' as well as my points in post 978 that is not the case.

Posts like 1054 reflect GCBC continuing to misinterpret and/or misrepresent what I meant in post 978. In fact, 1054 is a really great example of GCBC calling me scum, acting as though I didn’t think I was town-confirmed (when I explicitly wrote that I know I’m town, but that’s only knowledge that only a few single players know).

-In the case of 'Claiming Slayers Gambit in Response to a Wagon Forming on Him' (Post 1243):

Spoiler:

Why is this Scummy?:

GCBC is using commonly-used site-related terms to refer to my play in order to demean it, calling it a 'shitty response' and presenting it as factitious (there's another big word for you, GCBC. It means fake or artificial, usually referring to that artificiality in a lying sort of way). This devalues my play while simultaneously stripping me of agency by acting like I am only claiming the use of a gambit, rather than actually using it.

Why is this Wrong?:

It only takes a bit of site-meta to know that I follow my games and am extremely active in them. It takes a bit of research to realize I've been posting in other games as well as in my Hydra while I've been in this game. It only takes reading this game to realize that I've been following along with it day by day from the content I've produced that speaks towards the game as a whole. Therefore, positing that I'm just claiming a 'Slayers Gambit' instead of actually doing it (which, if you look, I actually did) is a lie. In post 1230, GCBC directly speaks about my gambit and calls it scummy, which means that he does acknowledge that I actually did perform the gambit—this stands in direct contradiction of him acting as if I just claimed a gambit.
Furthermore, the 'wagon forming on me' was Chamber of Kittens (who inherited an old vote on me from the Remembrance Slot) and Jaqen. That's two votes, one of which had no push behind it (Chamber). Two votes doesn't mean very much on D1 of a large game, and so by acting as if my gambit (or, my bad, 'claim of a gambit') was in response to the wagon forming on me, then GCBC presenting me as someone who would make so much noise over only two little votes. That wasn't the case at all, as is apparent by the fact that my responses were directly in reference to GCBC and didn't seek to clear me nearly as much as they did to pressure and expose the GCBC slot.

Ultimately, what does this mean?
GCBC has been misrepresenting, insulting, devaluing, and demeaning me as well as other players throughout the course of the game. His play is scummy, anti-town, and anti-fun. He is, for me, every bit an actual lynch as he is a policy lynch. His waffling between wagons while pushing cases for various people as scum while avoiding to committing to any one is suspicious at best and absolutely scummy at worst.

So, one last time,
VOTE: GCBC

VOTE: GCBC

VOTE: GCBC