Newbie 2059 - Scummer's Baking Championship (Baked Over)

[JacksonVirgo]

I am curious of a discrepancy I have just realised from Fizz.

Actually no this can wait

[JacksonVirgo]

Where has skitter even gone lately. Same with everyone really jesus

[JacksonVirgo]

We are at a 2v6 and we can not rely on PR results anymore. You have a semi-clear on yours truly.
Elim + Kill -> 2v4
Elim + Kill -> 2v2

We don't even have two safe eliminations now and we're essentially forced to no-elim tomorrow. This is legitimately WCS.

Elim + Kill -> 2v4
No Elim + Kill -> 2v3

That betters our chances as we're dealing with less people.
I wish one of the PoE was checked instead... Or at least someone who wasn't being town-read.

[JacksonVirgo]

Actually who am I trying to kid.
My original plan was to get skitter night-killed so I don't have to sort them, I was pushing them up high in my reads because I simply can't read them and I hoped to make it to D3/4 and then if they're alive, they're scum but that's useless now.

Fizz is the next to die, followed by myself.

Meaning a LyLo will happen with Ahri, GrandpaMo, Andante, Irish and skitter and I do not like our chances with the two afk's in there and the strong scum player (skitter) possibly yeeting the game away for us...

[JacksonVirgo]

Fizz, might as well claim who I visited and/or that you blocked me.

[JacksonVirgo]

If there's a PR, probably best to counterclaim here. That way we get one scum down at the very least which is what we need.
If a counterclaim happens here we end in a 1v5 on the best case scenario or a 1v3 in the worst case. In a 1v3 we no-elim to reach a 1v2 and then that's the best case lylo we can hope for.

[JacksonVirgo]

I just hope fizz is scum that misplayed here. Otherwise we're pretty screwed

[JacksonVirgo]

I feel ya Andante, I feel ya.

[JacksonVirgo]

I'm "insecure" simply because I think this game is a lost cause unless Ahri/Irish start posting a LOT more. Which they likely won't and even if they do, we have the odds seriously stacked against us.

[JacksonVirgo]

VC

Andante

(1) -> skitter30 [E-3]

WhemeStar

(3) -> Andante, JacksonVirgo, Fizz Raab [E-1]

JacksonVirgo

(1) -> Ahri [E-3]

Not Voting

(3) -> GrandpaMo, Irish dancer, WhemeStar
Day ends in (expired on 2021-04-14 19:49:39)

[JacksonVirgo]

Wheme's at E-1

[JacksonVirgo]

UNVOTE:

Consider my vote there but I'm gonna do this to test something. Feel free to vote there if you want though

[JacksonVirgo]

Wait either my tool broke or ahri is voting me after saying they think I am town

[JacksonVirgo]

it's tracker or jk just nl and stop giving mafia pr reads thank

VOTE: no one

Ah just broke

[JacksonVirgo]

Nice, my forged VC worked a treat

[JacksonVirgo]

I'll do analysis soon

[JacksonVirgo]

well i joined this game half way through, i said i was totally new then u pick me.

This proves that they almost definitely thought that was hammer and did it anyway.

[JacksonVirgo]

Weren't you saying earlier scum!Grandpa wouldn't have done what they did? Yet you order them as second to scum.

[JacksonVirgo]

Why are we not flipping adante. Why are we ignoring andante. Why was wheme the flip. I dont get any of this ...

I wasn't sure on wheme, and it seems like they were being tunnelled too easily so I wanted to test if anyone speed-hammered after I told them the bad position we were in, and irish did.

Wheme's reaction was genuine I feel, and they still added content and I liked what they said.

Irish apparently read the thread multiple times and still has no grasp on any reads, which is concerning.

Andante I think is town just from how they were acting, they acted pissed at the town for how they were acting rather than in a way to get themselves saved. In a position like this I would assume scum would be trying harder than that.

[JacksonVirgo]

Problem with an irish elim is that it gives us nothing going into tomorrow if they flip town

[JacksonVirgo]

Easy. They claimed I was town via reads. You were via night results.

[JacksonVirgo]

Wheme's reaction was genuine I feel, and they still added content and I liked what they said.

Irish apparently read the thread multiple times and still has no grasp on any reads, which is concerning.

Yes agree woth these, but disagree with your andante read. Intrested in at least putting some pressure on Irish with me, to get them to like post real thoughts and explain what they were thinking with the 'hammer' vote?

Mind responding to my post about them flipping town before I vote anywhere

[JacksonVirgo]

VOTE: Irish

[JacksonVirgo]

Fizz I changed my mind at this point

[JacksonVirgo]

why the **** did I come back to the most recent page, and there's discussions on pr?

who the flying duck asked / forced them to claim

and literally with the other pr dead it doesn't matter what their role is and they might as well out since they're dying so why is it not good to ask them for their role?

VOTE: Ahri

Not even joking I think this is a scum-slip

[JacksonVirgo]

And to explain why I think that's a scum-slip, they fell into an extremely common "Liar's Trap" I guess you could call it. Typically those who are lying tend to add information which is, by itself, useless but it's subconsciously or even consciously there to try and make their cases stronger. And it's the very first sentence that's what I got pinged by.

That sentence being "Why the *** did

I come back to the most recent page"

. Why would anybody say this if they genuinely read just the last page, especially someone who has been slanking the entire game. They wouldn't add this piece of information, and thus it's only from the perspective of a liar and this exact lie doesn't come from an anti-town townie in this context, at least I am almost certain.

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler:

Ahri has been fixated on self-image that I did not realise until diving through their ISO.

i have waited so long for you Ahri!

and this pagetop :3

Ahri, the third imposter, has come to play!

This is where the conscious self-image starts with Ahri, but it is far from the last time.

not sure if I get the flavour

so the mafia are kids who destroy other people's snacks
and the town are the kids who make snacks?

and the way mafia kills is by destroying someone's dessert so they have nothing to present
the way town eliminates is by voting someone off

and pls am not tryna hunt prs here but
how do prs even work
tracker / doctor can make sense i guess
but how does cop "check" another kid and how do "masons" even work

my brain

They are trying to "solve" the game's flavour, which is already super strange but NAI as far as I am aware.
But they are super self-conscious about their image when they say that they aren't trying to hunt PRs which is unlike a town's mentality.

uh

i was meme'ing but dat rxn doe

Retraction and immediate retaliation is a tell of someone that's trying to seriously protect themselves.

anyways bad elims for today are jackson / HoG / the afk / skitter

mainly because given jackson / hog's playstyle it's so easy to mess up and openclaim mafia
and the afk / skitter haven't really done anything and are capable of a lot more

This isn't anything AI, I just wanted to ask why my playstyle makes it easy to mess up and scum-claim? I am fairly strong as scum

*reading my iso*
*every single post fixated on Andante*

anyways I'm 90% sure Andante is flipping red here, given this main reason:

he's not scumhunting, but rather looking for the "easiest" or "best" elimination. what i mean by that is that he is prodding to see if people will vote me for having no content, he's voting jackson bc he's in a hotspot, and constantly asking "hm can i push this person?"

thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.

back to lurking.

Self-conscious of their own content that they wanted to put this here as a protective barrier in a sense.

honestly like I don't even remember if I was mafia VT or pr in this game all i know that is this jackson person is too towny and this pooky person is probably scum

tenks

"They don't remember" my ass. Tells me that they are super aware of the existance of scum and PR more than the average player, as they would likely either say "I don't remember my role" or not even say it at all and actually CHECK the role.

[JacksonVirgo]

jv i can kinda see where you're coming from wrt ahri but i'm not convinced how she's playing is more likely to come from scum than disinterested town

t3 i feel like this vote hop is oppurtunistic and just you switching because jv is pushing ahri and it seems to have more traction atm
i'm really not sure why you're just point-blanc not willing to vote irish

my bet for the scumteam is t3/irish

Disinterested town would not lie about not reading the thread in my honest opinion, can you explain to me why you think it's equally or more likely that it's disinterested town.

[JacksonVirgo]

@jv why exactly is ahri a better vote than t3? i think the scumteam is exactly t3 + irish

Because I don't think they're scum? Andante was fairly townie to me prior to their replacement and nothing T3 has said has made me think otherwise

[JacksonVirgo]

I am fairly confident they're either lying or wanting to not be seen as lying about them reading just the last page. Otherwise they would not have put that in their post at all. So either they did read the thread, and said they didn't which makes them scum or they don't want people to think that they read the whole thread so they put more of a defence up and that makes them scum as well. Disinterested town would not add that useless information to back themselves up because... they're disinterested.

Hate to break this to you, but what you just told me wasn't scummy. Not town-reading someone does not inherently mean they're scum-reading them or willing to vote them, they even said they don't want to because there's no information in doing so if I recall correctly, unless I missed something and just because your town-reads are on a wagon, shouldn't change a read on someone except if it's a possible compromise.

If they are scum, why would they not wagon Irish even if that's their buddy. If it's not their buddy, they get a free elimination with no extra information for the Town and if Irish is scum, their flip will make it much harder to eliminate T3 tomorrow and thus an irish wagon there would be beneficial regardless.

[JacksonVirgo]

Ahri is now at E-1

[JacksonVirgo]

I knew some people would not be able to comprehend why I think that it's a scum-slip, reading just the last page isn't the issue I am saying. That phrase would not have been said if that's what actually happened, and I am confident in that.

Regarding T3

I am unwilling to vote Irish here because Irish isn't scummy enough. If Irish flips scum at some point then yes. I will accept scumreads and accept the fact that my read was wrong. But I have't seen anything convincing enough for me to vote Irish over the bad and scummy votes against Irish.

If T3 is town here, why would they vote Irish over someone else they find scummier. I feel you're jumping to conclusions on them, and I am not sure about the opportunistic thing, like I can see it but I it's also backed up by their past posts I feel.

[JacksonVirgo]

It's very possible it's skitter/ahri tbh

[JacksonVirgo]

We are voting ahri... when tf did this pivot happened? I knew that we pivoted some while back but I didn't really think it would actually you know be the vote. Weird. Everyone scumread wheme/irish (besides skitter nd someone else maybe) then just followed Andante's plan of voting of Andante on WHICH JV + Skitter you thought andante was scummy. JV, I do not know how you are on Andante actually because I really haven't seen a clear read on perhaps. If you don't mind me asking, what is your finalized read on T3?

I'm the one that started pushing Ahri, I'm not even on Andante at all and think them and thus T3 is town.

[JacksonVirgo]

Obviously, Grandpa hasn't even read the logic behind why Ahri is being pushed. And is saying they think it flips town, seriously?

[JacksonVirgo]

ok im changing my voting thing we vote ahri today. since everyone already is

ahri >>> t3 >>> wheme >>> irish.

ok i think we win; this is better and have gave me better insight.

if ahri flips scum, t3 is most likely town.
if ahri flips town, t3 is most likely scum.

Can you read the reason why ahri is the wagon or are you going to just ignore that fuck sake

[JacksonVirgo]

"For some reason" is something you keep saying yet not respond to my posts telling you to read the fucking post saying why the pivot happened and then you keep acting ignorant.

[JacksonVirgo]

I am starting to not like Grandpa again fwiw

[JacksonVirgo]

smh. skitter i rlly hope ur right

VOTE: Ahri

Can you please tell me what you meant here? It's possible this is a Freudian slip.

- JV

[JacksonVirgo]

You said you hoped Skitter was right. Why would you hope that while hammering

[JacksonVirgo]

Spoiler:

The "I fucking hate this game" line is outdated btw, it was when I was still assuming this to be an authentic game, but with a meta I hadn't caught up on until half the town had covertly aligned against me. I think I love this game and I think you've all loved it too, or you would have stopped me earlier. Right? Just the facts and logic.

Since I am the only scum, you were all town, and you were

all

amazing. Even if that might be "brownie points" (hey, it's the wiki that says to have your scumbuddy's back). I'll have more to say a bit later. If you want.

VOTE: Ahri

Yeah, I realize more yet now.

The "catgirl vs. eurosnob" idea was just idiotic. It was a shit idea to suggest it, no less so as "theatre". Nothing else to say there. I didn't mean it as "emotional~ random dumb! vs. analytical", as you presented it. Or I would probably have noticed all of you using it sooner.

I shouldn't have said anything about the character of Ahri, ever, not knowing her.

If I called Ahri a "magical [!] 8-ball" on thread, that was just mafia misdirection and not my actual judgment of Ahri.
If I called her a "deep-space oracle" or "vig shot D1" backstage, it was meant as "energy", because I'd read that you should boost your scumbuddy, not as her being "random" at all. I've said here that I didn't think she was being random.

But again -- I shouldn't have said shit about someone I don't know. Who hates me now. Rightly.

"Spewing lies."
It

was

my first online mafia game. I've lurked elsewhere (probably also not understanding much), and I've played irl (years before), and I've inhaled the wiki far too much and believed in it far too much -- yeah.
I drew scum, was anxious to be "proactive", and always tell my partner all my thoughts to avoid cornering them into an impossible situation by miscoordination. Went well. I realize I gave too many "instructions" to Ahri, all that micromanagement. They weren't meant as commands, they really just were what I thought.

I did try to read the thread and make sense of it. Then you all mock that I don't know where to begin engaging if the entire thread is always "scum reading" what I'm doing.

"Being aggressive."
You were setting me up for that by being intentionally stupid in two different ways. There's also parts where I called the sudden counterstrategies or scum pair calls strikingly smart.

@skitter

"What do you think of Andante?"
On the private thread? Astonishing scumdar, not good at selling it, and play early on that I called newbish or terrible while being a newb myself. Yeah, that's arrogant, though if you've seen people give these tells, it happens. You all made a point of using intentionally terrible scum tells.

On this thread? I thought that their intentionally obfuscating posts were annoying me, also irl for saying that their style is annoying me. Sure, I get that Ahri thinks the same about me, but I never called

her

style annoying. It is precisely nothing like what Andante used. Ahri used her own style throughout the thread as I thought she would, not this "like whatever idk how it's even, i'll iso them tonight" -- that's precisely why I

liked

(what I thought was) Ahri's style.

I'm sorry, all of you.

...but I also said that Andante "was kicking off the catgirl vs. eurosnob discussion", so maybe I'm actually more idiotic and biased than I'd thought.

I don't think I think women are dumber than men. Or less analytical. Or more emotional.

And the style on the private thread is different because I'm not really "analytical". I was trying to play it like that. But yeah. Very weak analysis as shown.

Town Ahri could have D1 vig shot me.

I've heard of setups where you aren't always the role that you think you've been assigned. Or nobody knows how many mafia there are.

I wasn't lying when I said it was my first game of mafia online. There are mafia variants maybe that can be played on a rainy Sunday afternoon. 3-20 min. I've been in some of these, I think, they're always full of newbies though.

No way is Ahri an alt account, but that's neither here nor there.

I can't believe how it wasn't reasonable for me to read the entirety of Newb2057 when I heard of it, or remember Ahri's history better. I am sorry for that as well. It's what, 45 pages in total? Something around those lines.

No ofc I'm joking.

ahri is my alt shitpost account. I've been had.

im not voting anyone. i explained my reads.

im pushing more of the jv and pooky narrative today and can vote skitter if i want to. there is still like multiple days left as pooky said and i want to optimize my time lmao

I mean, I still don't get it

VOTE: Hand of Glory

im so fucking confused.

I'll give this a read in a sec

[JacksonVirgo]

smh. skitter i rlly hope ur right

VOTE: Ahri

Can you please tell me what you meant here? It's possible this is a Freudian slip.

- JV

Wtf is that. Sigmund Frued, the use of unconcious thought thinking and behavior wise? What does that have to do with anything. I just hoped skitter was right because me and skitter both didn't want Ahri out initially. And skitter continued to defend Ahri but I decided there was a reason to switch.

Now answer my other questions I have proposed. Pleasse.

I just feel you would rather hope they were wrong when hammering, not the other way around.
Also what's your other question? I am still reading the HoG wall

[JacksonVirgo]

Can someone point out the interactions that seem like it's talking about the scum PT? My eyes are melting reading that and I can't pinpoint anything that's specifically "scummy", but I also not saying that there isn't I just can't see things because I am finding it hard to read it.

[JacksonVirgo]

I read the thread, I don't see any question from you.

[JacksonVirgo]

I am tired so I am probably being really stupid rn tbf

[JacksonVirgo]

I am actually so confused. I can see why it can be seen as a scum-slip but like... it's inside of a normal post

[JacksonVirgo]

catboi / irish dancer / Hand of Glory

At face-value I feel HoG's posts were strange, but not straight indicative of them being scum. However catboi's response leans towards them being >rand scum just from what's happened. I'll give a deeper analysis when I have time, and by that I mean I am going to read their posts today and make a new analysis as this is based off memory.

skitter30

I am fairly confident that skitter isn't scum here, as if they were, pushing Ahri there would have given them a massive boost but they actively chose not to.

GrandpaMo

I would have said the same reasonings as skitter30, but that hammer post doesn't sit well with me, but I also don't think it's a deal-breaker for me to death-tunnel again.

T3 / Andante

I already thought Andante was fairly cleared from how they were acting, and also how Ahri posted about them in the early-game. This is solely from Andante though, and T3 has kinda yeeted out of my memory so I'll likely have to read back there.

Whemestar / GeorgeBailey

I feel this would be scum if catboi isn't but I also feel like this was heavily pushed yesterday just for being a counter-wagon. If memory serves me right of course, which it probably isn't.


So that makes me think scum is likely in catboi > Whemestar >>>>>> Gramps

[JacksonVirgo]

I think we also have to consider that the Tracker died. And if Catboi read that much in order to kill them

[JacksonVirgo]

jv could have still bussed there... @jv im still looking at ur reaction

Except it's proven I didn't.

If I was scum with Ahri, who would have done the kill?
And I was cleared by the Tracker as to not have done the kill.

It's not that hard.

[JacksonVirgo]

jv could have still bussed there... @jv im still looking at ur reaction

Except it's proven I didn't.

If I was scum with Ahri, who would have done the kill?
And I was cleared by the Tracker as to not have done the kill.

It's not that hard.

This and the remaining scum is a Role Cop. Meaning that I would have not done that action either.

[JacksonVirgo]

I think we also have to consider that the Tracker died. And if Catboi read that much in order to kill them

again fucking sheeping so much omg (well to me it looks like ur sheeping cuz i literally said the same thing lmfaooo)

and u scumread me???

pls read what i said

I'm not sheeping as I didn't know you said these things.

[JacksonVirgo]

@jv you should know that skitter is expierenced to wifom the shit out of that lol

Because they wouldn't risk that 9/10 times.

[JacksonVirgo]

btw how many mls do we have?

One iirc

[JacksonVirgo]

D1 -> 7v2
D2 -> 6v2
D3 -> 5v1

That's where we are.

2v1 tomorrow if we ML.
That's LyLo.

[JacksonVirgo]

Oh ahaha nice we are the same brain

[JacksonVirgo]

D1 -> 7v2
D2 -> 6v2
D3 -> 5v1

That's where we are.

2v1 tomorrow if we ML.
That's LyLo.

what??

It's Lylo tomorrow if we elim town.

[JacksonVirgo]

Town Core -> T3 / JacksonVirgo
Indifference Core -> Skitter / Gramps
Scum Core -> Catboi / Whemestar

[JacksonVirgo]

Actually if you actually mindmelded with me that's you in the town-core.

[JacksonVirgo]

I am definitely dying tonight, so make the elim accordingly that you will not get any information from the kill.

[JacksonVirgo]

Gramps can you answer who would be easier to distinguish between out of the following pairs.

Skitter / Wheme
Wheme / Catboi
Catboi / Skitter

[JacksonVirgo]

By that I mean, if one scum was in there. How confident are you in solving between them

[JacksonVirgo]

Gramps can you answer who would be easier to distinguish between out of the following pairs.

Skitter / Wheme
Wheme / Catboi
Catboi / Skitter

As in what?

By that I mean, if one scum was in there. How confident are you in solving between them

[JacksonVirgo]

If skitter is a worry in LyLo we can always PL them today, leaving Wheme/Catboi as the final PoE in LyLo after a NL.

[JacksonVirgo]

I read the thread and came to the conclusion that this flip needs to happen regardless of the fact if it's wrong. As this level of bullshittery from HoG in LyLo will end in a loss if they're Town.

VOTE: Catboi

[JacksonVirgo]

Also take not that hammering this means I am gone

[JacksonVirgo]

Scum PT is on another level

[JacksonVirgo]

boop