Mini Normal 2169 : random facts, game over !

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Spoiler: eng

If you guys are tying my boat^{would maybe be more likely to say wagon here than boat}

with

to Noraa and Shelly I don't feel too bad. It's not great but there's slots I have a deeper distrust ^of than those. I'm fine with it I guess. Let's see where my gut

s

leads me

to

.

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Oh yay ffs it’s another 15 pages!

just skip it and tell me where your head's at

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it was really just that like, when I was reading your posts up to that point nothing really jumped out at me as town? like it all seemed relatively safe, I honestly thought you town reading me as early as 149 or whenever it was was a little off and just being totally honest with myself I couldn't put you higher than null

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I don't really have any interest in flipping you but it's like, as of that point you hadn't showed me enough comparative to the people I was town reading/leaning for me to justify including you in that category by that point

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@bunno propositions are really fucking tricky in like every language and I'm p sure they only come from usage

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rip, even I am a victim

*prepositions

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I don’t get the Shelley pus

okay, so let's talk about this

what are you seeing in shelly that's townie?

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I really want to organise a game or play in a game played in Spanish but I haven't been able to get it together to organise it, to see what it's like having to negotiate the language as well as the just natural difficulties that arise from knowing some people are intentionally lying to you

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I guess I feel like I’m reading a 5000 page deconstructivist novel and the girth is obscuring how little is actually happening? I want to explore the yellow guys Taylor push.

The only think I’m pretty severely confident on is town Ico.

Pedit: it’s not that I think she’s town, it’s that I don’t see a reason she’s scum. There’s also things complicating my read there that I can’t discuss.

yeah this game has gone long already, I know I'm somewhat to blame for that, I'm basically just ignoring any posts that before I can come to post unless I see them in ISOs

okay, so first things first -- from whence cometh the confidence in town!ico?

secondly, why are you not reading shelly as scummy? what's your take on her fairly abruptly reversing her read on BM/noraa from TvS to TvT when it became apparent that that was the mood in the game/that people were beginning to come out in favour of that. and also of her kind-of-reversal-but-kind-of-not read on me, where she jumped to "maybe mena is scum" the second I started suspecting her/pressuring her, which I think is an odd reaction to one of your TRs putting pressure on you (as opposed to "huh, I wonder why my TR is wrong on me/what they're misreading, I should try to find out and set that straight")

thirdly, you've played with bunno before at least once

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Spoiler: eng

Looking back although my english is awkward I definitely improved a lot playing this game hmm...

Trivia fact is that I got around mafiascum.dot.com around 1 or 2 years earlier than my first account, but I couldn't understand english at all or type decently enough to be understood, so I ended up sh

inin

ying away from playing a game

also your English really isn't awkward at all and is very strong

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they're churros (which they've outed) but they've been around since before then on other alts

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we've all played together in a game before

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wait were you guys on the same team?

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oh right, for some reason I thought teacher was on the same team as skitt but I think I mixed her up with ofrhz

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1. what's your take on her fairly abruptly reversing her read on BM/noraa from TvS to TvT when it became apparent that that was the mood in the game/that people were beginning to come out in favour of that.

2. and also of her kind-of-reversal-but-kind-of-not read on me, where she jumped to "maybe mena is scum" the second I started suspecting her/pressuring her, which I think is an odd reaction to one of your TRs putting pressure on you (as opposed to "huh, I wonder why my TR is wrong on me/what they're misreading, I should try to find out and set that straight")

1. I’m still in the TVS camp here. But I guess I don’t get why Shelley is singled out for this? Like the temperature of the room was TVs. Then it evolved to tvt. So the entire room had to shift temperatures, ya? (This leads into ICo)

2. You did kind of go absentee. I was questioning my early lean too (but I always do).

I guess I can see the logic on both shifts.

(1) like, maybe? idk I'm not that interested in it atm, but shelly is being singled out because that was the one that most obviously felt to me like it was a readjustment of reads

in response to

the change in the feel of the room. it wasn't the same as someone new entering and just going "yeah, I've read this and I think it's TvT" it was a direct shift from her earlier position when she could see that would put her against the flow of the crowd

(2) dude, don't even. I had to wake up at 6am the day I got drunk (well, 6:15) to get to a meeting about not-exactly-VISA-but-more-or-less stuff at a police station an HOUR AND A HALF from where I live and my hangover kicked in /while I was waiting for the appointment/ then I didn't even get the thing I went there to do in the end bc ACAB, got home, barely napped, had to go to another appointment for a photo card for the metro network, then went to the big park here in Madrid and fell asleep, then got invited to a social thing which seeing as we're probably headed back into lockdown soon I decided to go to, then came home and my roomies wanted to watch an episode of dark together, then fell into a long and peaceful sleep

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It's weird...can't believe it's only been nine months...

It feels forever for me. Is that just a me thing or not?

no it defo feels weirdly long ago

fuck 2020

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okay, I used to be good at reading ico but now I feel like I have paranoia about him semi-regularly and I'm prob going through the same transition with him that I did with datisi (as in, too much pressure to be ~right~ on the read throwing off my ability to actually read him bc too worried about being wrong and losing the right to say I can read him) so I'll just defer to you/BM/bunno/dats and call him town for now

pedit: yeah, I didn't feel like you were, I just wanted to vent

who's on the shelly wagon? Taylor, me, datisi, TGP, bob

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2) dude, don't even

We good on this one. I wasn’t pushing, but I could understand a willingness to revisit your slot. As it seems you should from your “mysterious” thing with bunno

That’s basically it. Remind me who her wagon is?

this double post was a pretty 1337 move

okay, I'll see myself out

(no but really why am I still up I need to sleep good night world)

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Datisi why are you voting for teacher?

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fucked if I know

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below null but mostly bc I can't be fucked to do the effort of trying to re-evaluate your slot rn

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Datisi why are you voting for teacher?

he's a scumlean, i still think BM's more likely town than not, and the shelly wagon seems to be kinda dead/dying

pedit: mood

shelly wagon dying means... unvoting it and helping it to die is a good idea?

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Datisi why are you voting for teacher?

the bigger question is, why aren't you?

because I'd prefer we stop fucking around and just flip shelly

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we're already at 63 pages

let's stop the foreplay and find out what alignment she is

you were happy to declare intent yesterday why not now

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why is every town so fucking intransigent on the concept of just flipping a scummy slot early and insists instead on going to deadline every fucking time when there's literally concrete evidence that NOT doing that increases town winrates

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teacher you should vote shelly

@bunno I'll cut you a deal and we can do Taylor either way tomorrow if you vote shelly today right here right now, one time offer

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okay, I'm going to have a think about this but my initial impression is still that I don't think it's adding up, and that you're changing your reads to keep them inline with general trends in the gamestate and are having difficulty explaining how you established certain reads or are giving very vague answers which allow you avoid responsibility or elaborating on what you precisely believed at certain points

I think that's it in terms of questions for you rn, I don't think there's anything fruitful to ask you further and I think it will just spam the thread up

thanks for responding tho

bc of this @noraa

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shelly is scummy. she's been scummy, and she will continue to be scummy. the day is at 63 pages with plenty of content. worst case scenario we're losing a VT. at this point continuing to run the day long is not going to get us a whole lot of anything other than apathy and increased difficulty in sorting back through on later days

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okay, I'm going to have a think about this but my initial impression is still that I don't think it's adding up, and that you're changing your reads to keep them inline with general trends in the gamestate and are having difficulty explaining how you established certain reads or are giving very vague answers which allow you avoid responsibility or elaborating on what you precisely believed at certain points

I think that's it in terms of questions for you rn, I don't think there's anything fruitful to ask you further and I think it will just spam the thread up

thanks for responding tho

bc of this @noraa

i guarantee that even if you hadnt answered that, noraa would have found her way onto the shelly wagon. I caught her paving the way for it earlier with that coy "so you're at -2 huh?"

cool, I literally don't care so long as she votes shelly

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we're already at 63 pages

and how many of those pages are actually useful

as opposed to fluffy garbage and whatever BM and noraa are doing

like i'm not saying we need to put off any execution until 5 seconds before deadline because that is moronic, but i'd also like ~more~ before we end the day (at 4 days left?) because even if shelly does flip scum, tomorrow is gonna be more of a headache

enough

why

why do you want more

what is this obsession with always having to try to maximise every possible bit of content from every single game day

is there like literally ANY evidence that actually helps town win

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shelly is scummy. she's been scummy, and she will continue to be scummy. the day is at 63 pages with plenty of content. worst case scenario we're losing a VT. at this point continuing to run the day long is not going to get us a whole lot of anything other than apathy and increased difficulty in sorting back through on later days

i disagree and will not discuss it further. i'm not being browbeaten into flipping shelly now. we're running up teacher.

no, we're fucking not, we're flipping shelly

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okay, I'm going to have a think about this but my initial impression is still that I don't think it's adding up, and that you're changing your reads to keep them inline with general trends in the gamestate and are having difficulty explaining how you established certain reads or are giving very vague answers which allow you avoid responsibility or elaborating on what you precisely believed at certain points

I think that's it in terms of questions for you rn, I don't think there's anything fruitful to ask you further and I think it will just spam the thread up

thanks for responding tho

bc of this @noraa

well I mean ... shelly's landed scum like 7 games out of 10 or something. Her playstyle ending up being like this isn't particularly surprising if you ask me. Play too many scumgames and u start looking scummy as hell when ur in a town game.

THAT'S NOT A REASON TO TOWNREAD HER JFC

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one explanation: shelly's towngame looks like her scumgame because she's rolled scum a lot

second explanation: SHE'S LITERALLY JUST SCUM AGAIN

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teacher you should vote shelly

@bunno I'll cut you a deal and we can do Taylor either way tomorrow if you vote shelly today right here right now, one time offer

why are you so desperate to protect teacher again? you havent said much about him so far, so this is odd?

blah blah blah, I don't give a shit about teacher rn beyond whether or not he's gonna vote shelly for me

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if we flip shelly and she's town and we flip teacher later and he's scum I'll die too

rn i don't really care, and I frankly don't give a fuck if this looks like I'm protecting teacher or not

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WHAT ARE YOU ON FAM

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like are you serious rn

"she claimed VT so she's not a good flip"

are you high

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I'll calm down when you put your vote back on shelly

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and when BM stops chatting shit about how we shouldn't be flipping a VT claim

here's an idea

if shelly /is/ VT then all we lose is VT

wagoning someone else at this point is fucking dumb unless there are very strong reasons to think they're scum

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the second best option would be Taylor but WHY would we do that when shelly has already claimed and has not gotten any townier

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like are you serious rn

"she claimed VT so she's not a good flip"

are you high

I didn't say that lel

I'm talking to BM

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if we flip shelly and she's town and we flip teacher later and he's scum I'll die too

rn i don't really care, and I frankly don't give a fuck if this looks like I'm protecting teacher or not

your play here makes no sense. all your teacher-defence is doing is making me more convinced that we should elim teacher.

blah blah blah

okay go off and have fun trying to build your teacher wagon then

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one explanation: shelly's towngame looks like her scumgame because she's rolled scum a lot

second explanation: SHE'S LITERALLY JUST SCUM AGAIN

ur evidence is weak tho. u have nothing on her except her playstyle and that's literally how she is every single round. get some solid evidence and I'll sheep this vote.

yes, changing your reads because you perceive the game state is changing and that your position is about to become unpopular is so towny

yes, town reading someone and then IMMEDIATELY flipping that the second they start doubting you is towny

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the second best option would be Taylor but WHY would we do that when shelly has already claimed and has not gotten any townier

the whole point of getting a claim is being able to make a judgement on whether you believe it.

i asked for a claim
i got a claim
i was happy that the claim was good enough to buy her another day

that's the game buddy

no, that's moronic

you ask for the claim to avoid hitting a PR

that's literally it

if the person is scummy enough to need to claim you kill them unless they claim PR in which case you weigh if it's likely to be true or not then decide if it's worth wagoning anyone else

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yeah, scum don't have enough of an information advantage BM, you're right, let's give them more knowledge on the setup

what a brilliant idea

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wow such great townplay you're so smart

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get the fuck outta here with that BS

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i seriously think if taylor or shelly are scum, it doesnt matter one jot if we flip them today. if both are scum, i think town is winning this game regardless, so who cares? let's flip teacher and be done with it.

what are you even saying lmao

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yes preserving slots that are scummy is such high equity for town winning games

are you just scum

like how the fuck can any town player have ideas this just blatantly scum sided about how to play

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please don't

vote shelly

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please don't

vote shelly

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I'm not fucking around rn

vote shelly and lets get this show on the road

we're not fucking around with a whole new wagon for some weak ass reasons just bc BM has a fetish for needing all the attention to be on him

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the second best option would be Taylor but WHY would we do that when shelly has already claimed and has not gotten any townier

the whole point of getting a claim is being able to make a judgement on whether you believe it.

i asked for a claim
i got a claim
i was happy that the claim was good enough to buy her another day

that's the game buddy

no, that's moronic

you ask for the claim to avoid hitting a PR

that's literally it

if the person is scummy enough to need to claim you kill them unless they claim PR in which case you weigh if it's likely to be true or not then decide if it's worth wagoning anyone else

you're saying anyone who claims vanilla, you auto-flip? bloody hell dude lol

maybe i'm playing this game on another level or something, where we actually use deduction and take account of all available info.

say something useful or stop talking

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i seriously think if taylor or shelly are scum, it doesnt matter one jot if we flip them today. if both are scum, i think town is winning this game regardless, so who cares? let's flip teacher and be done with it.

what are you even saying lmao

dude stop posturing and vote teacher. when he flips scum, you can still get some towncred if you jump on board now.

we're not doing your vanity wagon so if you actually have any interest in helping town then get on shelly who YOU LITERALLY DECLARED INTENT ON YESTERDAY EVENING

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where the fuck are all of the other players rn who don't make me want to smash my face against my desk

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I'm not fucking around rn

vote shelly and lets get this show on the road

we're not fucking around with a whole new wagon for some weak ass reasons just bc BM has a fetish for needing all the attention to be on him

haha you can swear and throw a tantrum all you want mate - the game is mafia, and we're trying to use the time we have to find out who is scum.

Simple!

Get on board with the VOTE: teacher, or get off here

cute when you've got 2 votes and I've got 4 but keep trying diddums

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I'm sowwy no-one wants to vote ur Likkle wagon

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*cry 4 BM and his inability to get the flips he wants, boo hoo

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if you can't see how incredibly antitown you're being rn I can't help you

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if you'd like me to hydra with you to give you some pointers on how to play the game I can tho <3

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I'm not fucking around rn

vote shelly and lets get this show on the road

we're not fucking around with a whole new wagon for some weak ass reasons just bc BM has a fetish for needing all the attention to be on him

haha you can swear and throw a tantrum all you want mate - the game is mafia, and we're trying to use the time we have to find out who is scum.

Simple!

Get on board with the VOTE: teacher, or get off here

cute when you've got 2 votes and I've got 4 but keep trying diddums

you'll have to explain to me again why you seem to be happy with any wagon other than teacher?

could it be....?

yes, I'm happy with any other wagon, that's why I've been trying to get shelly flipped for literally 3 days

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that's an accurate portrayal of reality, well done BM

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this... is genuinely making me sad.

then vote shelly

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I think it's pretty obvious that BM is actively trying to push my buttons to make me say something that will get me banned/force repped and I think that's super fucking scummy incidentally as well as just bad sportsmanship

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if you can't see how incredibly antitown you're being rn I can't help you

you'll have to explain it to me. as far as i'm concerned, we were doing analysis of who to elim, you showed up and spammed up the thread with:

"look at me, i want to elim shelly still because i cant get over the fact my wagon diminished"

i'm definitely doing the protown thing by creating some balance here, so town doesnt get completely railroaded.

no, you're not

you're trying to move away from a scummy slot that IN THE WORST CASE SCENARIO FLIPS VT

in order to run up a fairly null-to-town slot and to get additional claims and to give additional information to scum

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I'm not going offline and I'm not going to let BM try to take control of the gamestate by outposting me

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Declaring intent on someone that you agree just has a scummy playstyle screams fishing for prs. Mena join me on the bm wagon.

if BM is scum why is he so invested in derailing shelly wagon now that she's claimed? could it be because perhaps *checks notes* they're partners?

*surprised pikachu face*
if you want a BM flip noraa, the best way to get it is flipping shelly!scum and then BM will be a lot easier to flip tomorrow

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please i'm just asking you both to stop

like this isn't productive this is just gonna get someone banned

please just stop

no, I don't think I've said anything out of line or harassing and I don't think BM has said anything along those lines to me

he's a scumfuck or he's actively antitown but I don't think anything rule breaking is happening here

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that's an accurate portrayal of reality, well done BM

dude what is this? i dont even understand your obsession with flipping shelly/not flipping teacher? it's NAGL

what does NAGL even mean

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that's an accurate portrayal of reality, well done BM

dude what is this? i dont even understand your obsession with flipping shelly/not flipping teacher? it's NAGL

this was in response to you saying that I want any wagon other than teacher

which is blatantly untrue, I want the same wagon I've been advocating for for the last 3 days

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Declaring intent on someone that you agree just has a scummy playstyle screams fishing for prs. Mena join me on the bm wagon.

if BM is scum why is he so invested in derailing shelly wagon now that she's claimed? could it be because perhaps *checks notes* they're partners?

*surprised pikachu face*
if you want a BM flip noraa, the best way to get it is flipping shelly!scum and then BM will be a lot easier to flip tomorrow

shelly's a null for me rn and I don't wish to flip her

half the time scum are in your null reads

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I'll railroad this town into a win, which is the direction we're going in by flipping shelly

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tell you what BM, vote shelly rn and keep your vote there until the end of day and if I'm wrong I'll sheep you for the next two days no questions asked

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But shelly's play style is just like that. I haven't see anything AI for her yet

I have read shelly's towngame and her scumgame

her making shit up and flitting around to suit the way the wind is blowing is DEFINITELY evidence of her scumgame

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tell you what BM, vote shelly rn and keep your vote there until the end of day and if I'm wrong I'll sheep you for the next two days no questions asked

if you're so sure on teacher scum take me up on this

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vote shelly and I'll go to bed


why are you suddenly so reluctant to vote someone you were supposedly scum reading for multiple RL days

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if you're town, you're not playing in town's interest by stopping discussion and removing any opportunity for people to give their views and opinions (which is the basis for determining their alignment).

we have had

63 PAGES

of this


it's time to end the day

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case on teacher is literally nonexistent it's just "teacher!scum provides a decent amount of information" when their interaction actually shows otherwise and like. they're a light scumlean if anything

townreading menal very hard rn i don't see this amount of lynch effort coming from scum trying to lynch a townie

Jesus Christ thank fuck you're here

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so basically you're saying that I didn't ask for town to do something useful and productive in a very nice way @datisi, and that's why you won't get on board with it

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why are you townreading shelly iaaun

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BM is trying to outpost me so that he can control the narrative and force a teacher guillo

I'm simply not allowing that to happen

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I'll hammer teacher if you can get him to L-1 tho BM

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it's still a terrible decision vs flipping shelly but whatever if it means ending the day

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and i suppose my general point that just elimming shelly because she claimed vanilla is dumb (i mean, i literally claimed vanilla on Page 1 and I'm still alive). and that it's in town's interests to let people form their own opinions.

shelly claimed because she was scummy and 6-7 people found her sufficiently scummy to want that claim

that scumminess didn't just evaporate because she claimed, and you trying to use her having claimed as a way to defend her/justify voting elsewhere is major partner equity because that is a classic scum move

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we're not liming her BECAUSE she claimed VT

we're liming her because VT wasn't a good enough reason to NOT lim her after how scummy she'd been up to that point

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bunno where the fuck are you

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I feel like TGP is the only person being reasonable rn in this entire PL

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in fairness to menal, i'm sure he was expecting everyone to just roll over instantly and wasn't aiming to be this conspicuous

no, actually I sadly have to yell at people despite trying to move away from that because apparently people don't respond to anything else

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I was fully expecting to yell at everyone about shelly because FOR SOME FUCKING REASON it is anathema to every fucking town on this site to end the day when it ought to be fucking ended and not drag it out until the last possible second

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and as much as Datisi can say that not ending it one day before isn't the alternative being proposed to ending it right now... that's what fucking happens isn't it? like nearly every time when town shits the pot and doesn't just get the elim done on the wagon everyone thought was scummy enough to elim halfway through the day

and there is 0 benefit to dragging it out. 0.

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But ending the day now isn't best either. You get me?

no, ending the day right now, tonight, is VERY MUCH the best possible thing we can do

there will be, I'm saying right now, no practical benefit whatsoever to ending the day one day before deadline and getting three more days of posting

there is already enough

end it now

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there is such a ridiculous fetish for running days out that I take advantage of again, and again, and again when I'm scum and then I call that out when I'm town and everyone goes "nO bUt wE nEeD to MaXiMiSe tHe InfOrMatIoN" and it just benefits scum

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Just read pages 64 -69

Is this all beer fuelled or something powdery?

I'm not on coke

I may have been drinking

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doesn't make me any less right in what I'm saying tho

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man, the shelly wagon was dead in the water anyway,

IT WAS STALLED BECAUSE IT'S ON SCUM

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Im fairly certain there is a scum within {shelly, ico}

if you're fairly certain there's scum in (shelly, icon) then why aren't you voting icon if you don't think shelly is scum????

and if you do think shelly has a good chance of being scum in that pairing, WHY WON'T YOU VOTE HER WITH ME

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Menal why is shelly scum besides her playstyle?

YOU CANNOT JUST JUSTIFY AWAY THE SCUMMY THINGS A PERSON DOES UNDER "WELL THAT'S THEIR PLAYSTYLE"

shelly adapting her reads to the gamestate instead of sticking to what she ACTUALLY thinks is scum behaviour!!!!!

shelly being reactive in how she reads someone instead of having any consistency in what she thinks someone's alignment is IS SCUMMY

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man, the shelly wagon was dead in the water anyway,

IT WAS STALLED BECAUSE IT'S ON SCUM

hang on...all the wagons have stalled.

have we nailed all 3 scum?

no, we have a wagon on scum and we have multiple abortive counter wagons to that scum, first on TGP, now on teacher

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Im fairly certain there is a scum within {shelly, ico}

if you're fairly certain there's scum in (shelly, icon) then why aren't you voting icon if you don't think shelly is scum????

and if you do think shelly has a good chance of being scum in that pairing, WHY WON'T YOU VOTE HER WITH ME

i feel bad for noraa in all of this. she is practically begging you to give her a reason to run shelly up. i can see it coming a mile off

Ico isn't getting clowned today obviously and I'm not positive shelly is the scum in that pool

surely if you are "fairly certain" that there's scum in there, and we flip shelly today and she's town, then that means you have achieved a high level of certainty on icon!scum, no? so how are you losing here exactly?

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there is such a ridiculous fetish for running days out that I take advantage of again, and again, and again when I'm scum and then I call that out when I'm town and everyone goes "nO bUt wE nEeD to MaXiMiSe tHe InfOrMatIoN" and it just benefits scum

absolutely not my experience dude, complete opposite actually!

I'm not talking about quick hammering someone one RL day into the game

once everyone has taken sufficient stances to get someone to intent then there is enough info to be going on

more info is just drowning the signal with noise

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man, the shelly wagon was dead in the water anyway,

IT WAS STALLED BECAUSE IT'S ON SCUM

hang on...all the wagons have stalled.

have we nailed all 3 scum?

no, we have a wagon on scum and we have multiple abortive counter wagons to that scum, first on TGP, now on teacher

curiously you forgot taylor?

I actually think Taylor might be scum tho

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that's okay; I'm cringing at your entire approach to this game

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Taylor vote shelly if you're town

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man, the shelly wagon was dead in the water anyway,

IT WAS STALLED BECAUSE IT'S ON SCUM

hang on...all the wagons have stalled.

have we nailed all 3 scum?

no, we have a wagon on scum and we have multiple abortive counter wagons to that scum, first on TGP, now on teacher

curiously you forgot taylor?

I actually think Taylor might be scum tho

anyone but teacher and TGP then? how convenient.

idk what you're trying to grasp at but it looks a lot like a cylindrical hollow object one might use to drink something with

[Menalque]

hang on ill vote in a minute but you guys spammed another 10 pages

there's not much of value there it's BM bitching about how we should flip teacher and me insisting that we flip shelly, and datisi telling us both to stop

[Menalque]

hang on ill vote in a minute but you guys spammed another 10 pages

ill repost my teacher case for you and alonzo (might be hard to find in amongst menalque's posts, but we try our best!)

bruh

you've made at least as many posts as I have this evening if not more

[Menalque]

Last ten pages was just Mena tunneling shelly for ??? reason

the reasons

have been

explained

to you

M U L T I P L E

T I M E S

[Menalque]

hang on ill vote in a minute but you guys spammed another 10 pages

there's not much of value there it's BM bitching about how we should flip teacher and me insisting that we flip shelly, and datisi telling us both to stop

bit unfair - i made an actual case on teacher. you just used caps to emphasise how much you dislike shelly

I don't need to repost my case on shelly over and over again and cases aren't any more accurate than not cases

[Menalque]

like I've given two strong reasons for shelly to be scum

I gave them much earlier

I've repeated them as part of all ~this~ more than once

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the fact that I didn't write out paragraphs of lovely beautiful prose doesn't make shelly less scum or those reasons any less compelling

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unlikely mate, you post more because im actually making some insightful remarks

lololololol

my post quality here has been significantly better than yours even if I've also been shitposting in between

granted the shitposts may have put me slightly over your number of posts now I think about it

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The teacher one is more trash obviously but I don't like the shelly one either

and yet

you're "fairly certain" that there is scum in {icon, shelly}

and you won't vote shelly

explain this to me

[Menalque]

you know how that can be avoided

hammering shelly tonight

[Menalque]

VOTE: noraa

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no offence, but i dont remember any quality posts from you

you maaaay wanna lay off a little on whatever it is that's giving you short term memory loss then! it's better for your health <3

[Menalque]

I'm fine with killing noraa at this point

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wait, I have something for this

[Menalque]

https://flic.kr/p/2jNdcYN

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yeah no prob, it was good

I think I'm off too

Spoiler:

don't think they'll ever realise we're partners after that episode!

[Menalque]

ahh the irony

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if you start pushing teacher again I'll start pushing shelly again

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ahh the irony

does this mean...what i think it means?

I have... no idea? what do you think it means?

[Menalque]

ahh the irony

does this mean...what i think it means?

I have... no idea? what do you think it means?

this:

if you start pushing teacher again I'll start pushing shelly again

oh, no, it meant more that I can't believe that after all that that Taylor then decided to turn up and fucking vote shelly mostly to get the thing to stop when that had already stopped

[Menalque]

VOTE: noraa

ugh menal please go back on shelly nora is annoying but it's a policy lim at that point

nah, I think it's actually super super scummy that noraa is so avoidant here

I think her reasons for avoiding it are weak ("it's just her play style") and I think her saying "likely one scum in shelly/icon, but I don't think icon is happening today" combined with not voting there is scummy -- like if you really believe that you solve another slot by flipping one, you flip the one you can get and then work off that information. I think noraa has

excellent

scum equity with shelly and even aside from that I don't think her reluctance to be involved here is from town (if she's not partners, I think she's just afraid of limping onto a town wagon late esp with BM calling her out for that so publicly)

and if she does flip scum, she gets me the cred I need to do shelly tomorrow

[Menalque]

and if your reluctance to vote a slot that would let you solve a dyad where you're supposedly confident scum is weren't so incredibly scummy, I'd be more worried about that

[Menalque]

TGP check out 1806

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On overall thoughts, I am happy elimming:

Teacher
TGP
Noora

Probably in that order of preference.

from my side this would be:

noraa
shelly
Taylor

also by order of preference

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jokes aside, what do you actually think about TGP alignment-wise?

I think he's prob town unless he's scum who's been actively trying to pocket me

I think the latter is maybe slightly more likely if noraa!scum given the way he's engaging me on getting back onto shelly now I'm pushing for noraa, but I'm not really interested in paranoiaing about this before a flip

[Menalque]

I don't really want to elim teacher but will hammer anyone at L-1 to end the day

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VOTE: shelly

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I think teacher is only at L-3 actually

[Menalque]

BM, Taylor, iauun, datisi

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yes, basically L-2 but again that's only if I can't get the votes back to do shelly

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no, I don't think he should claim until he's at actual, real L-1

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no, I'll allow claims

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I'm saying I will hammer anyone at L-1, not instahammer them

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hmmm

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daddy is back

[Menalque]

here's where we're at, depressingly

alonzo - town
icon
teacher - probtown
TGP
bob - maybe town?


iaaun - nullscummy
bunno, taylor - nullscummy but probably not scum together
datisi - scumpool
BM
noraa
shelly

[Menalque]

Hungover AF

surprisingly not!

[Menalque]

I think that if shelly is scum then there is a very, very good chance of the team being (datisi, BM, shelly) I think noraa is independently scummy

I dislike bunno's insistence on trying to force a compromise on Taylor instead of working with me on shelly, especially when shelly is a more viable wagon and I've offered to work with him tomorrow to do Taylor if I'm wrong

Taylor is still scummy but has been surpassed by other slots

iaaun I just think is mostly null and I think him limping in and joining the CW to shelly was bad

bob is just there because there are so many scummy slots this game that are worse than him

TGP has made me mildly paranoid that he's pocketing me despite my best intentions of avoiding it

teacher is probably town by virtue of being the CW to shelly

icon I think is just town at this point or he's working really really hard on pocketing me

alonzo is just very very town

[Menalque]

datisi - scumpool

?
are you about to call me scum with shelly
i feel like you are

yes, that's exactly what I think

[Menalque]

I think your weakly explained move onto teacher and away from shelly after a VT claim is very scum indicative for you

[Menalque]

I think BM looks worse than you, but I think you also look very bad. I think BM's positioning makes an incredible amount of sense as a partner for shelly. I think that if scum has a buddy getting wagoned in a relatively static way then if you just start pushing away from it you'll look very bad upon the flip of that slot. Therefore you need to (1) create distance and. (2) create something to excuse your action of trying to preserve your scumbuddy.

What BM did was exactly that: (1) threatened intent to try to create distance with shelly and then (2) used that as a justification for moving away from shelly despite giving very weak reasons for why he actually no longer thought she was scum, and to start a CW elsewhere.

[Menalque]

datisi didn't need to do something to actively create distance from shelly because she'd been voting her from an early point, but she also couldn't unvote early because she'd lose all the cred she'd get from the vote if she did. however as soon as there was an out she shifted onto a fluffy teacher wagon despite never providing compelling reasoning for why she no longer thought shelly was scum

[Menalque]

incidentally, this game is fucked

I think that I have like 1 solid TR which is alonzo, and that's never a good sign

[Menalque]

i'm still scumreading shelly

Datisi claims to be scum reading shelly. But datisi also uses her vote to actively support the counter wagon to shelly which is the best way to disperse a wagon. Datisi claims to be town this game, but datisi has also claimed to be town in other games where she was scum. Who is datisi really? Can we really trust someone with a proven record of lying.

Vote Shelly today, and don't believe her lies!

This ad paid for by the Shelly Is Scum Let's Just Flip Her Campaign

[Menalque]

you can keep saying she's scum but you're using your vote in the best possible way to preserve her life

I actually believe that she's scum and I'm using my vote and all my effort to end her life

[Menalque]

the only thing I find compelling in that is that I think you'd probably suggest she not claim VT but also that shit just happens sometimes. anyone should have told her not to claim VT, but sometimes scum just do be like that

[Menalque]

you realise that 1991 is a meme, yes?

[Menalque]

i really really wanna say something that i can't and it's frustrating me

if this is an ongoing games reference, stop

if this is something else, then spit it out

[Menalque]

I would be happier if you stopped supporting the CW to shelly which is the main way that she's likely to survive the day

[Menalque]

or survive the day-dy

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like you can say that you're willing to vote shelly as much as you like dats but the fact of the matter is that the way you're currently using your vote is to support her CW

it's always the same, sentiments don't mean shit when it comes to wagon building and getting people flipped, where people have their votes matters because that what governs the realities people perceive as possible

if 6 people are voting X and everyone is saying yeah I'd be willing to do Y but I don't think we can get the votes so I won't move there despite like 9 people saying they'd vote Y, X will still be flipped because they have the concrete wagon on them

[Menalque]

incidentally, this game is fucked

I think that I have like 1 solid TR which is alonzo, and that's never a good sign

Could be worse, mines noraaararaaaaaraaaa

why won't you just accept my love alonzo

[Menalque]

can we also note shelly's rather conspicuous absence from the thread through all this while she has been active elsewhere on site

[Menalque]

I'm happier about where you're voting

I'm still going to have some pretty major doubts if shelly flips scum but you're not as bad as BM in that case so *shrug*

[Menalque]

alonzo what can I say to you to get a vote from you on shelly

what can I offer you my dude

[Menalque]

alonzo have you considered that (1) your top TR is a likely compromise candidate if things go to shit and so by supporting shelly wagon you decrease the odds of your top TR dying and (2) shelly scum flipping gigantically increases your chances of flipping your top SR tomorrow, assuming that is BM who you were still voting as of last VC

[Menalque]

I'm happier about where you're voting

I'm still going to have some pretty major doubts if shelly flips scum but you're not as bad as BM in that case so *shrug*

noraaaaaa has partner equity as well, if you remember the whole 'certainly scum in ico + shellyc' ordeal

datisi probtown in my book

noraa does have partner equity, is true, but not as much as BM, maybe around the same level as Datisi

[Menalque]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wor ... aid_to_Die

[Menalque]

Sorry if you are town shelly, I think your death will be incredibly useful in solving the game anyway

[Menalque]

VOTE: shelley

Towniest thing to happen all game

[Menalque]

Shelly quickly why tgp and bob

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BM hard town if she is indeed green btw

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Datisi also leaves my scumpool but idk where to yet

[Menalque]

BM hard town if she is indeed green btw

what about me

your entire reason of your read on me was because I wasn't voting shelly

You’re still nullish

[Menalque]

I don’t hate Shelley’s pool if she’s town tbh although I would prob include iaaun

[Menalque]

Datisi also leaves my scumpool but idk where to yet

pls don’t

my last wish is for town to look at datisi more

Okay noted

[Menalque]

jfc

[Menalque]

what a game

we live in a society

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BM used his mailman with me last night. He targeted Taylor because she said she wasn't VT on D1, when she did come up as VT he thought he'd busted her for lying and that she was a goon fronting. Then there's a load of stuff about how he had a gambit and everything planned out, and somehow scum misplayed this and elim'd him despite him being incredibly misflippable today (I would have insisted we kill him, although maybe the message would have made me reconsider).

[Menalque]

I thought that all of (alonzo, datisi, bob, teacher) had incredibly bad posts/votes on Taylor, for different reasons.

Alonzo, why were you going on about "LaL tomorrow" on D2? That implies to me that you were expecting Taylor to flip green/not be guilted, and I don't see how that's a reasonable thing for town!you to think.

Datisi limped onto the wagon.

Bob did too.

Teacher hammered in a way that I think was intensely scummy. You check your VC before you're voting, even if you see a guilty, and even if there is a guilty, you don't end the day then and there. I don't think teacher is that careless, I think probably that's a scum hammer. Before that tho, I need alonzo to explain that "LAL tomorrow" thing.

[Menalque]

Smh when there's approx 0 townie slots in this game

[Menalque]

i am confident in my town reads on Noraa, Ico & Mena

I also hate this lol, weren't you like relatively unsure on me on D1? I thought I was in sort of probtown, and I don't see how I've gotten better from there rather than worse, especially given shelly flipping town

[Menalque]

this is like... nothing to do with what BM did/didn't say about you, it's all about your reaction to the Taylor guilty

I think the reasonable town assumption there is to assume it's a real guilty because why would scum throw by claiming a fake guilty is the alternative line of thought

[Menalque]

like how was he ever gonna prove whether he found you suspicious or not and therefore how were you talking about LaL re: his read on you?

[Menalque]

I feel like almost every person I think is even vaguely townie at this point is trying to pocket me, and then the others are all just too scummy

[Menalque]

2029

[Menalque]

I rolled my eyes but I also snorted @alonzo

[Menalque]

On the timing, Speed hammering a guilty is good, ya? Gives scum less time to come up with a plan to play around it/change their positioning now that plans have been disrupted/other PR fish/get the convicts thoughts for future days/etc. What’s the town benefit to playing out a day with an obvious lynch? What’s the scum benefit to grabbing a quickhammer on a slot that’s going to be limmed no matter what and still flip town? I strongly disagree with the “end the day then and there” as antitown on a theory level. With a promised red flip, it’s all gravy.

No? Just a big no? To all of this?

When I’ve been guiltied or had a teammate guiltied in the past as scum, I’ve *prayed* for a fast end to the day before town can co-ordinate or discuss the implications of that person being scum with who’s still alive, and to give enough time for the person who HAD the guilty (nearly always dying the next night) to give their thoughts on everything. I’m not saying you run out a day until the end but like uickhammering before some people had even POSTED is not protown in literally any way conceivable under the sun and I think it’s sort of incredibly bad faith that you’re trying to argue that it is?

[Menalque]

VOTE: teacher

L-2, if anyone hammers this preemptively they’re scum and they get flipped the next day

[Menalque]

usefull? you know what woulda been usefull?

a day 2

preach

[Menalque]

this game is a loss lol

[Menalque]

why have we mass claimed today

[Menalque]

vt, btw

might as well get it over with

[Menalque]

Night 2 has ended

Battle Mage was found dead, he was...

Spoiler:

Town Combined Mailman Vanilla Cop

Welcome ! You are a

Town Combined Mailman Vanilla Cop

You may each night, target a player, you will both
- make the moderator send them a private message of your choice, this message will be specified as coming from another player
-check if the player you target is a Vanilla role or not

Your Goal is to eliminate every threat to the town, you may find the game thread here

It is now day 3

I guess game designers are finally listening to implo:

Today's modern mafia consumer demands dozens, nay, hundreds of roles that are vanilla cops

[Menalque]

Why

Would you claim truthfully icon

For the love of god *read* our pt first

[Menalque]

Menalque had no town cred before this

Oof, Alonzo tellin’ it like it is

[Menalque]

Man I wish I were scum this game this would be such an easy win

[Menalque]

Like somehow I’m in the townier slots for most people here despite having done like... nothing? More or less? Since D1, and having spent a significant chunk of that day forcing through a guillo on town lol

[Menalque]

I don’t get how that makes sense personally

[Menalque]

don't think anyone has done much d2 or d3 except for my push on teacher which you should really join

Have you... have you read my last posts of actual content?

[Menalque]

Maaaaaaaybe check my ISO, TGP

[Menalque]

ico unless that's serious which i'd be quite surprised
please get sober and claim your actual role

He’s serious lmao

[Menalque]

He claimed it to me on D1 in the hood

[Menalque]

Oi, stop ignoring me in our pt

[Menalque]

so you're just a town neighbor?

Yes, but I wanted Icon and I to claim vt seeing as scum power is clearly lying about their role and I figured if they claimed a fake TPR that didn’t fit we could spring it on them to bust some chops

[Menalque]

Also, it just occurred to me: whoever killed bunno and deprived him of the chance to practice his english: very rude of you

[Menalque]

No, we’re neighbours