In post 412, Irrelephant11 wrote:Bernie is getting harder to read so even though I want to keep him in my townreads it’s hard.
I didn't feel this way at all based on Bernie's posting a few posts before yours. He's being vague about his TheWorst read because he didn't seem to want to out his alt at that point but none of it comes across as disingenuous and I didn't feel like he was being vague because he wanted to conceal a lack of good reasons for his reads.
In post 413, Momrangal wrote:All of his early posts reek of eagerness to look like he's doing something productive and meaningful while doing absolutely jackall.
He's sitting there looking pretty, playing it safe, and it looks like hes engaging with people but the questions are empty.
I'm not seeing how you got that from
39. It looks like he was clarifying whether Shoshin's scumread on Math was RVS or not.
In post 414, Keyser Söze wrote:@Shoshin - now’s the time to share that irrefutable meta evidence for town-invisibility. momrangel actually came back with a bang.
I don't think her post was particularly good. Admittedly, it's better than her previous posts but "came back with a bang" feels like an exaggeration for a pretty banal post. I also want to note that I see a lot of hanging back and letting other people push each other from you. For example, complimenting Momrangal for the Invisibility push and then asking Shoshin for her Invisibility meta-read. Do you think it's pro-town to get other people to argue with each other? Would you say this is how you normally play (I'm going to check but I'd like your opinion as well)? Also, Shoshin already elaborated on her Invisibility townread. I want to know why you aren't taking a stance here with your own opinions.
In post 421, Irrelephant11 wrote:
This feels like a weird turn from “momrangel came back with a bang” (the post implies a town Mom and a push on Shoshin) to now, where you’re kinda asking town Shoshin to scumread Mom?
This is a fair point actually. He's basically been encouraging other people to respond to each other's arguments but not much in the way of inserting his own opinions in there very strongly. I'll come back to this when I figure out whether this is normal for him. It's like everytime someone makes a point at someone else, he turns around and asks the other person how they respond, almost as if he's moderating a debate.
Can you elaborate on "performative?"
In post 432, Keyser Söze wrote:I wanted to sit back and watch Shoshin and Momrangel to play out the inner conflict in my head I have over Invisibility.
I like the transparency here. This confirms what I was thinking about Keyser but I don't think scum would be blatant about the fact that they are in fact sitting back.
@Keyser - can you describe how you normally play as scum?
I'm not following what you're trying to say here. Is replacing out as scum a blacklist-worthy offence? People replace out when they don't have time to play. Alignment should never be a factor.
In post 473, Irrelephant11 wrote:shoshin/math and shoshin/stun really didn't look like early s/s and stun and dino both seemed independently towny
and then I was sorta light-scumreading all three of the second list and there was nothing to indicate they had different alignments
Your second list was Keser/Stungun/Skitter. Were you townreading or scumreading Stungun?
In post 494, Irrelephant11 wrote:Like what if you're buddying me and really good at it
Oh well. It's honestly fine for now if it's true
Consider me buddied, we're buddies now. Buddied up from now till lylo see you then <3
I really don't like this post because it feels like you want to present yourself as a townie that's being buddied by Shoshin. If you're townreading her but have mild paranoia, you could probably just say that. If you're actually scumreading her, you'd be pushing her. But there's this weird read where you're basically calling her scum that's buddying you but who you won't push until LYLO. It looks more like that's the image you want to present to the game as opposed to it being a genuine read. So, that mid to late game if Shoshin is alive/comes under suspicion, you can come back to this and say "oh, yeah I got buddying vibes from Shoshin" and use that as a reason to push her then.
In post 562, Shoshin wrote:what I found is that her play here is consitent with her play in town games and actually slightly different from her play in scum games.
Can you give me a short overview of the differences you found in Momrangal's town and scum games.
I like Nauci's re-entrance in
656. But the rest of the catchup is somewhat null. I don't see much that strikes me either way. I'm still mulling over what Nauci's suspicions of Irrelephant means for both of their alignments. Haven't ruled out any combination yet.
In post 666, Nauci wrote:My rule of thumb that I absolutely don't vouch for is that, when heavily pressured, scum!tw becomes exponentially more dodgy/bullshitter, and slightly more serious as town. (based on one game w/ him and skimming a couple of others)
Why reveal this before you have a chance to see what he's like under pressure? Even if he's not pressured immediately, there's a chance he would be at some point. Edit: Just read
675 where you call it a placebo effect. Why can't he act serious if he's scum and gets pressured if he knows that's what you're expecting?
In post 671, Nauci wrote:578,
583 I post this kind of crap when I'm unmotivated scum so it's hard not to read it this way
Would you mind linking me to places where you've said this as scum.
In post 674, Nauci wrote:I generally gives 0 fucks about how I'm perceived in the game. If I am challenged on a specific thing or if someone has misinterpreted something I said, I'll address that. Otherwise, I just endeavor to town harder.
This pinged. This is a game of perceptions and to do well as town, you need to read people correctly and be read correctly. "I give zero fucks about how I'm perceived" feels like bravado/putting up a front. The most content you've written about anyone in your readslist is yourself (tied with Irrelephant) which is also odd for someone who doesn't care about how they are perceived.
I actually don't like anything you've written under the heading of yourself. Why give bullet-points when you don't like self-meta?
In post 674, Nauci wrote:I'm extremely capable of separating someone's read of me with my evaluation of the circumstances of how they read me as if it was any other player and their content.
What's the point of saying this?
In post 674, Nauci wrote:I will get exhaustibly pedantic to correct a misconception so try not to make any or I will be here arguing w/ you on it for 9 pages.
It's well within your control to not argue with people for 9 pages if you don't think it's alignment-indicative so I don't see the point of this either. Obviously if do think it's alignment-indicative, then it's a good lead and not just being pedantic.
How do you reconcile your stance of not sheeping with using TheWorst's vouch of Bernie as part of your reason to townread Bernie?
As for Nauci's actual readslist, I don't disagree with any of her townreads. I'm not so confident in Keyser being town but I'm leaning town. I think Stungun, Skitter, Bernie, and Shoshin are town. I know Math and Gamma are town. If she's scum, she's got a list where both her buddies would be in the bottom five reads and I think it's a less likely approach as scum than having at least one partner higher up in their reads. So, that gives me townvibes from Nauci. Overall, I'm pretty conflicted.
In post 687, Keyser Söze wrote:It this a bus, or is it opportunism? Funnily enough, this late push on TW followed TW's famous "Bernie Sanders remains probably my strongest townread" line Makes me want to re-look at TW's read of you too.
Bernie pushing TheWorst when TheWorst was townreading him so hard makes Bernie less likely to be scum. I think the scenario where the TheWorst is scum and buddying Bernie and Bernie not buying it is the most probable one. I don't know why you jumped to them being scum together as the most likely conclusion. One scum hard-townreading and vouching for another and the other voting them is actually a pretty unlikely interaction.
699 is a pretty underwhelming catchup by Invisibility with a few rehashed points.
Nauci's Irrelephant push in
702 and
704 felt genuine. The more I think about it, I actually don't think that after a great game as scum together, Nauci's strategy in the next game she plays with Irrelephant is to keep pushing for his mislynch on the basis of his good scumplay at least this early in the game (in the Nauci-scum, Irrelephant-town scenario). I suppose she could but I'd expect it more in the form of "why is he still alive" a few day phases from now as opposed to this paranoia push which is much less likely to gain traction.
@TheWorst, you never answered which posts of Gemini's you mindmelded on. I also want to know what alignment you prefer to play.
That's to the end of page 30. Catchup is going slower than expected but I'm still hoping I'll be caught up by tonight. We shall see. Feel free to engage my posting. I feel like I have a bit more solid take on the game now. My focus from POE is mostly on Irrelephant, Momrangal, TheWorst, and Northsidegal's slot (but I haven't read any of the replacement's posts yet). I'll do an actual readslist when I'm caught up.
![:]](./images/smilies/icon_smiling.png "Cheerful Smile"){kind=icon}