Mini 2274: Terminator: Salvation Game Over!

[Vivax]

Lmao I didn't think this thread would open up again. What follows are not tears of joy because now I have to actually read it.
Don't be fooled by appereances. There are TWO terminators in this thread, one being me, the one on team green. And the other the poor soul on team red that after my catch up, I will bury in my ketchup.

But first, I've got a tournament to play this evening. Toodles.

[Vivax]

Nooo Fidget

I've waited 24 hours to say this so it hits a little less hard now, but to any pals from my PT who are reading and Gamma, that CSF flip was an emotional rollercoaster hahaha.

p-edit: lol Enchant wait till you see our PT

Our order of lims and deaths was
Day 1 -> NAHA
Night 1 -> Loki/Freedom
Day 2 -> CSF
Night 2 -> Fidget

Yeah
Pretty sure Vivax is town based on both NAHA and CSF going after Toog

Before I head out I'd like to add that the conclusion is correct, but it's also an easy type of post to make as mafia. You should be more wary of scum bussing so this feels like it lacks paranoia about my slot and just echoes the sentiment of the last page.
In other words, you go to toast pile for it.

[Vivax]

how much of the game have you actually read? you should see that NAHA was pushing your slot for a while. After NAHA's death, and maybe even before a little bit, CSF tried to suggest Toog was scum within the people outside team 2. It seems they absolutely wanted your slot dead, unlike the weak distancing seen between them at the end of the first vote-out
plus, Aisa will back me on this, NAHA made a very weird post asking for people to stop voting them, that doesn't make sense if the scum control 50% of the votes
so try coming up with a take that requires more than a room temperature IQ

lol the burn
Cooking inside won't make you look better, but at least it confirms I can add more ketchup to your robotoast persona.

[Vivax]

vote me then you fucking coward

Ladies and gentlemen, we have a confession.
Gamma couldn't withstand even 3 posts from yours truly before breaking down into martyrdom.

[Vivax]

This is why the forces that be kept me contained at teamliquid for so long, but now I am unchained and on the loose. Ready to turn your inner fires against yourself. woosh

[Vivax]

I have no idea who I'd want as a leader just looking at the player list. From what I'd guess though, we want to elect consensus town reads who are also good at reading others, since it looks like we'll have to rely on them to make choices in future events.

so where's your vote for me?

I don't know you.

It’s not Hectic’s alt. What more do you need to know?

idk why but TOWN

This one was a town spew. Peng elim was bad in hindsight. Judging by beginning, CSF and NAHL (reminder:the mafia) were preferentially interacting a good amount with each other which is uncommon from my experience, so not easy catches.

Ahahahahahhaah the link to the mafia chat has been removed from the OP
Dammit, I was gonna start by saying that that I’m disappointed by it not being a rick-roll XD
it’s not like anything changes anyway

Welp, rip

Really? The mafia chat was in the OP and nami was in it and still played the game? Maybe we should talk about that before I go on. Now I feel stupid for sussing GE when we can just vote nami and win the game.

[Vivax]

Currently, thinking about Roden and cat scratch

as well (irony)

(that’s a pretty common opinion)
(wouldn’t rush it)
I wouldn’t mind nominating myself either just because the leader role sounds goddamn cool XD
but like, if I were to be honest- my read accuracy on MS was never much above rand :/
so yeah…
I recognize that I’m just acting illogical

I don't actually consider myself trustable

Oh okay then.

VOTE: ejjinami

That's it?That's the joke?Mafia got outed by the OP and ejjnami is playing along like this? Bruh

[Vivax]

Spoiler:

problem being, the first vote phase, again, did not go anywhere near how I think it would have if 3 scum were in the group

wdym by that?

I'll break down the action on my side now

I open by j'accusing Fidget because I felt like her comment about doing blackjack and hookers with penguin felt a bit too sure the other side had scum, Fidget immediately posts like 7 times in a row in response to me. CSF enters kinda limply and votes Aisa. Loki posts stuff declaring Toog scum based on how they acted regarding the team selection. NAHA immediately goes for my throat calling my Fidget push "outing", Aisa comes in asking NAHA about their thoughts on Loki and Aisa's TRs on me and also addresses CSF's vote on her.
Aisa then brings up she wanted to find evidence NAHA was scum but just ended up with a TR there. To add some director's commentary, this feels like a weird stance to go with as scum since a) if you want to find reasons to SR a scumbuddy it'll usually be easier and b) if the goal was to just voice a TR Aisa could have just done that and tried to convince others rather than taking the position of the one to be convinced that NAHA is scum. I agree with Aisa's NAHA TR, she then asks me to explain it which puzzles me a little since it seemed like she was more interested in hearing logic the other way.
Fidget starts like, actually tryharding, which I did not see as towny in the moment. Loki says I've slipped in his reads for not having a narrow PoE which wasn't exactly true since I still TRed 3/5 of the other players in that thread att, but apparently no one bothers to track legacy reads when keeping tabs on what people's reads are at a certain moment. I bring up that my reads have stayed their course and Loki asks why they are what they are. I clarify my reads a bit and also ask Loki what happened to the meta TR on me. Aisa votes me right after as an attempt to sort me, also explains that the NAHA re-read ws motivated by NAHA being the only null on team 2 Aisa had with the others being townleans.
Loki clarifies which game his meta read on me was from and then starts drilling me on my reads. Loki also says my preference for team 2 didn't make sense (when I was highly confident Andante was scum but my Fidget suspicion felt more circumstantial), then attempts to say I should be SRing NAHA if I thought thinking both teams would fail was scum indicative (which was an absolute garbage-bin interpretation of my argument!)

I took some offense to the clarified meta because in essence it was saying in order to be townread I had to be a non-entity for the first part of the game, which is sucky. I also start shutting out Loki because I wasn't in the mood to argue with someone who very clearly had blinders on to actual sound logic and rational explanation. I also slam Loki for assuming my read on Andante changed because I was SRing Fidget after he did the same thing when NAHA hurt tagged penguin. Also I was getting tilted that Loki was acting like I wasn't doing anything to explain my Fidget SR when I was, it was just that because my reads are esoteric and can be formed on a whim based off something seemingly innocuous, it probably came off as nonsense. But I also think Loki had played with me more than enough to understand that was how I formed reads sometimes and the lack of comprehension of that pinged me. He also tried to construe me as TRing NAHA for expecting both teams to succeed which is NOWHERE NEAR ANYTHING I HAD SAID. I vote Loki in small part because the bad faith arguments were making me distrust him greatly but for the most part because I could tell he was emotionally charged so I knew a vote would likely result in a lightning-fast OMGUS, after which I attempted to hammer myself (NAHA and Aisa had voted before Loki). It's actually comical that the bait worked because right before I voted myself Loki said he was immune to my emotional manipulation when he feel into a different manipulation entirely to what he thought I was doing.
Fidget actually start breaking down my thought process for Loki a bit after my self-vote (tbf if Fidget hadn't gotten killed that would have made my read on her go very south upon seeing that again, it felt like it was deliberately held until after I had attempted to lock in votes). I start lolcatting a bit but then get serious and say to never eliminate Aisa because I was a bit worried I wouldn't get to read the thread after I had gotten voted out. Following that, CSF breaks the illusion and points out that no hammer occurred because the deadline was hard-set and asked why I self-voted, to which I explained that it felt like NAHA and Loki were pre-sorting me scum in bad faith so I wanted to try to lock them into misyeeting me as a sort of lesson.
Cat Scratch then dives into coalition theory claiming scum would want to send a coalition with 1 scum to reduce the pool (obviously untrue given she flipped scum and I believe was backing her own team) and suggests Andante is suspicious for voting team 2 while SRing 3 people there. She then proceeds to try to play good-cop to NAHA's bad-cop by trying to act in defense of me. It was a good plan foiled by necessity. I also ask NAHA why they TR Loki since, after the meta read Loki had on me turned out to be bunk, my opinion on him slingshotted in part due to me hard-defending Loki to ejji, which resulted in my outlook on Loki being in the negative since I was like "maybe ejji was right all along!". CSF asks me to clarify my position on how Fidget and NAHA's beliefs that both teams would fail differed, which actually made a dent in me because a) it wasn't Loki who I was pretty much not engaging on principle att and b) it actually was asked in a way that felt salient. I pull out the ThorHead card (using meta that's seemingly fair except for a key perversion of it that makes it way less trustworthy) on Loki and spell out for CSF my logic for what exactly pinged me from Fidget (for the first of many times).

I then exit tilt-mode and put my vote on Loki with actual meaning behind it. Loki starts trying to take a moral high-ground by claiming his questions are perfectly logical to which I retort they feel shallow and like I have to explain my reads in baby-steps in order for Loki to comprehend them (this gets called out later). I also note I answered similar questions from others because of the lack of a belief that the answers would take more effort than I thought it was worth. I also call out Loki for what I see as shitty gotcha logic because he said he hadn't seen Fidget's scumgame (despite allegedly knowing her main?) but still tried to claim Fidget's posting pattern wasn't AI, in a way that misconstrued me again (claiming I was reading Fidget on post length when it came down to more of a timing and structure issue).
Loki then starts to change tune a little bit, but not much, asking why I had been dodging his questions (which should have been apparent but w/e), complaining that I was answering the questions he was asking when others did it (see reasoning for why I wasn't answering Loki, btw this bit carried on for a while and got rather grating), added more clarification to the meta read (this was actually rather okay compared to the rest of what I was dealing with) by saying I was trying to force a certain leader in the other game (true, but in that case why the drop of the meta read when the TRs I had that Loki listed as reason to drop it, FB and Enchant, I was nowhere close to pushing to be leader here?), and addresses my Fidget read full explanation ( by getting pissed I didn't explain it to him directly). One problem with A LOT of what Loki brought up was it was couched in a lot of complaining; rather than be glad I was making strides to actual answer questions he was asking, he got offended I wasn't responding to him! That's kinda ego-driven and I don't recall too well if he was pushing me as scum for that but if he was that was not very sensible, he literally let his offense of me answering to others before him cloud his judgment (this is starting to feel a bit overly critical and brutal so I'll mention that most if not all of this stuff I'm writing is probably the work of 2 of the bluntest of my 8 facets. I don't normally broach this subject in mafia games but I think it's mandatory to establish I don't feel entirely right being this way about Loki but it's the best way to convey what went down after the fact, I feel like). My other issue was he posted stuff without really thought-matching the other stuff that was going on.
After the brief period of what felt like good-faith posting Loki goes off by doubling down on his "truthfulness", refusal to actually absorb the logic behind my Fidget and NAHA reads diverging, tries to act like me reversing course on Fidget is unreasonable after the astronomical effort Fidget put in to sort when it absolutely wasnt. Fidget then comes in with the mother of all good posts, which included actual effort to bridge to gap between me and Loki, bringing up a good point that Loki continued engaging me well after coming to scumread me. Like, Fidget's posting was phenomenal atp.

Following Fidget's big-damn-hero moment, Loki starts to process "wait, scum!Gamma basically NEVER tries to go against me like this, what gives?" and backs off for a bit. Fidget does start to post arguments for me being scum in response to Loki TRing me, which in honest retrospect feels kinda shitty, Fidget tried to bridge the gap between me and Loki and then goes into providing reason I could be scum? Anyway, I re-enter thread for the first time after the seeming tune-change, and start just tearing into Loki, including constantly railing on about him missing the one post I explained the distinction between my Fidget and NAHA reads in. This was a bit of a dick move alongside the baby-steps explanation thing because it kinda slipped my mind Loki has dyslexia so he called me out on it and I reeled back in response because I could tell I was millimeters from crossing the same moral event horizon I had in Slaughter Hour (...I don't rlly wannna talk about ti). Besides that though I expressed a lot of those parantheticals I put in this post in my breakdown of Loki's posting. Me and Loki go on fighting for a while, until I hit full-on explosion territory which is where the call-out happens. After which, Loki starts seriously thinking I could be town and I decide to stop posting and take a full on thread break for a couple hours because I needed to clear my head and determine whether I felt like my ability to distinguish game elements from personal conflicts was compromised.
I return a few hours later and post a few things in response to posts that occurred since I left. Loki then snaps back into pushing me because "there's no way I should be scumreading him" because I mindlessly left my vote on him, SOMETHING I AM VEERRRRYYY ESTABLISHED TO DO AS TOWN!!!! I retort by saying in order for me to unvote I would need to not feel like I was backing down from the push just to let myself die! I also took offense to Loki pulling the "I'm disappointed if you're town" card which I previously experienceds similar from a very slimy and manipulative player, that Loki should not be emulating.
Fidget flips back into defending me which, again, very concerning that Fidget was basically playing devil's-advocate to whatever happened to be Loki's stance on me at the time, @scum you fucked up by killing her off! Loki then brings out the actual point of me haaving left my vote on him, whihc like, by not actually trying to approach me with any sort of civility and instead hopping to "Gammsa!scum because he parked his vote on me and he know I don't playe like this" made it REALLY hard for me to want to remove my vote. I also bring up that I've never seen Loki play the sort of bad-faith game I'd seen from her this game so I had zero clue whether she would do it as scum, and told her to stop harping on a bout telling the truh because it was starting to appear self-conscious. Loki says she never re-assesses as scum like she did with me because there's no reason to, whihc prompts me to pull a turnabout card on her by saying that just as her townflip would look bad on me, my townflip would look bad on her. I do mention her play is illogical as scum on the base logic I was employing, but her too-quick jump to accusing me again felt like there had to be SOME scum motive to it, whcih I ascribed as being paranoid letting the wagon on me die would result in her becoming the boot in the end. This results in a sort of impasse, where I can't really talk any more sense in Loki because he's stuck on "I can't let go of pushig you if your vote is gonna stay on me" and I'm kinda in a similar position. AAt that point, I decided "fuck it, I can't get any MORE in the hole, let's provide an ultimatum I have no business proposing!" and try to strike the following deal: me and Loki both avoid voting each other for the rest of the first voting stage. I decided on such an ultimatum because it felt like strongarming Loki was the only way to prevent him from continuing to burrow into the same tunnel he'd beeen stuck on for the majority of the phase and hopefully redirect his effort to finding ACTUAL SCUM!

Loki takes a second and then decided to actuallt take me up on my offer. We start actually having civil conversation where he questions why I reassessed and I explain it was because I couldn't quite grok the scum agenda for reconsidering I put out because his play felt absolutely bass-ackwards to what I described. Loki says he has no clue who would be the infiltrator in the group, to which I looked over the activity overview and proposed it could be NAHA or Aisa based on the fact me+Loki had been squaring off for so long with what felt like NOTHING from either of them! CSF also was on the lower end of activity but because of the smattering of good-cop posting he did I ended up discarding the thought she could be scum. I specifically called out that NAHA's group activity was WILDLY lower than their main thread activity, which felt like trying to let Loki drive the MY on me. Loki suggests Aisa and Toog might be scum, which puzzles me a little because I had no inkling of a connection between them, so I asked about it.
Loki then starts questioning why NAHA had volunterred themself as the second vote-out if I flipped scum, which was kinda not the most airtight line of questioning but I think still rustled NAHA's feathers in the right way to get them to start properly alignment telling. NAHA says they wouldn't let themselves be miselimmed if there was still confscum to yeet which prompted Loki to ask who ws confscum from my townflip, which was honestly a completely fair question as while it was obvious to me NAHA meant there was confscum in the group rather than one specific person, it put them on the spot a bit and probably frazzled them. Loki asseerts it's more logical for NAHA to volunteer to be limmed if they're wrong on the SR on me vs. being right, which I don't think is entirely true but I think either that or Loki saying he was going to start fully backing the idea of gamma!town spooked NAHA off of voting me.

At this point I end up with a kick of new energy because my enchant TR I had from very early on that NAHA tried to call TMI I was finally able to actually back because my completed game sample size was large enough I could point to more then just the normal game enchant replaced me in and mayyyybe chromavolan for enchant meta (I never used chromavalon except to page Loki to back my Enchant read at one point). Loki also provided some ISOs of Aisa, 1 town game and 1 scumgame, from which I conclude Aisa's play just from a low-effort meta basis leans town in this game. Aisa comes in and actually pushes Loki a little bit based on Loki being different in squid game (which I think was already rebutted when ejji brought it up?). She also backs a point Fidget made where my fire-and-brimstone read on Andante was not something they expected scum me to be doing. She ALSO also addresses my concern about her lack of presence.
After that and some engagement between Loki and Fidget, as well as me later down the line, Loki drops the first vote for NAHA This results in NAHA dropping a blatant OMGUS on Loki claiming Aisa made good points. Loki and I both basically see right through it though. Fidget also is rightfully skeptical. CSF's posts at this time are basically throwing the softest pitch to explain reads NAHA's way. She also tried to put some extra pressure on Loki.In response to 2 votes being on Loki, I did the same for NAHA. Aisa then removes her Loki vote, causing NAHA to try a last ditch bus on CSF. This does not work out and causes the rest of the people not voting NAHA to vote them. And that's the first vote phase basically summed up!

The second vote phase was way less active. Everyone was under the assumption everyone else was town so theories to who was scum on the other side were kicked around until around the last 48 hours where I decided to vote CSF believing myself the likely pick if scum were to have the control over the vote from no one voting at all. Fidget and Aisa followed and CSF went out with basically no ceremony whatsoever.
I'll be upfront though, I could actually see Aisa maybe being scum. Still feel like it's highly unlikely given how things went down though. Suggesting I could be scum is fucking preposterous though because I feel like my involvement was rather key to getting both the scum yeeted. I will not abide a repeat of Gensokyo where because of people being absolute boneheads and thinking I led votes against scumbuddies twice in a row for minimal gain the trail of the last scum ended up getting completely lost!

And you. Oh my actual god. I know that some players, like yours truly, are a terrifying sight to behold when they start pressuring you. But next time you're town and I call you mafia, don't overreact like this. I'm not a publisher.
But if you are able to write in dactylic hexameter, I'll gladly take a sample. One could assume you don't lack the motivation, maybe, just maybe.

[Vivax]

The link to the Mafia PT being in the OP has no bearing on the alignment of people who notice it, I don't understand your argument here

It wasn't accessible?

(I think this is what the youth call a "flail")

And you are what they call a farmer's boy. I'm playing the game.

[Vivax]

In today's episode of Aisa-throws-out-random-thoughts:

If I need to die to state your collective paranoia so you can move on to Vivax, so be it, but like. Given what seems to have occurred in the past PT, and in the main thread prior to the split, our hypothetical scumteam's strategy would have apparently been to just all bus each other, which.... Isn't really an ideal tactic if you ask me, and certainly hasn't worked out for "us" so far.

Hmm, NAHA also went after the Vivax slot a lot though.

I wonder if Vivax's entrance and attitude may be mildly scum indicative? It's a long slog ahead for the lone scum if they want to win. Might as well come in and have some fun, push Gamma a little, etc.

Nah, the PT wasn't accessible at any point Vivax. (Or it was but no-one except ejjinami ever noticed.) Are you an alt by the way?

At some point I will attempt to consolidate all my thoughts into an actual opinion on who could be scum, but that time is not now

Spoiler: Fluff

Aisa comes in and [...]. She also [...]. She ALSO also [...].

I died.

No I'm not an alt, I go by Vivax wherever I play (✟TL mafia✟, MU).

Regarding the bolded: How do you presume that it wasn't accessible or that only ejjnami noticed it? Seems like a generous assumption to make.

[Vivax]

Don't tell me we sit for all deadline like that.

I think you should assume leadership of this town, but I don't know who would agree.
So far you've only voted peeps who voted me, and in the PT you voted who I didn't think was mafia. Who do you actually think is mafia?

[Vivax]

TL;DR

If I'm Koba and I know that shoshin is scum, and that they aren't playing the game, I attempt to bus there regardless.

ジブリッシュ?

Who are Koba and shoshin. Cat and super mario bro?

[Vivax]

TL;DR

If I'm Koba and I know that shoshin is scum, and that they aren't playing the game, I attempt to bus there regardless.

ジブリッシュ?

Who are Koba and shoshin. Cat and super mario bro?

Koba is NotAHecticAlt.
shoshin is your slot's first occupant.

I don't disagree that both scum pushing me should be treated as NAI for my slot, which is the reason I didn't like Emerald pushing the notion.
Currently though I'm warming up to the idea that Johnny could be mafia cause I'm getting the vibes that he's just lurking and trying to sentiment snipe the best wagon for his survival. Calling my posts a flail was a reach, I much prefer Aisas take on that one. I do try to have fun.
I'd also like to add that ejjnami was a lot more active in the PT.

But apparently Enchant floats the notion that there's 2 confirmed town and so far I've liked the slot for town too much to dismiss that. I don't know who he means exactly but judging by the posts I'd guess it's RR and Aisa. Those seem fairly town to me.

[Vivax]

Ejj is Town because they took a long time to realize the PT existed. If they were scum, they would have seen it when they went to post in the scum thread.

That can be fake-dumbtelled.
Also weird that they would notice scum chat in the OP but not realize that there are PTs in the game.

I was very confused about mechanics as well, I just don't think that's a good reason for a read.

[Vivax]

[...]

Nah, the PT wasn't accessible at any point Vivax. (Or it was but no-one except ejjinami ever noticed.) Are you an alt by the way?

[...]

No I'm not an alt, I go by Vivax wherever I play (✟TL mafia✟, MU).

Regarding the bolded: How do you presume that it wasn't accessible or that only ejjnami noticed it? Seems like a generous assumption to make.

Ah yes, MU, that makes sense. (I was just asking because you came across as pretty confident and I was trying to understand where that came from.)

To answer your question:
- I think we may both have accidentally conflated two issues. Issue #1 is: was there a link to the scum PT in the original post? Issue #2 is: if there was a link, was the PT accessible to any townies?
- It is possible that issue #1 occurred, and I'll give you that it's possible that people other than ejjinami noticed. Maybe they just didn't say anything because if issue #2 didn't occur, issue #1 is not a big deal?
- If your point is that ejjinami noticing and pointing out #1 is slightly scum-indicative, sure, I'll give you that. Maybe mafia are more attentive to such things or something.
- I am not an authority on the forum software, but I believe that for issue #2 to occur the moderator needs to specifically grant access to a townie in error. It's very likely that did not occur. If that did occur, no townie noticed it. If a townie noticed issue #2, I have no idea why they didn't say anything.

So I guess my point is: it's possible the OP contained a link to the scum chat and ejjinami noticing that may be somewhat scum-indicative, but like, it does not outright spew ejjinami scum as you seemed to believe.

By the way,

@ejjinami

, I'd like you to explain exactly what you meant when you made that post (I have a theory I'd like to check).

[...]
I don't disagree that both scum pushing me should be treated as NAI for my slot, which is the reason I didn't like Emerald pushing the notion.
Currently though I'm warming up to the idea that Johnny could be mafia cause I'm getting the vibes that he's just lurking and trying to sentiment snipe the best wagon for his survival. Calling my posts a flail was a reach, I much prefer Aisas take on that one. I do try to have fun.
I'd also like to add that ejjnami was a lot more active in the PT.

But apparently Enchant floats the notion that there's 2 confirmed town and so far I've liked the slot for town too much to dismiss that. I don't know who he means exactly but judging by the posts I'd guess it's RR and Aisa. Those seem fairly town to me.

Wait, is that why you pushed Gamma a little? Have you read e.g. my post on why Gamma and I are probably town? Do you agree or disagree?

I'd say my confidence is just how I play this game. I'm not necessarily as talkative 'off-paper', and definitely not as pompous.
My town play can be very disruptive at times. I just love chaotic, emotional games and can be quite reckless at provoking that in a game.

Regarding §1 I'd say it's not a slam dunk reason if ejjnami wasn't able to access it. I'd also like to add that I got powerscum vibes off them in the PT and mentioned it there, but that was more feels based.
As for §2 (Gamma), I'll have to think it through because I don't know if 3 scum in a PT killing off everyone else wouldn't be too obvious to spot for the people from the other PT before mafia could secure a victory. Since I'm a sub/replacement I don't really have a good grasp on the alternating phases for now to be able to reconstruct that off the bat.
What would the town tell be, please do tell?

As for the avatar, it just stopped working. Got it from N_M so who knows.

[Vivax]

So I'm not gonna vote Aisa or Gamma, because wrong group.

I'm more or less betting the game on ejji here.

Vivax was the slot I wanted to push yesterday

I know nothing about RR other than this empassioned plea right now, which I like.

Enchant I could go either way on, but I don't really get bad vibes.

Yeah.

VOTE: Vivax

I'd like to add that Johnny didn't push me in the PT and seemed content to just vote Penguin. So the bolded looks scummy to me today.

[Vivax]

Spoiler: Relevant context

[...]

Nah, the PT wasn't accessible at any point Vivax. (Or it was but no-one except ejjinami ever noticed.) Are you an alt by the way?

[...]

No I'm not an alt, I go by Vivax wherever I play (✟TL mafia✟, MU).

Regarding the bolded: How do you presume that it wasn't accessible or that only ejjnami noticed it? Seems like a generous assumption to make.

Ah yes, MU, that makes sense. (I was just asking because you came across as pretty confident and I was trying to understand where that came from.)

To answer your question:
- I think we may both have accidentally conflated two issues. Issue #1 is: was there a link to the scum PT in the original post? Issue #2 is: if there was a link, was the PT accessible to any townies?
- It is possible that issue #1 occurred, and I'll give you that it's possible that people other than ejjinami noticed. Maybe they just didn't say anything because if issue #2 didn't occur, issue #1 is not a big deal?
- If your point is that ejjinami noticing and pointing out #1 is slightly scum-indicative, sure, I'll give you that. Maybe mafia are more attentive to such things or something.
- I am not an authority on the forum software, but I believe that for issue #2 to occur the moderator needs to specifically grant access to a townie in error. It's very likely that did not occur. If that did occur, no townie noticed it. If a townie noticed issue #2, I have no idea why they didn't say anything.

So I guess my point is: it's possible the OP contained a link to the scum chat and ejjinami noticing that may be somewhat scum-indicative, but like, it does not outright spew ejjinami scum as you seemed to believe.

By the way,

@ejjinami

, I'd like you to explain exactly what you meant when you made that post (I have a theory I'd like to check).

[...]
I don't disagree that both scum pushing me should be treated as NAI for my slot, which is the reason I didn't like Emerald pushing the notion.
Currently though I'm warming up to the idea that Johnny could be mafia cause I'm getting the vibes that he's just lurking and trying to sentiment snipe the best wagon for his survival. Calling my posts a flail was a reach, I much prefer Aisas take on that one. I do try to have fun.
I'd also like to add that ejjnami was a lot more active in the PT.

But apparently Enchant floats the notion that there's 2 confirmed town and so far I've liked the slot for town too much to dismiss that. I don't know who he means exactly but judging by the posts I'd guess it's RR and Aisa. Those seem fairly town to me.

Wait, is that why you pushed Gamma a little? Have you read e.g. my post on why Gamma and I are probably town? Do you agree or disagree?

I'd say my confidence is just how I play this game. I'm not necessarily as talkative 'off-paper', and definitely not as pompous.
My town play can be very disruptive at times. I just love chaotic, emotional games and can be quite reckless at provoking that in a game.

Regarding §1 I'd say it's not a slam dunk reason if ejjnami wasn't able to access it. I'd also like to add that I got powerscum vibes off them in the PT and mentioned it there, but that was more feels based.
As for §2 (Gamma), I'll have to think it through because I don't know if 3 scum in a PT killing off everyone else wouldn't be too obvious to spot for the people from the other PT before mafia could secure a victory. Since I'm a sub/replacement I don't really have a good grasp on the alternating phases for now to be able to reconstruct that off the bat.
What would the town tell be, please do tell?

As for the avatar, it just stopped working. Got it from N_M so who knows.

Glad we're on the same page about PT access. Powerscum vibes is fair.

Alternating phases...?

The town tell would be that you didn't seem to understand how scum PTs work, which may suggest you've never been on one on this website. Although I was thinking that you obviously understand that fake-dumbtells exist, which is concerning for my theory.

Not my town tell, the town tell for GE in the post you linked to me where you dismissed the 3-scum-in-1-PT theory.

[Vivax]

Eh, I think Enchant is prob Town here.

No reason to chainsaw for Vivax as solo scum, when he could help the lim go through first then blame me for it after

Do you believe that you should be scumread for being wrong on a player?
That's poor, honestly. But helps you make a lazy read here. Townies can be wrong all the time and I don't believe that you'd scumread them on that alone.

By the logic you're using here, if I'm scum all the mafia that flipped should have been town for pushing me.
You also imply that the only reason you should be pushed for by a scum-Enchant is a mislaunch.
If you're convinced Ench is town, try to convince them of your point of view?

[Vivax]

UNVOTE: ejjnami
VOTE: JohnnyFarrar

I like this more for today, the voting mood flipped again.

[Vivax]

[Vivax]

On reread, Andante-JohnnyFarrar obvtown, ejjinami has some interesting interactions with the known members of the scumteam. Disclaimer: I am on page 3

From what I've seen, Johnny didn't even post until page 3. Unless I missed a post.

[Vivax]

Johnny is the substitute for Andante. It's the same slot.

I don't find Ands posts that townie, she defended and in contemporary attacked NAHA right off the bat.
NAHA also healed Andante. I would assume that ideally, mafia wouldn't want to just give up on getting a leader set up.
Here:

Spoiler:

I mean - no one has to decide now?

lol THANK YOU!! everyone's acting like we HAVE to have one in the first 24 hours, like... people chill it'll be ok lol

HEAL: Andante
I know she requested not to be one, but I find that those who seek positions of power are often not the sort of people I want in positions of power.

hahahaha umm I'll either end up being good leader or terrible leader if I am one, there's like nothing in between, like I guess I'd rather be one than a terminator, but I'm sure we can find 2 town outside of me!! Abd that would be most ideal

oh rofl i just read the rules and you cant self heal lame

HEAL: PenguinPower

I'd also like myself to be healed as I tend to thrive with control over stuff in games like this.

Ok but like, why is your first instinct "I wanna self heal!!!!" this really isn't much different from a normal maf game where you find your town core or whatever, I say this, but if that was your first instinct it's probably more likely that you are town, cause I think maf would be more wanting to push each other, since there's 3 of them, like, 2 can push 1 to be healed, and yeah. ok tangent over, uhh not like a hard tr here or anything, but I think it's a good look for NotAHecticAlt

also theyre a mod so clearly theyre already well suited in positions of power

umm what? maybe I take back the "NotAHecticAlt kinda is looking good" cause umm "I'm healing mod cause mod" is like... really?? like, wanna play the actual game? or are we just blindly sheeping penguin all game cause mod?

Spoiler:

Noting the short phase deadline with disconcert, I make my entrance and say I'm excited to play with you all.

I'm not a fan of the instant heals... like, as soon as someone hits 6 they're a leader, so like yeah. plus post cap situatiion like, ehhh LOVE the gifs though

Hi! Do you feel different about the heals in particular? Would you feel this way if they were votes? Surely people can count?

HEAL: Andante

Uhhh I mean, heals are important, I don't see the purpose in RUSHING right as the game starts to randomly heal whoever, like, idk, that's just me. if they were votes I'd lose my mind I already have 2 votes lol so uhh yeah no heals and votes are not the same

Why are we voting heals based only off a few posts? I like the reasoning behind the heals but the game just literally started.

exactly my thoughts... it's almost like people don't care who they heal, like, it's not hard to sit here as day starts take control of the game, it's really not hard. if people wait till everyone at least shows up and says something, there's actual content... some of these people don't seem to want any content though I guess

The game is supposed to be mountainous. There’s no way the leader will have a standard role
If I were to guess- they could have a say in the lynch or night-kill choice so it might be worth at least eliminating those leader-candidates who know they tend to scum-side
Getting someone highly trustable and with a high accuracy would be perfect but frankly speaking I’m kinda afraid of seriously aiming for it
I doubt I’ll be able to get a good read on nearly anyone before any sort of yet
So yeah
……..it’s not like theorizing helps right now anyway lmao, lemme maybe just read the thread

OP says it's better if town are leaders than maf, so like, if I TR someone, and like my strongest TR doesn't always have good reads or whatever, I'm still healing them. cause it sounds like you don't care the person's alignment, you're just looking for the strongest players overall, and that's who you want. Which like, I guess if that's how you play, you do you, but those players are also more likely to have you thinking they're town when they're not, I'd rather just send 2 strong TRs regardless of their skills... the only way people get better is by practicing, and by being in this game, we're all practicing... I don't think these thoughts are all related to this post, but you strike me as someone who is coming in here "HERE'S MY THOUGHTS, AND THIS IS HOW WE'RE GONNA PLAY" which like, I am not a fan of, almost feels like you're trying too hard to be a leader in this situation, and I can safely say, as of this point, if there's anyone I don't want as a leader day 1, it's ejjinami.

I know it sounds stupid but if I were to select a Town leader right now, I’d make a choice based on personality rather than my early “reads”.

This is the post that got me so upset. Like, seriously? I didn't join this game for it to become "who's personality do I like/hate" or "popularity contest time" just.. yeah no, I'm not commenting on this any further, and just reading all this? almost makes me just not want to play the game anymore, I'm not sure why you ever thought it'd be a good idea to come in here "I'm going off personalities!!!" I highly doubt I'm alone in feeling this way..

[/quote]

[Vivax]

I wouldn't mind seeing ejjnami fall out of silence as to what they think.

[Vivax]

I think I'll put a vote down. Afraid our resident rat's theories just feel much too radical.
VOTE: Radical Rat

I feel a sudden rush of bloodthirst... Give! Me! The! Rat!

[Vivax]

sadness

[Vivax]

One of NAHAs halves each was sent to a timeline. I don’t see a problem here.

[Vivax]

I mean, NAHA is on both teams at once. The host has triggered a time paradoxon and players are randomly starting to disappear.

[Vivax]

Post 1202 by RR reads like a self-invalidating one.

‘I defended someone from NAHA but it could be bussing’ expressed in a lot more words.

[Vivax]

Yeah imo first 20ish pages are the juiciest
Don't know what went on in your PT though.

We ate Penguin burgers and Enchant did their thing.

[Vivax]

Post 1202 by RR reads like a self-invalidating one.

‘I defended someone from NAHA but it could be bussing’ expressed in a lot more words.

I don't really mind some good old hedging and self invalidating, I do plenty of that too. I think the issue for me is that RR's posts are not really leading to anything in any sort of visible way though. The hedging seems almost artificially limited to this one read on your slot because I've been asking about it. I think town!RR would be more likely to take a stand on, well, literally anything else?
...if someone knows RR and thinks I'm wrong this is like, a really good time to say something.

Anyway, will you help me in my quest for blood? Will you join me in voting for Rodent? Which one is better, bunnies or rats?

I'm of enchants opinion on this one by now. Will compromise with people willing to compromise.
Your question isn't hard to answer though

VOTE: RadicalRat

[Vivax]

Don't overthink it. This is a win unless enchant or Aisa are mafia.

[Vivax]

Though honestly... Mathblade is concerning me here, so I may be wavering on Vivax a bit.

We do have the ability to kill both of them though.

lol

[Vivax]

I think it's about time we get moving here.

If you want to kill me, kill me. If you don't, let's settle on either Vivax or MathBlade.

Very reasonable offer

[Vivax]

VOTE: mathblade

I have bad reasons for not wanting to launch Ench but whatevs ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ . They didn't opportunistically gnaw at me the moment I subbed into the game.
If it's not math, it's Johnny in which case gg mafia. Don't want to entertain m!Aisa world.

[Vivax]

Y'all need to towntell at some point today to help me out, ok? xx
Or maybe scum could just quote their PT or something. That would be much appreciated.

The artist at my old community who made this stuff isn't around any more I think so I'll just shamelessly "borrow" his work there and claim innocent child here:

[Vivax]

Y'all need to towntell at some point today to help me out, ok? xx
Or maybe scum could just quote their PT or something. That would be much appreciated.

I can’t really town tell to me that’s a trust tell.

I will answer any question you have though when I get time.

Look at this post. Look at it in context. Look at it closely.
And you can see that a mafia tucked his tail and ran when blasted with the magnificence of my town seal.

[Vivax]

Spoiler: Fluff

Effort!Aisa was a no show, but don't worry, I've found a substitute. I'm really thankful to Apathy!Aisa for stepping in to take this at the last minute.

So anyway.

CSF flipping maf HIGHLY suggests that last scum outside of team 2, because... Bruh really, why mafia would put all teammates with self, it's critically dumb.
So let's give remainings of Team 2 conftown status and sheep them.

Thanks, now i can go gaming normal games.

You and Gamma conftown, so...

It's kinda you to decide.

Hmm... how does this make sense though? Why would you just sheep me and Gamma instead of trying to form your own reads?

Sorry RR! I'll do my best to avenge you.

I suppose could be Vivax.

Hey Math, what do you think of Andante/JohnnyFarrar?

Also I will be

LA from this Friday to Monday 6 pm BST

.

Townier than Vivax by a mile

I have RL today so this is going to have to do unless I get a chance over lunch until tomorrow.

VOTE: Vivax

What's towny about them? What's scummy about Vivax?

Looks like it might be necessary to undig that discussion with the two PTs and what it meant for who was on them again.
Fwiw I would agree that your posts look townie, but mostly my read is from mechanics. So that deffo looks lazy.

Don't feel bad for low efforting though. Game only becomes hard to me if MB doesn't flip red.

[Vivax]

[...]

Looks like it might be necessary to undig that discussion with the two PTs and what it meant for who was on them again.
Fwiw I would agree that your posts look townie, but mostly my read is from mechanics. So that deffo looks lazy.

Don't feel bad for low efforting though. Game only becomes hard to me if MB doesn't flip red.

I genuinely don't quite understand whether this is a joke.

In case it isn't: I guess that if you have genuine concerns they seem worth addressing. Why does that need to be unearthed?

What I meant to say is that I don't find it worth to overthink the situation until we reach the spot where we lose from a mis-elim.
For now I'm mostly low efforting and just trying to kill everyone who wants to kill me because I'm assuming that's where the mafia is (thinking MB, JF). Subs are a succulent target.

I've been burned from putting high effort in games

almost

, almost designed to be unwinnable.

[Vivax]

Okok so
*deep breath*
I think I may have misunderstood what you meant which caused me to ask a question that did not make sense.
I think you then proceeded to rephrase the one line of your post which I did understand. Which is very much appreciated!

Could you please also explain/rephrase these two lines?

Looks like it might be necessary to undig that discussion with the two PTs and what it meant for who was on them again.
Fwiw I would agree that your posts look townie, but mostly my read is from mechanics. So that deffo looks lazy.

You and GE were the only ones left from the team where two mafias got nabbed, so it's highly unlikely to impossible for you both to have been mafia.
And if I'm not wrong mafia would have auto-lost if they all were on your team, but I'm not sure if I was looking at a hosting mistake.

[Vivax]

Johnny has an interesting strategy if scum in buddying me

Mafia thing to say.
Johnny has been pushing for my kill since forever. If town he wouldn't give a damn about buddying you, just about killing me. This is just a pocketing attempt.

[Vivax]

Johnny has an interesting strategy if scum in buddying me

Mafia thing to say.
Johnny has been pushing for my kill since forever. If town he wouldn't give a damn about buddying you, just about killing me. This is just a pocketing attempt.

The premise was if he’s scum it’s a weird strategy.

If town he’s telling the truth and townreads me.

??? *confused*

Are you like so desperate to paint me as mafia you aren’t reading?

But you

are

a mafia I am reading, I just quoted a post because I have read something you wrote.
You are just flailing at this point, and I checkmated your poor accusation.

[Vivax]

If Math is mafia, he just waiting in hopes i quickhammer your ass, not unvoting you.

idk

There is no escape for him. Once he‘s up against the three of you, you can slowhammer his ass. But it casts a bad light if I get miselimmed before you can win the game. I can‘t live without my pro stats.

I’m confirmed town from posting the townie seal, too. I know it‘s an underhanded way of towntelling, but I give it my all in my games, even dirty tricks like that.

[Vivax]

If Math is mafia, he just waiting in hopes i quickhammer your ass, not unvoting you.

idk

There is no escape for him. Once he‘s up against the three of you, you can slowhammer his ass. But it casts a bad light if I get miselimmed before you can win the game. I can‘t live without my pro stats.

I’m confirmed town from posting the townie seal, too. I know it‘s an underhanded way of towntelling, but I give it my all in my games, even dirty tricks like that.

This can be written for you too just swapping a few things

It’s bravado.

You don’t have an actual argument why I am scum.

I do have an argument I just am busy coughing repeatedly. I will get to it when I don’t feel like shit.

It's PoE. I wrote off Aisa, Enchant and Johnny, though I'm not sold on Johnny. He's just getting a free ride here if mafia, but I'm okay with that because he's such a cool cowboy.
I know you are busy coughing up an argument repeatedly, just that you have no argument. Checkmate again,

MATH

.

[Vivax]

So now you’ve borrowed mine.

Lol wow. You’re proving yourself scum.

I will do what I can later but Vivax is scum.

You are severely underestimating the perilous situation you are in, math man

[Vivax]

This is the case on math blade. Behold as he gets utterly obliterated with just a single post.

1. So now you’ve borrowed mine.

2.Lol wow. You’re proving yourself scum.

3.I will do what I can later but Vivax is scum.

1. Heinous accusations of plagiarism. Is that the best you can do, math man?
2. Embarrassed laughter followed by a ludicruous statement. The wow suggests his admiration at me seeing right through his facade, but it gives him away.
3. More empty promises, more of the same. This....man is not interested in the slightest of convincing others to join his cause. It's just a mafia scum laid bare for all to see, hiding his obvious embarrassment behind excuses.

[Vivax]

So now you’ve borrowed mine.

Lol wow. You’re proving yourself scum.

I will do what I can later but Vivax is scum.

You are severely underestimating the perilous situation you are in, math man

I am not in a perilous situation.
If I get miselimmed because I am sick and can’t form a case fine.
Then I flip green and you’re suspect number one tomorrow.

Your threat doesn’t scare me because there’s enough conf town I think to win.

If I die

Aisa probably dies. If not Aisa, Enchant.

Then it’s Johnny, you, and one of Aisa/Enchant.

Have you read my ISO,

math man

? Or are your eyes coughing too now?
No one who reads my ISO can be that certain I could be scum with a straight face, unless they are the two worst players in this game.
My brilliant mind was able to quickly establish that one of them must be mafia, and the other, unironically, the one playing cool all the time to hide that he isn't reading the game. Who just could that be?

[Vivax]

VOTE: Vivax

Then y’all decide.

I just am really sick. Each time I try to look at this I just don’t have the energy.

If I get some then I will.

Vivax recycled my arguments.

If I die then get Vivax tomorrow

Get better soon. I don‘t understand the sub in if you can‘t play.

[Vivax]

Apologies then, but someone has to go over and I‘m not letting that be a townie.

[Vivax]

Apologies then, but someone has to go over and I‘m not letting that be a townie.

Okay then vote yourself

Do I look like Rumplestiltkin to you?
It‘s up to others to see why you are mafia.

[Vivax]

Johnny has an interesting strategy if scum in buddying me

Mafia thing to say.
Johnny has been pushing for my kill since forever. If town he wouldn't give a damn about buddying you, just about killing me. This is just a pocketing attempt.

Do you disagree that Johnny is buddying Math?
Do you disagree with Math’s argument that scum!Johnny wouldn’t buddy Math?

I believe that Cowboy Bebops posts hint heavily at him being on autopilot on me and aren't aimed at buddying anyone.
If anyone was buddying, it was math blade making that argument.

[Vivax]

But not worth it to read much into buddying in general. There's no reason why you shouldn't do it as town as long as it's visible in the game. You do want to find someone to cooperate with.

[Vivax]

I mean, NAHA is on both teams at once. The host has triggered a time paradoxon and players are randomly starting to disappear.

This is what makes me sus of Vivax early

The deaths don’t seem to be random.

There were elims in our hood and a terminator night kill.

If the other hood went the same way.

Random kills are extremely unlikely on MS without being flagged as possible

I was referreing to something else. Not what you think.
Do you feel healthy now?

[Vivax]

I would say he’s not really solving the game.

He’s relying on the fact that he posted a sticker.

It’s a low level gimmick.

A lot of Vivax’s posts are gimmicks.

Oh. wow. WOW.
Is that your strategy this game, mathblade? When under duress from me, you will just claim you are sick. I give you sick leave and pray for your recovery just so you can be smitten again, and you exploit my generous absence and call my posts gimmicks. Low level? The nerve! It's a beautiful sticker after all, and only someone who didn't read my ISO could conclude it's all gimmicks, when in fact my ISO is a beautiful sticker of my shiny townieness in this game in itself.

I was gonna say:
...reflecting on why I decided to ask for feedback since the two players who are most likely to give me feedback will each say that my case on the other is amazing

I don’t like Johnny and Enchant are quiet but I still wanted to try

Two important questions really:

Math are you town?
Do you pledge your loyality to me?

If yes on both, we autowin.

If no on both, we autolose.

I don't see we going autolosing, and nothing yet trying to persuade me otherwise. We can as well just BURN EVERYTHING.

Of course, next day is next day, if it does happen, we turn paranoid fucks, but road is pretty chill for now. If you want to ask me something go ahead

Yes
One day only.

For someone who claims to be proficient in math, answering with yes to Enchant's "If no on both, we autolose" doesn't spell well for their alignment. This is just agreeing for the sake of agreeing because it's such an obvious fallacy to agree with.
Now I know why I spontaneously woke up at 6 AM today, it's because I inconsciously knew that you were spontaneously combusting at this time.

[Vivax]

Spoiler:

Finally, some thoughts on what Vivax has done in this thread:
- I like this post:

Spoiler: quote

Nooo Fidget

I've waited 24 hours to say this so it hits a little less hard now, but to any pals from my PT who are reading and Gamma, that CSF flip was an emotional rollercoaster hahaha.

p-edit: lol Enchant wait till you see our PT

Our order of lims and deaths was
Day 1 -> NAHA
Night 1 -> Loki/Freedom
Day 2 -> CSF
Night 2 -> Fidget

Yeah
Pretty sure Vivax is town based on both NAHA and CSF going after Toog

Before I head out I'd like to add that the conclusion is correct, but it's also an easy type of post to make as mafia. You should be more wary of scum bussing so this feels like it lacks paranoia about my slot and just echoes the sentiment of the last page.
In other words, you go to toast pile for it.

- There are

a lot

of jokes in his ISO. Initially I wanted to make a list of all his posts that were jokes but I gave up.

-

Sussed ejjinami for that post about the Mafia PT. I still think this ought to be slightly +town, much to my dismay

Spoiler:

- Pushes Gamma then says "next time you're town and I call you mafia don't overreact like this", then I ask him if he agrees Gamma and I are town, he says he has to think about it. Maybe playstyle, but eh, maybe there's a bit of inconsistency there
- "Apparently Enchant floats the notion that there's 2 confirmed town [...] I don't know who he means exactly" oof not sure I buy this in retrospect
- "Will compromise with people willing to compromise" followed by RR vote: I didn't say this but this did strike me as possibly scummy at the time.
- I don't want to look at the discussion we had about "undigging that discussion with the two PTs" again because I am still not sure I understand
- He starts by saying JohnnyFarrar seems scummy, at some point he "wrote off" Johnny as a scumread but it's not clear why

Maybe the best way to summarise my thoughts is that it's not clear he is trying to solve the game. I understand he has explained this with not wanting to effort / not wanting to overthink it, but at some point I have to assess whether he's using this as a convenient excuse and I think he may be.

Also want feedback on this if people feel like it

I am in fact

so

blatantly townie that it sends attentive players into outright dismay and despair when they realize that. Many fingernails were chewed in the making of this game.

[Vivax]

Spoiler:

Finally, some thoughts on what Vivax has done in this thread:
- I like this post:

Spoiler: quote

Nooo Fidget

I've waited 24 hours to say this so it hits a little less hard now, but to any pals from my PT who are reading and Gamma, that CSF flip was an emotional rollercoaster hahaha.

p-edit: lol Enchant wait till you see our PT

Our order of lims and deaths was
Day 1 -> NAHA
Night 1 -> Loki/Freedom
Day 2 -> CSF
Night 2 -> Fidget

Yeah
Pretty sure Vivax is town based on both NAHA and CSF going after Toog

Before I head out I'd like to add that the conclusion is correct, but it's also an easy type of post to make as mafia. You should be more wary of scum bussing so this feels like it lacks paranoia about my slot and just echoes the sentiment of the last page.
In other words, you go to toast pile for it.

- There are

a lot

of jokes in his ISO. Initially I wanted to make a list of all his posts that were jokes but I gave up.

-

Sussed ejjinami for that post about the Mafia PT. I still think this ought to be slightly +town, much to my dismay

Spoiler:

- Pushes Gamma then says "next time you're town and I call you mafia don't overreact like this", then I ask him if he agrees Gamma and I are town, he says he has to think about it. Maybe playstyle, but eh, maybe there's a bit of inconsistency there
- "Apparently Enchant floats the notion that there's 2 confirmed town [...] I don't know who he means exactly" oof not sure I buy this in retrospect
- "Will compromise with people willing to compromise" followed by RR vote: I didn't say this but this did strike me as possibly scummy at the time.
- I don't want to look at the discussion we had about "undigging that discussion with the two PTs" again because I am still not sure I understand
- He starts by saying JohnnyFarrar seems scummy, at some point he "wrote off" Johnny as a scumread but it's not clear why

Maybe the best way to summarise my thoughts is that it's not clear he is trying to solve the game. I understand he has explained this with not wanting to effort / not wanting to overthink it, but at some point I have to assess whether he's using this as a convenient excuse and I think he may be.

Also want feedback on this if people feel like it

I am in fact

so

blatantly townie that it sends attentive players into outright dismay and despair when they realize that. Many fingernails were chewed in the making of this game.

Typical scum overbrag.

Town doesn’t have to brag.

Town just is.

Truly spoken like someone who doesn't care how I play as either alignment.
We can add that to the reasons that make you mafia: You are implying to know meta about me that you don't.
I will quote a post of mine from a recent town game on mafia universe, and there are many more instances of my confident writing as town around:

Spoiler:

This game is like talking to a wall for a big part. Maybe it's community specific but I hope not, only few players play reactive and engaging enough for my taste. Probably there's a few beginners in here too, I could think of ZZ because he's a very shy poster (shy and yes, mafia) who got protected by niph for reasons unknown to me, but I don't think niph is mafia.

There's like a bunch of weird circles that almost only talk to each other: The usual swedish triad, then beagle and enix seem to know each other somewhat, but I wouldn't say they only talk between themselves.
Hard to say where kuro fits, but gave me a honest impression he's looking at the right places.

I don't know where to place aphelios, but from a cursory look at other games, they always play like this, just posting more.

If I had to pick three people I'd trust the most purely tone wise (even though Beagle gave me a few hmmm moments), it'd be kuro, Beagle and cape90.
I'll probably try to vote with them if no one sees how Zug and Swedish are mafia further on.

Penguin so far was the most receptive of the three, so I'd be open to voting the other two today. Would be good play considering Zergon died.

[another player's quote, then I answer to them]

I tend to start off the games like that, it's more or less my town character (you could call it being arrogant or being a pompous arse, either is fine, and I agree).

I could see why someone could take it..personally when playing with me for the first time. To me it's just part of the joke when getting into character for the game, also tends to make mafia evasive or dismissive towards me, while townies could get triggered, which also would tell me they are town.
I build in the occasional joke to make it clear...No, I'm not angry (but the mafia can think that).

You could look at how Beagle handled it vs Skumbag. Skumbag just flat out refused to answer some questions about his Egix scumread, because he knows he can as nobody besides me is pressuring him on expanding on that.

Beagle on the other hand fell out of character to try to convince me that Skumbag towntelled (to which I disagree), and when faced with adversity, said I was trying to be difficult (also correct), but he remained calm and that didn't change his read on me. I read that as townie. I'd probably also read it as townie if someone called me a pompous arse in response to a provocation fwiw.

Need to run off to work. Hope to see some more activity on the return.

[Vivax]

I'm almost embarrassed at myself for going into self-meta from a patently false statement that town doesn't have to brag. Many players love to brag about their performance and that doesn't make them mafia.

[Vivax]

I'm almost embarrassed at myself for going into self-meta from a patently false statement that town doesn't have to brag. Many players love to brag about their performance and that doesn't make them mafia.

Scum over brag.

Not that town doesn’t.

Averaging down now are we

[Vivax]

I'm quite disappointed that I can't find a waving flag of Pi.gif to characterize your...flexibility in your convictions to not call it another way. But all I run into on google is polyamory flags. Maybe that's your gimmick though, because you're just trying to pocket everyone in the game.

[Vivax]

*crickets*

[Vivax]

I'm sorry mathblade. Making you run in circles was fun, but to be completely honest, your slot was doomed from the start and making you sub in was pure cruelty. I cannot stand this damning silence any longer, and I am afraid that the overexertion from having to deal with me might be morally questionable, even though you are confirmed mafia.
I will grant you a mercy kill here so you may recover in peace.

We could have avoided a lot of this if you just read my ISO, and paid attention to what Aisa had spoilered in her posts on ejjnami:

Spoiler:

I have no idea who I'd want as a leader just looking at the player list. From what I'd guess though, we want to elect consensus town reads who are also good at reading others, since it looks like we'll have to rely on them to make choices in future events.

so where's your vote for me?

I don't know you.

It’s not Hectic’s alt. What more do you need to know?

idk why but TOWN

This one was a town spew. Peng elim was bad in hindsight. Judging by beginning, CSF and NAHL (reminder:the mafia) were preferentially interacting a good amount with each other which is uncommon from my experience, so not easy catches.

Ahahahahahhaah the link to the mafia chat has been removed from the OP
Dammit, I was gonna start by saying that that I’m disappointed by it not being a rick-roll XD
it’s not like anything changes anyway

Welp, rip

Really? The mafia chat was in the OP and nami was in it and still played the game? Maybe we should talk about that before I go on. Now I feel stupid for sussing GE when we can just vote nami and win the game.

Currently, thinking about Roden and cat scratch

as well (irony)

(that’s a pretty common opinion)
(wouldn’t rush it)
I wouldn’t mind nominating myself either just because the leader role sounds goddamn cool XD
but like, if I were to be honest- my read accuracy on MS was never much above rand :/
so yeah…
I recognize that I’m just acting illogical

I don't actually consider myself trustable

Oh okay then.

VOTE: ejjinami

That's it?That's the joke?Mafia got outed by the OP and ejjnami is playing along like this? Bruh

This was the pyre, and Aisa just brought the torch.
Reminder:

There are a lot of jokes in his ISO. Initially I wanted to make a list of all his posts that were jokes but I gave up.

You are a victim of this game, mathblade. This is actually an episode of candid camera and everyone knew you were mafia from the start. The predecessor to your slot knew this, look at my quotes in the spoilers, then look at this, bolded and understriked:

Spoiler:

I mean, I'm assuming everything people are saying in terms of reads are just very mild, not locktown level.. I think you're fine!! lol wait
@ejjinami, do you not like people voicing their reads in the moment? like, you just straight to the conclusion... a comment on post 7 of a game is a lock town read? idk, it just feels like you're trying to pick apart the little things, as get us not trusting the people who you know are gonna be the most obv town or something... idk, feels weird, I think 47 was in the posts of yours I gave up on, or I'd have commented at the time.

oh and Aisa is giving me bad vibes tho that's most likely becuase of their playstyle, not necessarily alignment

frankly, this feels like one of those games where I'll need several days just to get to know the players personally before trying to determine anything

ahhh there we go... that "hidden agenda" behind yelling at Aisa over a "lock town read on post 7" on a real note though, can we please not play the game like "Bad vibes here!!! cuz playstyle, but bad vibes!!!" like, I could definitely say the same about you right now, I can't stand your playstyle, but, I'm reading your posts.. like, where you said you'd heal csf/roden like, they haven't done too much this game, you went after Aisa for TRing Roden for one of their like only posts thus far yet you also TR that same post so why?? like, if you TR the same person as Aisa. and that person has 1 post.. yet you just said there was no way Aisa could TR Roden off that 1 post.. there's no new content.. it's still just that 1 post..

holy fuck just kill me

it seriously feels like you’re focusing on me solely because you’re in a state of emotional excitement
read my posts again, please. Half of what you’re talking about can be deduced easily
the other half is just simply a misunderstanding of what I’m writing
Emotional misunderstandings are generally townie but holy damn I seriously hope I was wrong about the leader mechanics

my initial reads are too weak to explain. Treat them as non-existent or just vote me when you have the opportunity to do so
What I meant by “I think their personality is just pinging me” – is that I may be getting pinged by something that’s totally normal for them. That’s a way of me saying- I notice the ping and consider it NAI.

Ejjnami knew they were outed but still played along for the sake of the game. This is one instance where they were like 'Bruh stop pushing me just kill me already we know how it is'.
I applaud your efforts to stay alive, but we're not allowing a single more ML in this town. Your scum play is admirable, I will say. It was an honour to play with you.

[Vivax]

You’re literally pulling a “confidence” con.

Not gonna lie that sounds pretty nice for myself if I were.

[Vivax]

Gg sorry this was so pretty low effort for me

Nice try Vivax you did really good. You’d be really formidable in a non replacement game.

Thanks. I had fun writing absolutely ridiculous things.

[Vivax]

Yeah overall very enjoyable players to be around.

Spoiler:

Vivax - substituting in and having to play solo scum is my worst nightmare brrr well played (I know you were not initially solo, but whatever, close enough)

It was funny as hell to me I have to say (the benefit of not being heavily invested). Getting serious replies from MB to (what seemed to me like) obvious troll accusations made me randomly burst out laughing in everyday situations and friends were wondering what the hell was wrong with me. I guess I can thank Ench and Aisa for not just instant hammering me, and MB eventually realized I was just dropping jokes with a serious face.

Hardest part was figuring out the game mechanics in retrospect. And I guess ejjnami replaced out because they saw the mafia team in the host link or something, at least it looked a bit that way.

[Vivax]

I actually didn’t.

I knew it was some kind of something. I thought you maybe were newb scum that didn’t know how to be sussed.

I was legit scared until the flip.

But I am on the spectrum so yeah. I knew something was off and thought you were scum but was paranoid of Johnny.

They were serious because I didn’t realize you were trolling.

It's kind of the hard part of a text based game like forum mafia. The tone is analogous to the frequency of the message you have to get right, and we all project our own assumptions into it depending on the intent we expect from the other player.
If you read my posts pretending I'm something like the Riddler cornered and talking to Batman, you will get the intention behind the posts and why I had so much fun writing them.