Tales of You (Endgame)

[CarbonFiber]

Me too.

This alone should be a cause for return.

[Titan]

I won't touch you, I promise

I mean, unless you don't mind working and talking to me. I would like to do that, since orci-town read on you guys gave me a chance to not not let my paranoia drive me to scum-read your slot, and figure out where/why I town-read you as scum, and scum-read you as town and pick up your town-markers

I don't mind talking or working with anyone. What I do mind happening is what happened in NY169 and I'm not going to let the game devolve into a distraction any more than it already has.

Maybe I jumped the gun and I'm feeling a bit sensitive. I just automatically think here we go again and it freaks me out and it's not something I want to deal with.

I don't even mind you being paranoid of me legitimately; I just hate feeling trolled and pushed to a breaking point. I don't think that people realize the toll it takes to being pushed especially by those who don't know how to read the reaction properly and can't take in the residual effects.

pedit: I <3 all of you. I'm sorry. I realized I overreacted awhile ago but my internet sucks.

[Nachomamma8]

awww, that's better

[CarbonFiber]

I'm glad you are back. Many kittens were spared from being kicked.

Nacho feels town-town-town-town-town during this whole thing.

[Yggdra Union]

<3

this game is full of feels. (((tammy)))

[Brian Skies]

Three's a charm.

Spoiler:

I strongly doubt Mac could have been killed from anything other than scum

This pretty much sums up my thoughts about the N1 kills. I don't think Mac was being scumread by anyone in this playerslist (and was actually being townread by a fair handful of players). So I still think he was either directly or indirectly killed by the scumteam.

*Mastin/Bro are talking in circles around each other and I just want one of them to flip.

I felt Mastin's initial attack on me was incredibly manipulative and scummy and that feeling still hasn't gone away but I am not as sure as I was before.

Are you referencing the 'rage-posting'? Because I remember that and I was townreading you/scumreading Mastin from those interactions. I may or may not have mentioned them somewhere earlier in thread (but I'm pretty sure I had you above Mastin/RBD in terms of reads early on and Notty may/may not have opposed it; he also opposed my Mac townread for w/e reason that is unknown to me).

I'm really curious about this because I'm pretty sure you heavily implied that both of you should be aware of your 'investigative action.'

If I did, it was only because I was still defaulting to thinking they were scum and would therefore know.

AP: Your (Actual, no BS) investigate target in your next post with the result you got.

You and I was explicitly told that my role failed.

Pretty sure this is a heavy implication that both of you should be aware of your investigation result.

Declaration of 1v1

I don't care. I'm still voting you and contemplating moving my vote.

*Nothing about this Nacho/Mastin 1v1 tells me either (or both) of them are town.

*I'm still confused about AP/Mastin because despite Mastin continuing the tunneling and trying to lynch AP, AP still seems determined to defend that slot.

JSU have been more active since their slow entrance into the thread and have been increasingly vocal and active as time goes by. I do think that some of their intermediate thought processes and read progressions are hidden in the neighborhood but the trend has been towards more openness. I think more than AP's replacement, it was Rancid's response to their vote on them that spurred them into action.

I don't remember the vote and will have to check up on that in the near future.

Regarding their slow start, they lacked transparency in the thread and may or may not have been almost entirely hidden in the neighborhood. I wouldn't call being voted at that point in time for lack of presence/transparency to be unfair. I also didn't like Bro suddenly perking his head up when AP came into the thread and townreading AP for doing something EXACTLY the same way he did in another game (and this was something I was in complete agreement with RBD early on). The frustration at getting suspected for supposedly "townreading AP correctly" also pinged me in a bad way.

You say GiF/Pie and Bro/Desp have been incredibly town in your neighborhood, but the vast majority of it hasn't bled into the thread. So don't be surprised when people refuse to accept their towniness when all we have is your word for it.

Do you think that his showing up near deadline makes him town or scum? Can you clarify this? I think in more recent games, Nacho has been whiteknighting townies a lot towards deadline. For instance in NY169 (I think this happened after you replaced out), he spent quite a bit of time defending both me and Varsoon-Mac hydra and then left and the deadline lynch was decided by the people who were online a few hours before deadline.

The timing is an okay reason to suspect him, but it's not really a factor. I think the important point is the wagons he tends to push. When he's town, he might push bad wagons, but there's a methodical approach to it and you can see the town motivation to it. As scum, he's not really looking to determine alignments and it's mostly because he thinks he can push the wagon (see BJC in PYP) or he has no choice but to push it (see Sakura Hana in 169). Also, Sakura Hana seems to be the designated scum mislynch target for a small handful of players in this playerslist (as well as the mod). Also, about 90% of 169 still remains unread for me and I was only following what my replacement was doing and the last one or two days of the game.

Going back towards the Orci lynch, what was the town motivation in pushing that? How would his lynch have benefited town (with the exception of Orci not being a self-governing gladiator and flipping scum)? At best it was a supposed feel-good lynch that avoided resolving the major issues in the game thread at hand and wouldn't have even served as a useful information lynch.

I was townreading Pie for the same reasons and the read going stale is reasonable. BUT, he's still been town-town-town in the neighborhood so I guess you should just wait for him to return.

Whatever. He's going to have to come out of the neighborhood at some point. Kind of hard to trust somebody who's spending most of his time hiding behind a neighborhood QT.

I agree. I was scumreading Mastin at that time and I thought AP's reaction felt off which led me to think they might both be scum.

It's one of the great unsolved mysteries of this game. And their interactions with each other feel really weird for two players who supposedly are able to read each other really well.

What specifically? I had the opposite reaction to most of their posts.

It's hard to go back and point a lot of it out because it requires effort I'm not interested in putting into this game (and I don't remember a lot of Day 1). But to summarize, I greatly disliked Mastin's initial post against you for supposedly 'rage-posting.' It didn't look that way at all. I thought there was some merit to you trying to buddy up to Tammy. I also agreed with RBD about Bro's initial townread on AP being halfassed and bad. I also didn't like the lack of transparency from JSU early on and suddenly perking up when AP came around (apparently there was a neighborhood). I also shared the same sentiments about the Fox being skeevy for just pushing people and wondering why they weren't being townread by a lot of players early on when they haven't really contributed much up to that point. For the most part, I was reading Day 1 pretty loosely, skipping/skimming posts, and just picking sides and running with them.

Also, you were being scumread by at least one of them (while the other just backed up the attack), so there's completely different perspectives between us (with me having an outsider POV).

Also, can you please get those Notty walls in thread. I'd love to see where you guys are at.

His walls are largely just him marking down whenever somebody's read changes and making an opinion on it (as well as whatever thoughts he has about the slot). He hasn't done anything since the first 5 isos and I don't really know what he's been up to recently (probably having a life, chasing girls, trying not to fail classes, milking me for all I'm worth). I've just been on autopilot. And I've been handwaving his walls for now because my opinions on trajectories is that there's a lot more to read progression than just looking at where somebody's read changes and for me to go back and look at each trajectory would require me to reread Day 1, which is something I've been dreading for a while now.

I've also been basically summarizing his thoughts in my recent walls. And I think you just want the main points anyways.

Give me specifics on what you want details on. There's about 20 pages in there. I explained my read on BRO-Desp read in that wall. I am actually unsure about my read on Nacho-Bork and they haven't posted a lot in there. It is mostly me, BRO-Desp, and PieInFreezer.

It's hard to pinpoint specifics because I don't really know what to look for. But having three slots from that neighborhood not posting a whole lot outside of the neighborhood (or inside the neighborhood for Nacho's case) pretty much leaves me in the dark when I can't see what you guys are talking about. I think the biggest thing is just seeing reads and reasoning for now. Other than that I'm pretty much forced to read you and decide whether or not I want to trust your reads on them.

Also, you seemed to disagree with Mastin quite a bit in your wall. How does that affect your read on him?

I think I disagreed with him a lot mostly based on minor non-alignment indicative stuff. My main issues with him is the circlejerk he keeps doing with other players in the thread (especially AP) and I wouldn't be opposed to lynching him. As far as scumreading him goes, I'm not and I don't know what to look for.

-Nacho is town and I'll never support anything resembling a lynch on him

This needs to be explained.

-mastin has spent this entire game day calling AP scum but he keeps looking for excuses to get off the wagon or vote someone else. personally I think this points towards mastin x AP team, but it could also make sense as mastin scum not wanting to antagonize AP town

I agree with you that this could be a MastinxAP team. A weird one, but it could be.

I'd pay cash money for a vig shot on mastin right now just to stop all the fucking posts

Well, I'd love to help you out and take your cash money, but I'm not a vig and this lunatic over here thought I was for some reason.

I found two

-mastin has spent this entire game day calling AP scum but he keeps looking for excuses to get off the wagon or vote someone else. personally I think this points towards mastin x AP team, but it could also make sense as mastin scum not wanting to antagonize AP town
-mastin has literally ACKNLOWLEDGED she's been flooding the thread with bullshit and her response to that is? continue flooding the thread with bullshit. sounds legit

-Y

I'm pretty sure everyone who thinks Mastin is scum is right here with these points.

I think everyone is here with these two points regardless of what they're reading Mastin.

I made you paranoid when i said I thought you were my strongest town read didn't I? I figured it would.

Of all the people in this game, why is ffery your strongest townread?

He's not getting lynched today so it doesn't really matter right now anyway.

He's low priority but I wouldn't just handwave developing a read on him.

Pie said in the neighborhood that he was falling behind and would come back and push for more votes on Mastin if they stopped coming.

Day 2 is way slower and way less wall infested and headache inducing than Day 1 was (depending on whether or not you choose to read Mastin's walls). So how the hell is he falling behind?

Perhaps you can offer a word to CupcakePanda that if hydras aren't his thing, another player may be better suited for the position he currently occupies.

Why? I don't even know why he's complaining considering most of the hydrae are currently being dominated by one head.

I didn't like their push on me after claiming miller and later retraction

, the challenge to gladiate JSU, the response to Fox's Disney vote on them, and Nati's post to Tammy were wierd and the way he approached his read on her didn't make sense.

I remember the bolded part. It was unexpected and scummy but somebody called it trolling and made me unsure. The rest I'm quoting so I'll look at it again later.

Also gods I hated Peres interaction with ffery.

Why? Ffery's only scumread this game has been Mastin and she hasn't moved forward to push that with any conviction whatsoever to sort out the rest of her reads. It's been bugging me and PV pointing it out made me extremely happy. I also know what Ffery's like and my previous experience with her is the only thing holding me back.

but I do try to work with town reads.

Me too. At least until they try to defend what I'm killing because he thought he saw a pony fart out a rainbow.

No longer thinking he's scum, though.

Because...?

Kind of hard to take this at face value when your proposed scum-team includes me, Nacho, and AP together as a group.

Me? I dunno. Rancid? Because you threatened him.

A joke that happened to perfectly predict that I was a treestump.

Well, I don't know what to tell you. The votecount implied you were most likely a treestump and I associated an alignment with the color as a joke. How you even find this joke alignment indicative is beyond me.

My role's passive, not active.

Not something I would know. And even if you're telling the truth about your ability being passive, I wasn't the one who activated it.

Almost as

boring

as Brian's. Why do you spoiler your posts again?

Why don't you like Brian-posts? I thoughts they were

cool

.

They are kinda

cool

, yeah.

Just boring

This doesn't compute.

I spoiler my longer posts because scrolling through them later on is a hassle especially if people (namely me) aren't specifically looking for the content in my posts. I also tend to fill up a lot of my longer catch-up walls with useless filler content that I refuse to take out of my walls.

Also, contrary to whatever you think I'm here for, it's not to entertain you.

Also, you're reading my slot as town despite Notty and I expressing our everlasting desire to see you hang. I'm slightly amused. You also almost always townread me when you're scum (can't think of a time where you haven't) so I'm pretending I never saw it.

Also, his hesitance about BRO townreading me makes sense as well.

I was talking about PV. The neighborhood paranoia I have is a completely different beast altogether.

There are things that bother me about players, but nothing that I've gone aha that's scum!

What about my slot bothers you (aside from anything related to PV)?

GIFPie, DespBRO and Orcinus. Beli's actually more bet the farm about Orcinus than I was before we talked.

That's unexpected.

Really? The only one I find weird is DespBRO.

Do you think the nature of how the wagon formed says anything about Rancid's alignment?

I just think the wagon was a terrible fucking wagon. Who started that wagon anyways?

[Red Gyarados]

Three's a charm.

Spoiler:

I strongly doubt Mac could have been killed from anything other than scum

This pretty much sums up my thoughts about the N1 kills. I don't think Mac was being scumread by anyone in this playerslist (and was actually being townread by a fair handful of players). So I still think he was either directly or indirectly killed by the scumteam.

*Mastin/Bro are talking in circles around each other and I just want one of them to flip.

I felt Mastin's initial attack on me was incredibly manipulative and scummy and that feeling still hasn't gone away but I am not as sure as I was before.

Are you referencing the 'rage-posting'? Because I remember that and I was townreading you/scumreading Mastin from those interactions. I may or may not have mentioned them somewhere earlier in thread (but I'm pretty sure I had you above Mastin/RBD in terms of reads early on and Notty may/may not have opposed it; he also opposed my Mac townread for w/e reason that is unknown to me).

I'm really curious about this because I'm pretty sure you heavily implied that both of you should be aware of your 'investigative action.'

If I did, it was only because I was still defaulting to thinking they were scum and would therefore know.

AP: Your (Actual, no BS) investigate target in your next post with the result you got.

You and I was explicitly told that my role failed.

Pretty sure this is a heavy implication that both of you should be aware of your investigation result.

Declaration of 1v1

I don't care. I'm still voting you and contemplating moving my vote.

*Nothing about this Nacho/Mastin 1v1 tells me either (or both) of them are town.

*I'm still confused about AP/Mastin because despite Mastin continuing the tunneling and trying to lynch AP, AP still seems determined to defend that slot.

JSU have been more active since their slow entrance into the thread and have been increasingly vocal and active as time goes by. I do think that some of their intermediate thought processes and read progressions are hidden in the neighborhood but the trend has been towards more openness. I think more than AP's replacement, it was Rancid's response to their vote on them that spurred them into action.

I don't remember the vote and will have to check up on that in the near future.

Regarding their slow start, they lacked transparency in the thread and may or may not have been almost entirely hidden in the neighborhood. I wouldn't call being voted at that point in time for lack of presence/transparency to be unfair. I also didn't like Bro suddenly perking his head up when AP came into the thread and townreading AP for doing something EXACTLY the same way he did in another game (and this was something I was in complete agreement with RBD early on). The frustration at getting suspected for supposedly "townreading AP correctly" also pinged me in a bad way.

You say GiF/Pie and Bro/Desp have been incredibly town in your neighborhood, but the vast majority of it hasn't bled into the thread. So don't be surprised when people refuse to accept their towniness when all we have is your word for it.

Do you think that his showing up near deadline makes him town or scum? Can you clarify this? I think in more recent games, Nacho has been whiteknighting townies a lot towards deadline. For instance in NY169 (I think this happened after you replaced out), he spent quite a bit of time defending both me and Varsoon-Mac hydra and then left and the deadline lynch was decided by the people who were online a few hours before deadline.

The timing is an okay reason to suspect him, but it's not really a factor. I think the important point is the wagons he tends to push. When he's town, he might push bad wagons, but there's a methodical approach to it and you can see the town motivation to it. As scum, he's not really looking to determine alignments and it's mostly because he thinks he can push the wagon (see BJC in PYP) or he has no choice but to push it (see Sakura Hana in 169). Also, Sakura Hana seems to be the designated scum mislynch target for a small handful of players in this playerslist (as well as the mod). Also, about 90% of 169 still remains unread for me and I was only following what my replacement was doing and the last one or two days of the game.

Going back towards the Orci lynch, what was the town motivation in pushing that? How would his lynch have benefited town (with the exception of Orci not being a self-governing gladiator and flipping scum)? At best it was a supposed feel-good lynch that avoided resolving the major issues in the game thread at hand and wouldn't have even served as a useful information lynch.

I was townreading Pie for the same reasons and the read going stale is reasonable. BUT, he's still been town-town-town in the neighborhood so I guess you should just wait for him to return.

Whatever. He's going to have to come out of the neighborhood at some point. Kind of hard to trust somebody who's spending most of his time hiding behind a neighborhood QT.

I agree. I was scumreading Mastin at that time and I thought AP's reaction felt off which led me to think they might both be scum.

It's one of the great unsolved mysteries of this game. And their interactions with each other feel really weird for two players who supposedly are able to read each other really well.

What specifically? I had the opposite reaction to most of their posts.

It's hard to go back and point a lot of it out because it requires effort I'm not interested in putting into this game (and I don't remember a lot of Day 1). But to summarize, I greatly disliked Mastin's initial post against you for supposedly 'rage-posting.' It didn't look that way at all. I thought there was some merit to you trying to buddy up to Tammy. I also agreed with RBD about Bro's initial townread on AP being halfassed and bad. I also didn't like the lack of transparency from JSU early on and suddenly perking up when AP came around (apparently there was a neighborhood). I also shared the same sentiments about the Fox being skeevy for just pushing people and wondering why they weren't being townread by a lot of players early on when they haven't really contributed much up to that point. For the most part, I was reading Day 1 pretty loosely, skipping/skimming posts, and just picking sides and running with them.

Also, you were being scumread by at least one of them (while the other just backed up the attack), so there's completely different perspectives between us (with me having an outsider POV).

Also, can you please get those Notty walls in thread. I'd love to see where you guys are at.

His walls are largely just him marking down whenever somebody's read changes and making an opinion on it (as well as whatever thoughts he has about the slot). He hasn't done anything since the first 5 isos and I don't really know what he's been up to recently (probably having a life, chasing girls, trying not to fail classes, milking me for all I'm worth). I've just been on autopilot. And I've been handwaving his walls for now because my opinions on trajectories is that there's a lot more to read progression than just looking at where somebody's read changes and for me to go back and look at each trajectory would require me to reread Day 1, which is something I've been dreading for a while now.

I've also been basically summarizing his thoughts in my recent walls. And I think you just want the main points anyways.

Give me specifics on what you want details on. There's about 20 pages in there. I explained my read on BRO-Desp read in that wall. I am actually unsure about my read on Nacho-Bork and they haven't posted a lot in there. It is mostly me, BRO-Desp, and PieInFreezer.

It's hard to pinpoint specifics because I don't really know what to look for. But having three slots from that neighborhood not posting a whole lot outside of the neighborhood (or inside the neighborhood for Nacho's case) pretty much leaves me in the dark when I can't see what you guys are talking about. I think the biggest thing is just seeing reads and reasoning for now. Other than that I'm pretty much forced to read you and decide whether or not I want to trust your reads on them.

Also, you seemed to disagree with Mastin quite a bit in your wall. How does that affect your read on him?

I think I disagreed with him a lot mostly based on minor non-alignment indicative stuff. My main issues with him is the circlejerk he keeps doing with other players in the thread (especially AP) and I wouldn't be opposed to lynching him. As far as scumreading him goes, I'm not and I don't know what to look for.

-Nacho is town and I'll never support anything resembling a lynch on him

This needs to be explained.

-mastin has spent this entire game day calling AP scum but he keeps looking for excuses to get off the wagon or vote someone else. personally I think this points towards mastin x AP team, but it could also make sense as mastin scum not wanting to antagonize AP town

I agree with you that this could be a MastinxAP team. A weird one, but it could be.

I'd pay cash money for a vig shot on mastin right now just to stop all the fucking posts

Well, I'd love to help you out and take your cash money, but I'm not a vig and this lunatic over here thought I was for some reason.

I found two

-mastin has spent this entire game day calling AP scum but he keeps looking for excuses to get off the wagon or vote someone else. personally I think this points towards mastin x AP team, but it could also make sense as mastin scum not wanting to antagonize AP town
-mastin has literally ACKNLOWLEDGED she's been flooding the thread with bullshit and her response to that is? continue flooding the thread with bullshit. sounds legit

-Y

I'm pretty sure everyone who thinks Mastin is scum is right here with these points.

I think everyone is here with these two points regardless of what they're reading Mastin.

I made you paranoid when i said I thought you were my strongest town read didn't I? I figured it would.

Of all the people in this game, why is ffery your strongest townread?

He's not getting lynched today so it doesn't really matter right now anyway.

He's low priority but I wouldn't just handwave developing a read on him.

Pie said in the neighborhood that he was falling behind and would come back and push for more votes on Mastin if they stopped coming.

Day 2 is way slower and way less wall infested and headache inducing than Day 1 was (depending on whether or not you choose to read Mastin's walls). So how the hell is he falling behind?

Perhaps you can offer a word to CupcakePanda that if hydras aren't his thing, another player may be better suited for the position he currently occupies.

Why? I don't even know why he's complaining considering most of the hydrae are currently being dominated by one head.

I didn't like their push on me after claiming miller and later retraction

, the challenge to gladiate JSU, the response to Fox's Disney vote on them, and Nati's post to Tammy were wierd and the way he approached his read on her didn't make sense.

I remember the bolded part. It was unexpected and scummy but somebody called it trolling and made me unsure. The rest I'm quoting so I'll look at it again later.

Also gods I hated Peres interaction with ffery.

Why? Ffery's only scumread this game has been Mastin and she hasn't moved forward to push that with any conviction whatsoever to sort out the rest of her reads. It's been bugging me and PV pointing it out made me extremely happy. I also know what Ffery's like and my previous experience with her is the only thing holding me back.

but I do try to work with town reads.

Me too. At least until they try to defend what I'm killing because he thought he saw a pony fart out a rainbow.

No longer thinking he's scum, though.

Because...?

Kind of hard to take this at face value when your proposed scum-team includes me, Nacho, and AP together as a group.

Me? I dunno. Rancid? Because you threatened him.

A joke that happened to perfectly predict that I was a treestump.

Well, I don't know what to tell you. The votecount implied you were most likely a treestump and I associated an alignment with the color as a joke. How you even find this joke alignment indicative is beyond me.

My role's passive, not active.

Not something I would know. And even if you're telling the truth about your ability being passive, I wasn't the one who activated it.

Almost as

boring

as Brian's. Why do you spoiler your posts again?

Why don't you like Brian-posts? I thoughts they were

cool

.

They are kinda

cool

, yeah.

Just boring

This doesn't compute.

I spoiler my longer posts because scrolling through them later on is a hassle especially if people (namely me) aren't specifically looking for the content in my posts. I also tend to fill up a lot of my longer catch-up walls with useless filler content that I refuse to take out of my walls.

Also, contrary to whatever you think I'm here for, it's not to entertain you.

Also, you're reading my slot as town despite Notty and I expressing our everlasting desire to see you hang. I'm slightly amused. You also almost always townread me when you're scum (can't think of a time where you haven't) so I'm pretending I never saw it.

Also, his hesitance about BRO townreading me makes sense as well.

I was talking about PV. The neighborhood paranoia I have is a completely different beast altogether.

There are things that bother me about players, but nothing that I've gone aha that's scum!

What about my slot bothers you (aside from anything related to PV)?

GIFPie, DespBRO and Orcinus. Beli's actually more bet the farm about Orcinus than I was before we talked.

That's unexpected.

Really? The only one I find weird is DespBRO.

Do you think the nature of how the wagon formed says anything about Rancid's alignment?

I just think the wagon was a terrible fucking wagon. Who started that wagon anyways?

[AngryPidgeon]

On phone but: at brian: that sentence of mine is just poorly punctuated. I was responding to say I targeted Bork but I was also told it failed. "You. And I was told... " was the intent. I forgot the period. Not that sstaring sentences with and us good grammar.

[AngryPidgeon]

With "and" is* : |

[Titan]

I feel liek I'm goign to miss something, cuz holy shit is it late.

I don't feel terrible about your slot brian. You guys are probably town and are only probably town because notscience has dropped out. (I believe he's sick btw not just absent, but still.)

I talked about why I'm townreading ffery. I think it's involved my most extensive read thus far. I think it's the strongest because she seems to be viewing the game with a similar lens as I am. If you could get into my head and see how I feel about the game, it's something I think would be difficult for scum to "replicate". There are other lesser reasons involved in my town read, but what pushes it to strongest is that.

Oh the other thing i'll respond to is the pere thing with regards to ffery. I'll do that later. It's 5 and I need sleep.

[AngryPidgeon]

Why the he'll are you town reading them due to ns flaking over irl issues???????

[AngryPidgeon]

F16: ffery said nothing was happening at all. I corrected her by pointing out that mastin was quite clearly a thing that was happening. Cause I mean wow. How could anyone not see that as the centerpiece of today.

I agree nacho pposts look really town wrt. Tammy.

[Titan]

Why the he'll are you town reading them due to ns flaking over irl issues???????

I'm not?

I was already town reading their slot. NS flaking had me concerned about their slot HOWEVER I believe he's legitimately sick; therefore his flaking may not be alignment related meaning there's not a lot of reasoning for me to get concerned, just yet.

[Breakfast With Sandy]

F16: ffery said nothing was happening at all. I corrected her by pointing out that mastin was quite clearly a thing that was happening. Cause I mean wow. How could anyone not see that as the centerpiece of today.

I agree nacho pposts look really town wrt. Tammy.

You're right that Mastin is a thing that was happening. But it's mostly a Mastin generated thing, with votes here and there and then a Nacho-tunnel.

But the thing is kind of static. It's this big lump sitting in the thread.

And then there's this push on me, which resulted in what? 2 votes? And a lot of talk about how this isn't my town game mostly by people who have never played with scum me. But it seems odd to me that the noise and the votes didn't go further if mastin is scum. I'm hard to lynch when town, but not impossible.

CF raised saving-rancid as a reason for all the vote-craziness on Day 1. So what's going on here?

[PeregrineV]

AP: Your (Actual, no BS) investigate target in your next post with the result you got.

You and I was explicitly told that my role failed.

Pretty sure this is a heavy implication that both of you should be aware of your investigation result.

Pretty sure AP is not the world's biggest grammarian.

Read it as

You, and I was explicitly told that my role failed.

[Nachomamma8]

When Rancid-deadtown is a MASSIVE tactical advantage to this hypothetical scum-me, and a MASSIVE inconvenience to a hypothetical scum-me?

I agree you didn't kill him. I can see your team janitoring the flip if someone shot him since Rancid-scum's a massive inconvenience to you, and having the confidence that you can janitor the first one of you two's flip means that you're not afraid to buddy to shit like you did D1. But you're correct, you didn't kill him.

In contrast to me, who has at times been voted by literally every fucking player alive. No, seriously. Name a single player alive who at a point in the game has not voted me. I can't think of any.

I'm pretty sure our slot hasn't voted you and continues not to vote you.
But hey I could totally be wrong about that!

YOU ARE USING THINGS THAT I DID AFTER YOUR CHANGED READ TO JUSTIFY YOUR ORIGINAL CHANGE IN READ.

My current read on you is pretty much composed of your reaction to me scumreading you, how uncomfortable you are with me pushing you. My read before that? It wasn't strong. Townread started dying when everyone else seemed more town, and when you stopped hitting the notes you were hitting D1.

It might have been mentioned before that, too, and I brushed it off, since again, it wasn't from the source. It was essentially a second-hand talker, a talker who I knew would have biases, would have hesitancy in using exact wording from the QT, and thus, as a result, would not be conveying the accurate info. Or so I thought.

But you never thought to follow up on it? You brushed it off because you didn't think it was completely accurate because F-16 would lie about my suspicions in thread and I wouldn't publicly call him out and correct him for it? That doesn't seem like a very town-Nacho thing to do: in fact, that sounds like vintage scum Nacho!

BEYOND THAT. There's your stance on me. Your stance on me couldn't have been a scumread, because you fucking derailed the lynch on me, onto others. That's not something you do for someone who's so much as null; it has to be at least a townread. And then! Then there's the real kicker. Your neighbors have talked about your reads disagreeal with them. Overnight. They said that you were basically fighting their reads. Not coming to a consensus. You were the odd man out, of the neighborhood.

I did. I completely went to bat for you and alienated myself ENTIRELY from the neighborhood. Bork has built up a hell of a lot of towncred between them (aka no one even entertained the possibility of us being scum), and I burned it the fuck to the ground because there was no way in hell that I was going to let you get mislynched. I burned that cred during the day when I told BRO he was being an idiot and tried to flashwagon him, and I burned that cred to the ground when I continued arguing overnight (against bork's wishes) that you were town. You were a strong, strong townread and my play reflected that entirely. And now suddenly, I'm supposedly breaking cover against you and alienating myself from you after already burning my towncred from the neighborhood to the ground because apparently I hate having friends as scum. If I were scum in this situation, I would have protected you to the end: if you die, neighborhood's rep is shot and I'm ripping that town block apart with my bare hands. If you survive, I have you in my pocket for the long haul and one diehard calling me town is worth much more than 5 players calling me maybe town. I understand I've used this argument a lot in the past to great effect so it won't ring too true with too many people (or shouldn't, anyways), but your current requirements of me being scum are that I've completely lost my mind and know legitimately the only way to get myself lynched when I'm riding high on the highs of towncred banks. If you really were reanalyzing like you say you are (and all you've done is say you were and switch around a couple of reads: as town you show you're reanalyzing and prove it), you'd be able to see that obvious, obvious fact at least. But it's not convenient for you to bring up as scum, so you just happily ignore all motive for me changing my reads the way that I did as scum and instead cry "look, a contradiction!".

Yes you have. You've correctly read me in every damn game we've had, recently. Last time I can remember you being wrong? Was Mindreader Mafia. A fucking year ago. When I was specifically manipulating you through your role. That's literally it. Every game since then. From Walking Dead to Xeno. You've had me correctly read. Your read on me isn't instantaneously correct, like AP's and zMuffinman's are. But they ARE correct, eventually.

Chain of command.
Unless you forgot?

Rambles, thankyouverymuch, and they accomplished a very specific thing. They let you know exactly where my mind has come from, and also contained a readchange in the form of PV. Furthermore, I HAVE reached out, to just about everyone.

I haven't seen you reaching out to everyone.
I can see gigantic alienations in the form of your treatment of BRO's anxiety attack (aka are you fucking kidding me? That niggled like shit once BRO pointed it out, but I pushed that aside in favor of a larger townread), and your latest rant to ffery about tossing her diplomat hat down. I see a reachout in the form of you waffling on AP, but those aren't the kind of reachouts that I like. What else were you referring to?

...Well, I've never been this active at all. Last time I got even close?

I'm glad you found your scum stride again.
No scum game can flourish without the ability to post, and post a lot. I'm not so naive as to think that you don't know how to sit yourself down and post as scum, and I'm sure as hell not so naive as to think that you really think that you think posting a lot is a persuasive argument for you being anything other than slightly more likely to be town. I don't know why you would post so much this game. I don't know where you get your motivation, I don't care where you get your motivation.

This isn't your town game. I know that, whether you make 5 more posts or 500.

[PeregrineV]

So we didn't play heroes of comedy together?
marketplace 2?
hpatpl?
marketplace 3?
board games?
gundam seed?
holy shit if you remember me from anything goes and have anything approximating a scum read on me here you really really really don't know how to meta at all and should stop?

I mean because then you should at least understand my playstyle varies and not be just comparing it to some two-year old game.

marketplace 2 I already noticed a difference that threw me off: 1832 1909 2661-

" I think part of my issue with pere is kind of self absorbed as I can't see why he'd have me as null with the need to do further meta research when we've played a few games together and he's seen me as scum and town. I don't think I've been overly active this game and shining brightly like a beacon of innocence though but it still kinda reads off."

At this point you were picking up the whole "How someone reads me determines how I read them" thing.
But we worked through it.

HPATPL- You were SK. But even after you admitted it, I could see your town mindset scumhunting (you shot scum). That was one reason I was OK with leashing you. 1639

Marketplace 3 You were a hydra.

Board Games- You were a hydra

Gundam Seed (hydra) 370

I'm a hydra now.

Marketplace 3 - 95% of those posts are mine. (You can tell which posts aren't mine as syryana is telling me to shut up and meta someone like we had discussed >_>)

Gundam seed - 99.5% of those posts are mine.

Board games - pless posted more than I did, but that should tell you something. Games going on at the same time, my overall approach is similar, except I'm actually more engaged here than I was there.

What this collection of games whether hydra or solo should tell you is that you can't meta mr off one game, and sure as he'll not off one game from two years ago. And if you're going to look at a town game you sure as shit need to look at a scum game. You've seen two: team mafia and anything goes. Wait three weren't you in heterosexual revolution?

What all of the games you have participated in should tell you is that you actually have to look at a large freaking sample size with me unless you are a really gifted meta reader who picks up tonal differences really well. I'm an emotional person, I'm an emotional player, that means that my mood impacts my posting more than anything else. Not only my away from mafia game mood, but the mood of the game as well. It also impacts how I read the game and how I read others. I don't have one specific playstyle or one specific scumhunting method or one specific anything.

People with small sample sizes almost always pick up on incorrect things. For instance, in mafia.maiden a couple years ago magua thought I was scum based on my reaction to suspicion. I got very frustrated and flustered, which regfan who knows me recognized as town. But magua had recently played in ny146 where I had replaced into a slot widely regarded as the sk and was up for a lynch. I took that suspicion really calmly and worked to get information out there as I knew it wasn't my fault I was going to be lynched. I ended up not and was able to win it for town in lylo. (Incidentally, I've always wished I could be that person under suspicion.). But what to read me by was misunderstood.

Likewise, you could look at two recent games of mine.

im proud as fuck at this game

And

not as proud of this game

Both town wins. I replaced into both at the same time. The first game I felt like I was really on top of my game. A couple original reads were off but those were corrected for, and once falcon replaced in we figured out the game together really well. It was a solid solid game. The other game? Felt meh. Had a bad scum read but fixed it. Knew something was off with nacho but the game just felt off overall.

So both games at the same stage of my life. I was just as busy, in the same rl mood for both, but in one I excelled and one I languished. In both I was able to look town, which is over and above my best attribute. It's the thing I know how to do best and most consistently.

So, meta me, sure, but not as simplistically as you've done because you won't get anywhere, but irritate me.

I use meta better if I was actually in the game.

(I think I replaced into the hetero revolution one if that was the lovers game)

And overall, I prefer similar game types to similar game types.

I'll leave the mood thing alone, since I think my opinion on that would be in the minority. Suffice to say if I'm in a cat-kicking mood, there is no reason for me to come online and kick your virtual cat. That would just be pointless when I have a perfectly good cat to kick here.

[PeregrineV]

@Nacho

- Good morning!! Actually reading and responding to Mastin? You are a better man than I for that.

Oh, and also,

@Nacho-

Would like to see a summary of your current reads along with a brief reason for each.

Also, thoughts on the neighborhood you are in.

[Nachomamma8]

I said it way, waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay back in GvE, CvL, that

I couldn't win the fight against you with you-as-scum and me-as-town.

It's still just as true now as it was back then. I am not as charismatic. This is not a fight I enter with any chance at all of winning. Obvtown be damned! Yes, I'm fucking obviously town. Anyone reading my goddamned posting without confirmation bias, without emotional attachment, and putting so much as an iota of effort into reading my fucking mindset would be able to figure that out. Doesn't mean I'm going to win. Yes, I should. No, I won't.

This was bullshit then, and this is bullshit now. The longstanding conditions that surround most of my interactions with players that I can read go as follows: they won't win against me when I am town and they are scum. I won't win against them as scum if I break cover on them. I only break cover when I'm absolutely 100% sure that I'm going to get that mislynch and I'm 100% if I fail that we will win if we fall anyways. Ask fucking notscience when he comes back: in Wicked, I broke cover when the game was won. I called mollie when we reached that LyLo to tell her the game was won because I knew there was legitimately no way we could lose. Did I break cover before then? Nope, called him town LEGITIMATELY THE ENTIRE GAME LIKE A GOOD SCUM. I played around him because 1v1 exchanges are horrible for scum early game. You are not as charismatic as I am. But you know the feeling of being stabbed in the back and you express that shit as well as anyone else but you're damn right when I'm stabbed in the back and I know I'm being stabbed in the back there's no fucking way I'm going to lose.

[Nachomamma8]

Because while I don't know what exactly sparked the reveal, something did. And I'm willing to bet it's that I hit something that the scumteam desperately was hoping I wouldn't hit on.

You sound like DGB.
If you hit the scumteam perfectly minus me, do you know what I would do? I would shut the fuck up and bus a buddy, then I would kill you during the night. Or, I would shut the fuck up and let you get mislynched because that's exactly where the day was going. The "oh i bet I said something REALLY on point and you panicked" is so far gone from everything that you ever learned about me, and I really wish that someone that wasn't me could see that.

[Nachomamma8]

@Nacho- Good morning!! Actually reading and responding to Mastin? You are a better man than I for that.

give me a moment. i will give a full list of general reads (a catchup post even!), once i'm done catching up.
but i need to do this for right now.

[Nachomamma8]

Anyone reading my goddamned posting without confirmation bias, without emotional attachment, and putting so much as an iota of effort into reading my fucking mindset would be able to figure that out. Doesn't mean I'm going to win. Yes, I should. No, I won't.

Hey Tammy!
Could you ask SAD if he thinks mastin is town?

[PeregrineV]

@Nacho- Good morning!! Actually reading and responding to Mastin? You are a better man than I for that.

give me a moment. i will give a full list of general reads (a catchup post even!), once i'm done catching up.
but i need to do this for right now.

k, thx

[Nachomamma8]

A scum-me would never even so much as attempt to risk it. A scuMastin if faced with a Nacho scumread? Will do everything in her power to switch that around. Plead. Beg. Reason. Misdirect. Use logic. Try to shake it. Push it elsewhere. NAME A SINGLE FUCKING SCUMGAME OF MINE WHERE I DIDN'T DO THIS. Can't? There's a goddamned reason for that; it's because that's how I act as scum and you damn-well KNOW it is

Do you want me to quote pleading, begging, reason, logic for you trying to get out of this read? Just because you haven't dropped the scumread on me doesn't mean you're not flailing all over the fucking place: do you think you can suddenly switch back and try buddying me now that I'm as against you as I currently am? No. Fuck no.

[Nachomamma8]

THE EGO CHECKS.
ARE RIGHT FUCKING THERE.
IN MY FUCKING POSTING.

Where?
Could there be an ego check... here?

My scumgame this year (for the most part) has been top-notch. I've masterfully manipulated players. I've had plans. I've beautifully orchestrated the downfalls of towns, in ways that they would never expect, even if they expect me to be scum. It may sound arrogant, but bluntly, I've felt as if my scumgame has taken such leaps and bounds this year to be frankly at scummy-level performances. Because I come up with plans, dang-good plans, and execute them near-flawlessly. And they are all driven by the singular desire of manipulating circumstances to be favorable for my scum faction.

...nope.