Large normal 236 [Game over]

[Rannygazoo]

@The last few pages

[Rannygazoo]

VOTE: Andres
This feels right

Also I was recently called a nerd so the opposite is soothing ty

This is just gambler’s fallacy affecting your worldview. You should abandon it now.

Gambler's fallacy cuts both ways. It's either "this one is lucky so I should keep betting on it" or "this one is unlucky so its time should come soon". But anyway, this feels too defensive for such a vague vote.

Soaring into the game from the clouds, then crashes into a wall

..ow

...Anyway, hello everyone! I am Loftwing, your local neighborhood skylofty bird. I am here to pass judgement onto one of you.

VOTE: Hakai

Spiderman wouldn't have crashed into a wall there.

Random vote or do you see what I see?

This defense seems weakly town.

I kinda disagree. I think it's NAI. Can you explain how it's Townie?

Like LQ as town.

I don't want to lose to scum!Titus laying low and throwing out vague statements like this.

VOTE: Andresvmb

Good vote, tho

VOTE: LicketyQuickety

I had to do this. The name is just asking for a vote.

In other words, you're just happy to see me?

Your avatar is amazing. I’m definitely going to UNVOTE: .

Are you playing intentionally or not?

I'm going to go against the grain and label andres as town for now - something about their postings feels townie to me right now and I can ellaborate on it later once I get sufficient reaction from the low explaination read first.

If Koba every makes a true claim or gives a true read this early, it is sheer coincidence.

norway, is your case on Andre srs?

Yes.
I’ve already solved 1/4th of the game.
Go vote him.

How do you know there are 4 scum? *eyes narrow, grips katana and tips fedora*

6 dunnos. 3 did they post. 3 things that are functionally nothing (like "want to see more" or "on the fence") and okay one of them is yourself so that's 11 but still

@Dwlee @LQ I literally cannot read your posts. My eyes roll off this nonsense like water off wax paper.

[Rannygazoo]

How do you know there are 4 scum? *eyes narrow, grips katana and tips fedora*

how are ppl this dumb?

No u

[Rannygazoo]

VOTE: Almost50

[Rannygazoo]

Given subsequent conversation, it’s blatantly obvious what I meant there.

Was it? Ok.

Saying that it can cut both ways is just fluff.

Yes.

And it’s not too defensive if it’s correct.

...That ain't it. That's like saying town should always be as defensive of themselves as possible because they're correct. That's not how it works.

DW said as much.

Who? Dwlee? I've already said that I can't read their posts.

[Rannygazoo]

VOTE: Almost50

why?

Mainly I wanted to see how Almost50 would genuflect. I also kind of feel that generic questions like asking for a reads list is just trying to look busy.

[Rannygazoo]

I would vote Andres but there hasn't been a vote count and I don't want to run the vote up too high yet.

[Rannygazoo]

Are you playing intentionally or not?

How does one play unintentionally?

Someone pointed out earlier that you randomly go back and forth between being serious and being silly. (Can't be bothered to go back and find the source.)

[Rannygazoo]

...That ain't it. That's like saying town should always be as defensive of themselves as possible because they're correct. That's not how it works.

You’re not understanding what I’m saying. DW voted me and said that they felt it was right. I guessed (correctly) that they were saying that it felt right because it’s been repeated multiple times in games we’ve played together that I’ve been nothing but Town. DW confirmed that was the case. I wasn’t too defensive - I correctly understood the motivation behind the vote, and told DW not to fall for a basic logical fallacy.

I wasn’t saying that I was correct because I’m Town so any logic for SR’ing me will always be wrong. There’s no point in even making that statement it’s so obvious.

@Dwlee is this really what happened?

[Rannygazoo]

P much

[Rannygazoo]

How often are 16-player games multiball?

[Rannygazoo]

Nero is clearly "playing unintentionally", as I would put it and Andres would be pedantic about it.

[Rannygazoo]

It doesn't stick out to me any more than dance videos or cringeposting. It feels like some players are still in RVS, and Nero is one of them.

What makes the post so special to you?

[Rannygazoo]

oh yeah i lied about townreading andres i wanted to just see reactions to it lmao

Called it

[Rannygazoo]

@Nero: No pressure and ni rush, but I'd appreciate it if you could give a "mini readlist" on the most active slot (i.e. LQ, Andres, Norwee, Dwlee, Granpa, DkK). Again NO RUSH. Thanks is advance

scum
null
town
town
null

scum
null
town
town
null

Ahem.. these are 5 reads.. on 6 slots..

Which one did you miss?

grandpa

How has this player not moved away from RVS already?

To be tbh I did not see the context for 282. I thought Nero was just throwing out words to take up space.

[Rannygazoo]

@Hakai post something that isn't a wall.

[Rannygazoo]

@granpamo @ranny pls unvote a50 they are town(and so are you 2)

Hard to say no to a request like that so I’ll look harder for others to vote, but I don’t like A50s constant wink wink nudge nudge

Gotta rate your vibe because I haven't seen anything AI yet and my instinct is to SR that. Usually you'll sprinkle something useful or at least insightful in.

Seriously??

FoS Kyouko. You should know why already (and so should Nero, Wake, Titus & Andres)

If there’s something that we’re supposed to know, go ahead and say it. Keeping your reads to yourself is one thing, but signaling like this is another.

[Rannygazoo]

VOTE: Margot

What is this? Is this where you think we should go day 1?

[Rannygazoo]

Andres, I’ve read through and seen you complain about weak votes from Norwee and Titus, and people reading your meta wrong. Would it be fair to say you’ve been caught for the wrong reasons?

[Rannygazoo]

It is hard to keep track of this many players this early.

That’s why I think everyone making a reads list is weird.

[Rannygazoo]

I don't like that we're voting someone who hasn't even played yet. If they don't post at all they'll get prodded or replaced. I feel that it's really cheap, and despite having voted no-shows in the past I now think it's not really optimal Townplay any more. Dwlee, I don't think you should be voting a no-show, unless it's just to get the person to get active if lurking.

I agree with this, and it think it’s weird that it took so long for someone to say it.

As for Rannygazoo, I feel like his response is maaybe a little *too* normal. Something about it just irked my gut, just a bit.

Bro, this is me not really having time for nuance right now. I wanted to find the motivation for the vote without coloring DW’s response with my opinion.

Koba, I'm not sure I understand your thought process about his shift in play having a Town though process/reason for going there. It's just my opinion, but I don't think votes on no-shows are good unless just to pressure.

Koba is a very intuitive player. No use trying to figure them out. I do think they’re town here, though.

And after re-reading this right as I'm typing I probably should have asked Dwlee first if his vote on Margot was serious or temporary.

Isn’t this what I did?

[Rannygazoo]

Going to put my money where my mouth is. Voting an inactive slot when you could be gaining information from active players is a coward’s move. VOTE: dwlee

Also, I sorely overestimated how much time I’ll have for this game right now.

@mods V/LA until Monday

[Rannygazoo]

You’re both handsome young lads?

[Rannygazoo]

Can we stop this shitty wagon on town!Dwlee and many sus slots defending scum!SSBM for dumb reasons.

I do not vibe with this. I don’t think Norwee has enough towncred to make demands like this.

But prove me wrong. Why should we wagon Kyo, aside from Koba’s intuition for meta? I can’t read her by myself since all she’s done is talk about catching up, followed by a whole lot of not catching up. I just don’t like to vote based on someone else’s vibes unless I have nothing better to go on.

[Rannygazoo]

I think you’re confusing “loud” with “town”

[Rannygazoo]

If the rest of the town aren't good enough to catch scum by their tone and need more hard proof then the only other alternative is to prove why the other slots on the table are townier than the slot in question. This is especially useful, given that SSB is not currently present in the game.

Yes, this is good. So is Koba’s advice of making a town block.

But Dwlee? Help me see it.

[Rannygazoo]

That vote feels like forever ago. I could see scum doing something like that, even not newb scum, if it’s not strategic to vote an active wagon or a slot that will push back.

This is my first game with Dwlee, but I don’t see their every post as playing 420D chess the same way you do. How do you provoke a reaction from a slot that’s completely absent? Even if Margot eventually sees it, she will know that the vote means nothing.

[Rannygazoo]

Absolutely nothing, as far as I can tell. I’m still on V/LA and ISO diving is inconvenient on mobile. But Kyo is on V/LA too. I want to see that end and have it be a little closer to end of day before I come to a conclusion. The louder players don’t want to do that, and I don’t take it as AI because maybe it’s just their personality. But I’m in no rush.

I could see an argument for voting Kyo over Dwlee because Dwlee is more active and will be easier to catch down the line. But that’s not really a fair comparison when one is on V/LA, right?

Dwlee may post a lot but— and maybe it’s just because I’m not used to them— they don’t seem to say much.

[Rannygazoo]

These are all conjunctions and whati-ifs from Loftwing and Ranny.

Sure it is possible that Dwlee is scum here. But by probablity it is an much lower chance than the mafia being someone else.
So yes, Dwlee could in theory have masterfully town!told as scum and is fooling us. But the possibility of that is much lower than the much more higher probability of scum being in the much more scummy slots.
Which is why it is the correct play to call out this Dwlee wagon as bad and lead us to an lim that is much better for town and that i believe flips scum.

Lol@ someone having to be masterful in order to fool you

[Rannygazoo]

If me and Koba are both town we're an very high threat to the scum team just saying Loftwing, so if you're town here you'd be better off just assuming we're town until one of us inevitably get's NK'ed or we eliminate scum back to back.

You sure are eager to get pocketed by Koba.

[Rannygazoo]

Maybe I’m using pocketed wrong. I meant that Norwee seems to especially want Koba’s trust.

[Rannygazoo]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

@Norwee I’m saying I don’t townread you like I’m being told to.

[Rannygazoo]

You've now said three different things.

Take 888 and 893 to be the ones I mean, since I don’t know what “pocketed” means.

[Rannygazoo]

I was using it to mean “trusting without thinking too hard about it” but I’m still confused about which direction is which.

[Rannygazoo]

The loftwing wagon is trash tbh. He’s just raising some valid points about the dangers of having one or two players run the game.

[Rannygazoo]

How sustainable do you think it is for theoretical scum!Kooba to take charge and lead us through mislims in a large, without getting any suspicion for it?
They’d get 2 mislims max before getting vigged/copped or just eliminated.
It’s not what scum does. Loftwings points is, and will continue to be garbage. Now it is perfectly possible that Loftwing is town and genuinely believes what he is saying, but his points are absolutely not valid.

M8 what are you even trying to say? Scum can’t be active? It’s sustainable for as long as it works. If a scum slot is suspicious for not getting nightkilled, a buddy can just claim doctor. I don’t like how you’re acting like the POV you’re pushing is the only valid POV.

[Rannygazoo]

@Koba and @Nowree once we put this behind us, what is next on the agenda? Elim SSB immediately or wait for their V/LA to end?

[Rannygazoo]

Andres, I’ve read through and seen you complain about weak votes from Norwee and Titus, and people reading your meta wrong.

Would it be fair to say you’ve been caught for the wrong reasons?

This looks weird to me, anyon eplayed with Ranny before? It feels like the classic "fairish" scumtell, also the words dont seem to match the intent.

Like what is expected here Ranny? What do you expect Andre's to say and what do you get from that? This feels snipish.

We have pages of discussion about you and this is one of the few things you want to focus on? I’ve been trying to stay prudent and keep the game level-headed and this makes me feel like I was wrong to do so. Smdh my head.

VOTE: SSB

[Rannygazoo]

To answer the question, I don’t know what “fairish” means but it was a cheap shot at Andres to provoke a reaction. All it got in response was sarcasm so I don’t know what to make of that. Could be scum hiding behind irony.

[Rannygazoo]

No, I think I get what you’re saying. She’s cherry-picking and not addressing what town needs to address.

[Rannygazoo]

I think I’ve been in a large before. I don’t remember it moving so fast. Jfc

[Rannygazoo]

gut says probably not kyouko today. could consider LicketyQuickety though. it would be more informative for me partly because of the player's clear posting style. and that defence stuff about 'I can't be scum here because I'd never post a half-complete readslist as scum' was a bit sus. had a bit of "mafia caught for the wrong reasons" vibe to it

I'll UNVOTE: for now anyway, seems like things are getting a bit fiesty

Andres, I’ve read through and seen you complain about weak votes from Norwee and Titus, and people reading your meta wrong.

Would it be fair to say you’ve been caught for the wrong reasons?

This looks weird to me, anyon eplayed with Ranny before? It feels like the classic "fairish" scumtell, also the words dont seem to match the intent.

Like what is expected here Ranny? What do you expect Andre's to say and what do you get from that? This feels snipish.

agree that is a bit odd from Ranny

What is this trash

[Rannygazoo]

im mostly wary of those following dkkoba reads, as it's a very easy way to stay out of the limelight. Dwlee99 is of interest, not only for that reason, but to look at later.

Do you think Koba is town and scum are sheeping, or do you think Koba is scum trying to strongarm the game?

[Rannygazoo]

I don’t think Norwee is the move today.

[Rannygazoo]

A whole lot of shouting

[Rannygazoo]

On the contrary, if we had ended the day so early, I would have taken it much more seriously that y’all might be scum trying to strongarm the game, regardless of the flip.

[Rannygazoo]

Let’s give people a change to post instead of chasing an axe and then going into day 2 not knowing who half the players are.

[Rannygazoo]

Like, I feel like loftwing has been saying that pressure and building a case good, rushing an elimination bad. It seems like you’re not getting it or not going to agree.

[Rannygazoo]

How do you have the third most posts in the game when you’ve never said anything

[Rannygazoo]

It is hard to keep track of this many players this early.

That’s why I think everyone making a reads list is weird.

idk if u have played in a large before but a good strategy is to try to mainly just try to find people you can feel comfortable as town, or at least not voting out day 1 and then go from there.

I tried this and I can’t. Most everyone is a suspect.

I’m not scumreading you but I wish you wouldn’t lie about being mason.

[Rannygazoo]

maybe Rannygazoo is not all bad - i like some of the earlier stuff. but some hint of knowing more than he should, and an interesting evolution in thoughts overall. basically rannygazoo begins with a bit of stand-offishness towards the claimed masons, then rueful at 2 potential town loudplayers on the same page, and finally capitulates and sheeps with no diguise. some other points i noted...

Spoiler:

Can we stop this shitty wagon on town!Dwlee and many sus slots defending scum!SSBM for dumb reasons.

I do not vibe with this. I don’t think Norwee has enough towncred to make demands like this.

But prove me wrong. Why should we wagon Kyo, aside from Koba’s intuition for meta? I can’t read her by myself since all she’s done is talk about catching up, followed by a whole lot of not catching up. I just don’t like to vote based on someone else’s vibes unless I have nothing better to go on.

the cynic in me wonders if this is asking for a case to piggyback on, given where we end up...

the walkback on SSB:

@Koba and @Nowree once we put this behind us, what is next on the agenda? Elim SSB immediately or wait for their V/LA to end?

Andres, I’ve read through and seen you complain about weak votes from Norwee and Titus, and people reading your meta wrong.

Would it be fair to say you’ve been caught for the wrong reasons?

This looks weird to me, anyon eplayed with Ranny before? It feels like the classic "fairish" scumtell, also the words dont seem to match the intent.

Like what is expected here Ranny? What do you expect Andre's to say and what do you get from that? This feels snipish.

We have pages of discussion about you and this is one of the few things you want to focus on? I’ve been trying to stay prudent and keep the game level-headed and this makes me feel like I was wrong to do so. Smdh my head.

VOTE: SSB

im mostly wary of those following dkkoba reads, as it's a very easy way to stay out of the limelight. Dwlee99 is of interest, not only for that reason, but to look at later.

Do you think Koba is town and scum are sheeping, or do you think Koba is scum trying to strongarm the game?

this is a red flag - it was very clear i think that i was implying the former, so setting up the latter may be a bit of misrep/distancing from the truth.

I don’t think Norwee is the move today.

On the contrary, if we had ended the day so early, I would have taken it much more seriously that y’all might be scum trying to strongarm the game, regardless of the flip.

still on the strongarming. maybe TMI.

My dude why are you obsessed with me

[Rannygazoo]

im mostly wary of those following dkkoba reads, as it's a very easy way to stay out of the limelight. Dwlee99 is of interest, not only for that reason, but to look at later.

Do you think Koba is town and scum are sheeping, or do you think Koba is scum trying to strongarm the game?

this is a red flag - it was very clear i think that i was implying the former, so setting up the latter may be a bit of misrep/distancing from the truth.

I will address this point -- I straight up do not remember why I asked this. I thought I was going to expose something about your motivations, but looking at it now, it's an obvious question.

However, your weird combination of wishy-washyness and tunneling feels unnatural, and unnatural feel scummy. I wouldn't mind eliminating you now, but I don't want you to be my vanity wagon.

@titus join forces?

[Rannygazoo]

VOTE: cool cookie

;_;7

[Rannygazoo]

gut says probably not kyouko today. could consider LicketyQuickety though. it would be more informative for me partly because of the player's clear posting style. and that defence stuff about 'I can't be scum here because I'd never post a half-complete readslist as scum' was a bit sus. had a bit of "mafia caught for the wrong reasons" vibe to it

Followed by:

Andres, I’ve read through and seen you complain about weak votes from Norwee and Titus, and people reading your meta wrong.

Would it be fair to say you’ve been caught for the wrong reasons?

This looks weird to me, anyon eplayed with Ranny before? It feels like the classic "fairish" scumtell, also the words dont seem to match the intent.

Like what is expected here Ranny? What do you expect Andre's to say and what do you get from that? This feels snipish.

agree that is a bit odd from Ranny.

You use the "caught for the wrong reasons" line and THEN you say it's odd coming from me, when I said it first. This is fake.

I don’t think Norwee is the move today.

We could always eliminate me.

Hey Nero! I THINK YOU'RE SCUM!

interested in these reactions immediately following NorwegianboyEE getting a bit of pressure, maybe top 2 biggest wagons. it would be an infortmative elim if it happened...time to put my vote to use...

VOTE: NorwegianboyEE

This vote was bad, and so was your loftwing vote. Followed by unvotes within the hour. What are you up to? Trying different wagons to see what sticks?

maybe Rannygazoo is not all bad - i like some of the earlier stuff. but some hint of knowing more than he should, and an interesting evolution in thoughts overall. basically rannygazoo begins with a bit of stand-offishness towards the claimed masons, then rueful at 2 potential town loudplayers on the same page, and finally capitulates and sheeps with no diguise. some other points i noted...

I feel like I'm not a main character today and I'm too busy to be very active. Why are you giving me outsized importance? Don't get me wrong, you are allowed to. I even think it's good that someone is considering me critically. I just don't understand why it's coming from you.

[Rannygazoo]

Apologies for flaking

You've got to do what's right for you. I hope you find peace.

[Rannygazoo]

Do I need to post for the sake of posting despite not having any updated reads at this time?

Someone please ask me something about someone so I can post something that may count as "game related

If you had to pick one player to sheep the whole game, who would you pick?

[Rannygazoo]

on my voting, I think I only made 2 votes so far, and neither of them stuck for long, so hard to say I really gave anything a chance to stick? you say my votes were bad, but you dont say why. I think both were fine tbh, maybe you are just not relaxed with somebody using their vote as a tool to learn more information. sometimes voting to see how people react is a good way to learn. also having conversations with real substance and detail

Oh no, I'm totally relaxed with it. So what did your votes accomplish? What did you learn?

Pressure votes don't work if there's no threat behind them. There's no threat because we're in the middle of day 1 of a large. It looks like you were trying to make a counterwagon to scum!kyouko. You haven't updated your read on kyouko since your 19th post 1297. I mean, if kyouko flips town today, I will crown you the Due Diligence Fae, but I don't think trying to stir up new wagons for no reason is necessarily good town play. You've been putting the vote before the reason. Wtf do you expect from get from voting titus at this point in the game?

that is exactly why i think it's important to look at you, and others in that camp. you are no less important than anybody else - you have an equal chance of being mafia as everybody else. If a town just gave you a free pass because you were quiet, would that be good? seems to be a bad precedent to set. but really, like most of my comments it was just prompted by a comment which stuck out to me, and then I did some more research on you. but I think my assessment was fair and your reaction was overly defensive.

If I seem defensive, it's because you're making things up.

but some hint of knowing more than he should, and an interesting evolution in thoughts overall

You didn't back this up. What did I know that I shouldn't? What was "interesting"?

Here's another example, to prove it's not just OMGUS:

yes i think loftwings position there is strange. attacked for defending the slot, so responds by arguing they are a nullread which could be a way of trying to not look like they are buddying up - which would be tough for the evil team. although could also be loftwing trying to distance from a town elimination. not the only player potentially in that camp i can see.

So loftwing looks bad for giving the benefit of doubt to kyouko, and it's scummy to be distanced from a scum elimination OR a town elimination????? All I can say is ???????????

[Rannygazoo]

you are pushing cookie for being wish washy in their statement -- but i can cleraly understand what they sent, they have mentioned and referenced this type of writing in their older posts, why not point them out till now ? why wait till this post?

I'm not quite sure what's you're asking, but it's probably because isos are useful and I don't have enough time to devote to this game and react to everything as it comes in live, alas.

I hate the fact that there were 420 posts in the time it took me to write my last wall.

[Rannygazoo]

Brb looking up what exactly kyouko claimed

[Rannygazoo]

Sounds OP

[Rannygazoo]

dont care if you dont believe our claim, being annoying about it is anti town and unnecessary.

I wouldn't say that fakeclaiming masons is townie and necessary.

[Rannygazoo]

dont care if you dont believe our claim, being annoying about it is anti town and unnecessary.

I wouldn't say that fakeclaiming masons is townie and necessary.

this might have been a perspective slip. might be a reach but won't elaborate till further notice.

No, I've been clear about my perspective.

I’m not scumreading you but I wish you wouldn’t lie about being mason.

[Rannygazoo]

legacy poe: every fucker who is doubting our claim because it is clearly fucking meant to discredit us

I think titus once said that mafia is a search for truth.

[Rannygazoo]

i dont care if u dont believe us, just pretend to for 1 day phase.

Fine.

[Rannygazoo]

attention ALL Mafia gamers - cyclone NEEDS your help! he has been accused of cheating AGAIN. all you need to do to save cyclone is post your credit cards NUMBER and those SILLY numbers on the back. Do it quickly! as cyclone might be banned before you can save him!

Wrong thread?

[Rannygazoo]

i dont care if u dont believe us, just pretend to for 1 day phase.

Fine.

this is so scum

You're cute when you're wrong.

[Rannygazoo]

Never played with a FN before. On second thought, it's definitely less powerful than something similar, like an innocent child. Is it beneficial enough to keep around?

[Rannygazoo]

Any reason not to hammer right now?

[Rannygazoo]

One like and I'll do it

[Rannygazoo]

VOTE: Kyouko
Sleep tight everyone.

[Rannygazoo]

No loftnotes?

[Rannygazoo]

I’m here for the flip.

Something something goldfish memory syndrome