Newbie 1988 | Octopus | Over

[Ph0enix]

@Phoenix, who would you like to lynch this dp?

You gotta be kidding me.

[Ph0enix]

What wagon from which game prompted this change in views? Is this the first game where you have decided that early wagons are valuable?

1976 started with a very early wagon and it's what got the game going. Granted, I was not there when it happened as I replaced, but still, form a Town POV I think Town managed to gain information from that.

Elaborate.

It led to Norway accusing Map for his post he made when he joined the wagon.
Norway's push led to people questioning him.
Which led to an exchange between the players.
Which led to post 75 in that game.
Which led to GBJ's questionable vote on Norway.
Norway's post during that time regarding the events above made people TR him.
etc...

[LuckyLuciano]

Spoiler:

I am wondering, actually. Why is this the case?

Why is what the case? The phrasing confused me here.

Why is it that,

If you accuse me of being scum right out of the gate without providing reasoning and just simply claiming it, I'm voting you and you should not wonder why I'm voting you. Period.

If you think it needs explaining in the first place, I can't possibly explain it to you.

Why don't you try?

Answering questions for other people, or derailing those questions before they are answered, does not help the town.

Such questions won't help much, either.

If you think so, then perhaps if you really are town you should sit on the sideline and let more experienced town find the scum.

[LuckyLuciano]

@Phoenix, who would you like to lynch this dp?

You gotta be kidding me.

@Phoenix, who would you like to lynch this dp?

[LuckyLuciano]

What wagon from which game prompted this change in views? Is this the first game where you have decided that early wagons are valuable?

1976 started with a very early wagon and it's what got the game going. Granted, I was not there when it happened as I replaced, but still, form a Town POV I think Town managed to gain information from that.

Elaborate.

It led to Norway accusing Map for his post he made when he joined the wagon.
Norway's push led to people questioning him.
Which led to an exchange between the players.
Which led to post 75 in that game.
Which led to GBJ's questionable vote on Norway.
Norway's post during that time regarding the events above made people TR him.
etc...

This chain of events literally lead to a mislynch on DP1. You stated in a prior game that you dislike wagons because new players mishandle them and get misread as scum. And you are now citing a wagon, which was mishandled by a new player, which then led to that new player being lynched, as your inspiration for changing your views. Am I reading this correctly?

[Ph0enix]

This chain of events literally lead to a mislynch on DP1. You stated in a prior game that you dislike wagons because new players mishandle them and get misread as scum. And you are now citing a wagon, which was mishandled by a new player, which then led to that new player being lynched, as your inspiration for changing your views. Am I reading this correctly?

What sealed GBJ's fate that day had nothing to do with the fact that he was at L-2 before he even showed up. Seemingly, he couldn't care less about that. His reaction to another post is what escalated to an eventual lynch, nothing to do with the wagon itself. His vote was followed by: "the first sentence is sus to me because it seems sus"
And it started there. He did not mishandle the wagon.

[Ph0enix]

@Phoenix, who would you like to lynch this dp?

You gotta be kidding me.

@Phoenix, who would you like to lynch this dp?

As of now, the one asking the question.

[LuckyLuciano]

Do you still believe that new players could make mistakes when facing a wagon on them that causes them to be misread as scum?

Do you believe that town can establish town cred without wagoning new players and putting them under the sort of pressure that, as you stated, could cause them to make mistakes and be misread as scum?

What is the value of town cred anyway?

[LuckyLuciano]

@Phoenix, who would you like to lynch this dp?

You gotta be kidding me.

@Phoenix, who would you like to lynch this dp?

As of now, the one asking the question.

Why?

[LuckyLuciano]

In addition, if for some reason the moderator intervened and said I could not be lynched this dp, who would you lynch in my stead?

[Ph0enix]

Do you still believe that new players could make mistakes when facing a wagon on them that causes them to be misread as scum?

Do you believe that town can establish town cred without wagoning new players and putting them under the sort of pressure that, as you stated, could cause them to make mistakes and be misread as scum?

What is the value of town cred anyway?

Mistakes, probably. Harsh enough to be seen as scum? Not so sure.
I don't know.
Rephrase the question, please.

[Ph0enix]

As of now, the one asking the question.

Why?

I'm not particularly fond of your push on me.

In addition, if for some reason the moderator intervened and said I could not be lynched this dp, who would you lynch in my stead?

I don't know.

[LuckyLuciano]

Do you still believe that new players could make mistakes when facing a wagon on them that causes them to be misread as scum?

Do you believe that town can establish town cred without wagoning new players and putting them under the sort of pressure that, as you stated, could cause them to make mistakes and be misread as scum?

What is the value of town cred anyway?

Mistakes, probably. Harsh enough to be seen as scum? Not so sure.
I don't know.
Rephrase the question, please.

[/quote]

How do you define town cred, and why is it an important concept?

As of now, the one asking the question.

Why?

I'm not particularly fond of your push on me.

Are you not fond of the fact that I made a push on you, or about the details of the push?

In addition, if for some reason the moderator intervened and said I could not be lynched this dp, who would you lynch in my stead?

I don't know.

With what have we, 8ish days played and 360 posts made, the only thing that has happened thus far that has sparked any desire for a lynch as the day draws closer to its end is the fact that somebody thinks you are mafia? Nothing else has caught your eye? Nothing else stands out to you?

[LuckyLuciano]

I'm going to fix up that last post.

Do you still believe that new players could make mistakes when facing a wagon on them that causes them to be misread as scum?

Do you believe that town can establish town cred without wagoning new players and putting them under the sort of pressure that, as you stated, could cause them to make mistakes and be misread as scum?

What is the value of town cred anyway?

Mistakes, probably. Harsh enough to be seen as scum? Not so sure.
I don't know.
Rephrase the question, please.

How do you define town cred, and why is it an important concept?

As of now, the one asking the question.

Why?

I'm not particularly fond of your push on me.

Are you not fond of the fact that I made a push on you, or about the details of the push?

In addition, if for some reason the moderator intervened and said I could not be lynched this dp, who would you lynch in my stead?

I don't know.

With what have we, 8ish days played and 360 posts made, the only thing that has happened thus far that has sparked any desire for a lynch as the day draws closer to its end is the fact that somebody thinks you are mafia? Nothing else has caught your eye? Nothing else stands out to you?[/quote]

[LuckyLuciano]

@Phoenix, if you could address this, that would be great.

Spoiler:

I am wondering, actually. Why is this the case?

Why is what the case? The phrasing confused me here.

Why is it that,

If you accuse me of being scum right out of the gate without providing reasoning and just simply claiming it, I'm voting you and you should not wonder why I'm voting you. Period.

If you think it needs explaining in the first place, I can't possibly explain it to you.

Why don't you try?

[Ph0enix]

Spoiler:

I am wondering, actually. Why is this the case?

Why is what the case? The phrasing confused me here.

Why is it that,

If you accuse me of being scum right out of the gate without providing reasoning and just simply claiming it, I'm voting you and you should not wonder why I'm voting you. Period.

If you think it needs explaining in the first place, I can't possibly explain it to you.

Why don't you try?

1）You are Town and do this to get a reaction:
Scenario A) I ignore the vote and don't make much of it
Scenario B) I do what I did and vote you

So scenario A is NAI and scenario B can easily be misinterpreted, so I wouldn't rely on it, either.

2) You are Scum:
Scenario A) I ignore the vote and don't make much of it
Scenario B) I do what I did and vote you

Scenario 2 is still NAI, scenario B gives you a reason to start a push on me.

So you either gain no information, or start a push on me because of me voting you. I think there's better ways to gain information and judge someone than this one.

"If you think so, then perhaps if you really are town you should sit on the sideline and let more experienced town find the scum."
Are you referring to yourself here?

[Ph0enix]

"How do you define town cred, and why is it an important concept?"

Pass.

"With what have we, 8ish days played and 360 posts made, the only thing that has happened thus far that has sparked any desire for a lynch as the day draws closer to its end is the fact that somebody thinks you are mafia? Nothing else has caught your eye? Nothing else stands out to you?"

I'm a fan of NL instead of random lynch, so if I don't have enough information, which I don't, imo, I'd rather abstain.

"Are you not fond of the fact that I made a push on you, or about the details of the push?"

The latter. I don't mind people calling me out on my bullshit. There's not much for you to call me out on, that's the point.

[Ph0enix]

Did I miss anything?

[LuckyLuciano]

Spoiler:

I am wondering, actually. Why is this the case?

Why is what the case? The phrasing confused me here.

Why is it that,

If you accuse me of being scum right out of the gate without providing reasoning and just simply claiming it, I'm voting you and you should not wonder why I'm voting you. Period.

If you think it needs explaining in the first place, I can't possibly explain it to you.

Why don't you try?

1）You are Town and do this to get a reaction:
Scenario A) I ignore the vote and don't make much of it
Scenario B) I do what I did and vote you

So scenario A is NAI and scenario B can easily be misinterpreted, so I wouldn't rely on it, either.

2) You are Scum:
Scenario A) I ignore the vote and don't make much of it
Scenario B) I do what I did and vote you

Scenario 2 is still NAI, scenario B gives you a reason to start a push on me.

So you either gain no information, or start a push on me because of me voting you. I think there's better ways to gain information and judge someone than this one.

"If you think so, then perhaps if you really are town you should sit on the sideline and let more experienced town find the scum."
Are you referring to yourself here?

First off, I didn't vote you, I just said you were scum without context in 228. Second, if I gain no information from a reaction test, that does mean the reaction test isn't worth trying. However, I do think your reaction is very curious. Are you claiming that you reacted by voting me as a reaction test to see if I would vote you back? Further, why do you care if somebody thinks you are scum?

[LuckyLuciano]

"How do you define town cred, and why is it an important concept?"

Pass.

Why? How does not answering this question benefit the town?

"With what have we, 8ish days played and 360 posts made, the only thing that has happened thus far that has sparked any desire for a lynch as the day draws closer to its end is the fact that somebody thinks you are mafia? Nothing else has caught your eye? Nothing else stands out to you?"

I'm a fan of NL instead of random lynch, so if I don't have enough information, which I don't, imo, I'd rather abstain.

We only discovered recently that an extension was being granted. At what point were you planning to advocate a no lynch? In particular, when Titus moved their vote to Cheeky, putting her at L-1, in 307, you questioned the motive. When she stated it was due to the deadline, why did you not begin advocating a no lynch?

"Are you not fond of the fact that I made a push on you, or about the details of the push?"

The latter. I don't mind people calling me out on my bullshit. There's not much for you to call me out on, that's the point.

Is your vote on me because my reasoning is incorrect, or because it feels artificial?

[Ph0enix]

First off, I didn't vote you, I just said you were scum without context in 228. Second, if I gain no information from a reaction test, that does mean the reaction test isn't worth trying. However, I do think your reaction is very curious. Are you claiming that you reacted by voting me as a reaction test to see if I would vote you back? Further, why do you care if somebody thinks you are scum?

I did wrote "ignore the vote" in the previous post, my bad.

What, no? I did because if you make such a reaction test, as I pointed out in a previous post in 2/4 scenarios you gain no information and in the other 2/4 scenarios you gain information which can be easily misinterpreted if you're Town and used as a straight up reason for a vote if you're scum. All in all, I see more value in the reaction test from a scum POV.

It's not that you think I'm scum, it's that you're making a push on me with questionable reasoning.

[LuckyLuciano]

First off, I didn't vote you, I just said you were scum without context in 228. Second, if I gain no information from a reaction test, that does mean the reaction test isn't worth trying. However, I do think your reaction is very curious. Are you claiming that you reacted by voting me as a reaction test to see if I would vote you back? Further, why do you care if somebody thinks you are scum?

I did wrote "ignore the vote" in the previous post, my bad.

What, no? I did because if you make such a reaction test, as I pointed out in a previous post in 2/4 scenarios you gain no information and in the other 2/4 scenarios you gain information which can be easily misinterpreted if you're Town and used as a straight up reason for a vote if you're scum. All in all, I see more value in the reaction test from a scum POV.

It's not that you think I'm scum, it's that you're making a push on me with questionable reasoning.

Is it questionable to think that a player might be scum because they take a course of action that contradicts how they claimed to play the game as town in the past? I understand that you are claiming you have changed your views on early wagons, but do you really believe that finding such a change in behavior suspicious is questionable?

[Ph0enix]

"Why? How does not answering this question benefit the town?"

How does it do? And quite frankly, it is such a broad question that I don't know what answer you expect.

"We only discovered recently that an extension was being granted. At what point were you planning to advocate a no lynch? In particular, when Titus moved their vote to Cheeky, putting her at L-1, in 307, you questioned the motive. When she stated it was due to the deadline, why did you not begin advocating a no lynch?"

Should've been more clear, I meant NL on my part, as in, me not voting, not no lynching in general.

"Is your vote on me because my reasoning is incorrect, or because it feels artificial?"

The former. What do you mean by artificial?

[Ph0enix]

Is it questionable to think that a player might be scum because they take a course of action that contradicts how they claimed to play the game as town in the past? I understand that you are claiming you have changed your views on early wagons, but do you really believe that finding such a change in behavior suspicious is questionable?

Given the fact that said player does not have a defined style of play and you are judging off of two games alone, yes.

[Ph0enix]

yoink -1