Mini Normal 1829 - Game Over

[kraska77]

hey guys did u miss me

[kraska77]

Where the F did I say "I want to stay in RVS stage!" I'm saying we're still in it

Michael's first posts have been a load of bs and feels like he's trying to get something rolling on town (ironic cause I'm doing the same thing)

Jarjar made one post and it wasn't a joking post it was a chainsaw lynch post that was god awful

jarjar's post doesnt look serious to me
idk about michael he could just be tryhard town

where are you getting the weird idea that i think joke reasons are acceptable?

hot damn

VOTE: karnos and gerryoat come post ^_^

[kraska77]

Dude, game is going and there are actually two potentially sexy wagons to be on - why you sidelining instead of sheeping me?

which wagons? maria and michel?
both wagons suck

[kraska77]

why are you not pushing a good wagon to combat the suck?

because everyone's posts seem to revolve around one or both of these 2 being scum so far
so everyone is posting similar content and i have nothing appreciable to say yet

[kraska77]

If everyone's posting about how those 2 are scum, and you think the wagons suck, how do you not have more to say about the people on those wagons?

post 121 still answers this

[kraska77]

I mean Maria is an acceptable policy lynch

U wot

[kraska77]

@Jarjar and nero
What makes transcend scum? Bc I'm not seeing it

[kraska77]

I will admit Maybe I need to adjust my town play a bit because I always feel rather confident when I flip town because that's normally where I shine on chat mafia (towntelling) but I guess it's quite different here

No ur play is fine
Ppl's scumreads on u are shallow/lazy
U still think Michel is scum?

[kraska77]

I mean Maria is an acceptable policy lynch

U wot

I think he's upset I beat him how are you doing today

I'm fine ^_^
I have a lot of shit to do today tho
Wbu

[kraska77]

VOTE: elyse
if uve really seen scummaria before, u would know that scumher is consistent as f
this doesnt resemble her scumplay at all

[kraska77]

@shadow
yes but tell me why she would think approaching the game the way she did will help her as scum?
and she had chances to town it up but she kept baiting rope
this doesnt look like scum

[kraska77]

Baiting rope = too scummy to be scum = not a thing. Will catch up in detail after doctor's appointment

it is a thing. ppl's scumreads tend to be shallow..."someone's not being consistent/have overblown reactions/whatever, they must be scum" regardless of context. like those tells might be scummy in vacuum, but when you look at surrounding context and see that their reactions were unprovoked, this should factor into ppl's reads as well bc it's fucking imp

[kraska77]

Basically, if I get this right, you dislike the game state as far as how it serves town, but don't want to do anything to make it better.
Isn't that a scum tactic?

who said i dont want to do anything to make it better? it's just that everyone was putting out similar posts about maria/micchel so nobody's posts stood out

anyway im voting elyse now so this should no longer be an issue

[kraska77]

@elyse
my point is her ate here is not helping her. its clearly backfiing on her
so stop with the "calulated" shit

[kraska77]

I'd rather lynch Michel over Elyse but everyone says it's "a bad lynch".

michel kinda feels like iraonvap(whatever the spelling)
i'd rather we keep him around bc i feel like he can be an easy mislynch

[kraska77]

ya but i cant read ppl like him for shit
i think better to read them thru associations

[kraska77]

@elyse
my point is her ate here is not helping her. its clearly backfiing on her
so stop with the "calulated" Smurf

I would note that the AtE specifically worked on JarJar and she town read him for it, which is perfectly within the sphere of AtE.
Who would you say is causing the AtE to "backfire" on her? (the only name I have for that list is Elyse, I noted it as scummy but was already voting her so it's a neutral break with me)
I don't see that happening at all, what are you seeing?

im mostly talking about her unprovoked early claim

[kraska77]

im mostly talking about her unprovoked early claim

I think Elyse was the only one who called that out as an issue, am I recalling that wrong?
Or is "Elyse" the sum total answer for how the AtE is backfiring on Maria?

elyse called it out
but i also thought it was really bad and almost reconsidered my read on her. just bc noone else came and said stuff doesnt mean i cant think her ate here wasnt helping her acquit herself

[kraska77]

im mostly talking about her unprovoked early claim

I think Elyse was the only one who called that out as an issue, am I recalling that wrong?
Or is "Elyse" the sum total answer for how the AtE is backfiring on Maria?

elyse called it out
but i also thought it was really bad and almost reconsidered my read on her. just bc noone else came and said stuff doesnt mean i cant think her ate here wasnt helping her acquit herself

So you agree with me that her AtE actions look bad, even though you think the wagon is terrible?
If you think the wagon is terrible, but you kinda buy into the wagon...how does that work?

i already explained this before...we're just going around in circles at this point
the unprovoked nature of her claim and the way some of her reactions were kinda ott when the situation didnt warrant that makes me think this isnt scum

[kraska77]

She seems to be two town reactions to one scum reaction. That's a win, maybe not a great one, but it's assuredly not a backfire.

how so? i dont see any of the people voting her unvoting
transcend and i are the only ones defending her
so it' 2 townreads to the rest of the game either scumreading her or being ambivalent to her lynch(like this nero person for example who said it's an okay pl on page 7 on day 1 lol)

[kraska77]

I don't really think Michel is scummy, I just think his logic sucks dick.

y are u voting me when u dont sr maria or michel either then? -___-

[kraska77]

I don't really think Michel is scummy, I just think his logic sucks dick.

y are u voting me when u dont sr maria or michel either then? -___-

????

Like I don't understand how my reads on Michel and Maria would affect you. Pls explain.

bc that's all my iso's about so far
if u on the same wavelength then y am i scum exactly?

[kraska77]

So this sounds like scum that knows Maria is town.

bye

[kraska77]

VOTE: karnos

I will follow you for a bit Nero. Still want Maria's head but I think Transcend is town, so let's see what shakes loose.

VOTE: kraska

That's the one you were voting.

is this supposed to show that ure following nero's votes whatever they may be?

[kraska77]

lol

[kraska77]

oh crap y do mods steal my color

[kraska77]

IM A SHE DAMMIT

[kraska77]

I'm not em player wtv that is

[kraska77]

IM A SHE DAMMIT

[kraska77]

"Instead of responding to points"
What points elyse? Jar doesn't comment at all on the content of my defenses (like...he even holds me pointing out that his first post wasn't serious against me when there was nth wrong with what I said). His case on me in a nutshell is I've "defended" a bunch of people and that somehow makes me scum

Didn't you say you were going to explain ur sr on me? I'm w8ing for that

[kraska77]

Michel has some of the best posts of the game thus far.

lolwat

[kraska77]

"Egodriven gambit"
Lol
Mason claim was obviously fake
What are you on about

[kraska77]

I'm new and yet every single game I've been in someone fakeclaims mason day 1
U guys have older join dates and yet u believe that stuff and make a big deal out of a gambit like that's not usual business on this site

[kraska77]

I'll do proper catchup later today

[kraska77]

hi
nero the nobrainer posts i made elsewhere dont take time or effort, decent catch up does tho
im going to try and explain the thought process behind everything ive posted so far

first...my "both wagons suck" post...i'll start with michel

michel's entrance comes off as gauche and robotic...like i said before reminds me of iraoanavp or LQ. regardless of his alignment, players like that are easy pickings for surface level scumhunting. that's why his wagon sucked. because anyone can keep pointing out theyre shifty, that doesnt tell me much about the people pointing fingers...especially not when majority of the active playerlist was onto them early in the game. his wagon sucked because it doesnt prompt more complex interactions. thats why i dont want him lynched or wagoned today. bc if he's town, his wagon will be easy copout from actual scumhunting, and if he's scum, associations are still a better way to peg him. either way, lynching him means we go on to day 2 with minimum info

[kraska77]

made elsewhere yesterday*

[kraska77]

Are you really saying we shouldn't lynch Michael because he's so lynchable

this ^ ...although i dont like the way you put it here

and i havent talked about maria at all in that post
why are you confused?

post on maria coming up next

[kraska77]

Are you really saying we shouldn't lynch Michael because he's so lynchable

this ^ ...although i dont like the way you put it here

and i havent talked about maria at all in that post
why are you confused?

post on maria coming up next

I was confused because the Michael wagon got up to about three votes for about an hour, so I wasn't sure if you were really claiming it was large or easy pickings since it never really had traction.

I started posting on page 4 I think? At the time:
3 were on Michel, another 3 or 4 were on Maria...remaining 1 or 2 were ambivalent. And 3 were afk (me, Gerry and karnos). So considering the gamestate, it did have traction

[kraska77]

thor why do you keep saying im a good lynch
also sorry i got distracted and forgot to complete my catchup
i'm on it now

[kraska77]

PEdit - opportunistic where and how? I called Maria out on being opportunistic and her best rebuttal was agreeing with me.

@Transcend

thor why do you keep saying im a good lynch
also sorry i got distracted and forgot to complete my catchup
i'm on it now

Revelations 3:16 mostly.
You barely exist - when you skate that much you shouldn't act shocked that people are fine with your lynch.

*shrugs* i think i did influence the game somewhat? even if im getting voted, my posts made a ripple...atleast gamestate is no longer stuck in a michel vs maria loop
what about blitz tho? bc i think theyre skating for real and im scumreading that slot

[kraska77]

i kind of lost every last ounce of interest in this game...

[kraska77]

hoookay
maria is town because...i think she's perfectly capable of consistent play. especially with jarjar constantly pointing out inconsistencies in her posts, i think she would have tweaked her play if she were scum. that she didnt and continues to be erratic, makes me think town. can u guys please not reduce my read on her to just "meta"?

[kraska77]

compare jar and elyse's approaches to maria
elyse's posts at maria seem exploitative
feels like she's more concerned with looking town for the push rather than genuinely sorting her
her posts are mostly "u did blabla and yadayada and according to wikitells that makes u scum"

[kraska77]

lol
you used stereotypical scumtells against her is what i mean

[kraska77]

anyway shadow what do you think of maria

[kraska77]

i cant be bothered to iso you now
but off the top of my head you used her getting flustered under pressure against her for one
and stop evading my point...your push on her felt opportunistic

[kraska77]

town: nero, jar, maria,\
lean town: iai, gerryoat, michel
dunno: transcend, thor, karnos, shadow
scum: blitz, elyse,

[kraska77]

hmm actually shadow is somewhere between dunno and lean town

[kraska77]

ahem... moderator....

Question to everyone else
Are jesters allowed in normal games?

fake

Kiss my ass

lol shadows town i guess ^_^

[kraska77]

@blitz
no transcend always plays like that
tho he seems a little off here
but none of the things you listed are unusual to his play

[kraska77]

yeah i knew it you're just being a paranoid idiot due to our last game.

who?

[kraska77]

oh i thought you meant blitz

[kraska77]

hey transcend thor asked for u to be force replaced or he gets replaced instead
can u be a good boy and promise not to do personal attacks anymore so thor retracts that?

[kraska77]

Also K77 if i'm off i'd love to remind you that i was basically mod-confirmed town since he made an error and that's our only completed game together.

also i will not play the game the same way every time.

dunno why youre strongly townreading thor and i dont understand your strong shadow and michel scumreads either

[kraska77]

k then you can go because i don't intend on leaving lol.

shutup transcend ^_^
apologise to jjd pls
and @thor stay

[kraska77]

The personal insult tracker is to 6. (Braindead)

you're not helping...

[kraska77]

The personal insult tracker is to 6. (Braindead)

you're not helping...

Really, he's either clueless or deliberately insulting players as a strategy. If he's clueless, I am helping him. If it's a strategy, the mod should be aware of this to take action.

ya but thor's a hairs length away from replacing out and that post isnt helping stop that

[kraska77]

if he's spineless enough to replace out due to a little bit of dirty talk then so be it. it's an aggressive game, people will get heated up.

@Mod: Do something about this or I am gone too.

tactical replace out

LOL JUST FUCKING STOP

[kraska77]

@Kraska - I appreciate your efforts, but I don't make willy-nilly replace out requests. There is literally nothing Transcend could say within this game to change my mind. A few months from now if I see different playstyle from him, yes, that would change my mind, but within this game my mind is very settled. I appreciate if he wants to claim his play style and language are "just a game" and respect that opinion. I have the opinion that I don't play with people like that, because it makes the game unfun. Due to [ongoing] I see no real liklihood of a play change in him regardless of his claims otherwise. I do apologize for the abrupt shift, but consider it a less negative effect on the game then me sitting here responding to the game in this state any longer.

okay
i understand that. im touchy to toxicity myself and have replaced out of many games for this reason. but i dont feel any real malice behind transcend's words, doesnt feel like he means any of the things he said...which is why i think if he tones it down there wouldnt be any lingering toxicity...and there wouldnt be a problem or a need for people to leave

[kraska77]

same for me with u and maria
sad to see it come to this...

[kraska77]

alternatively:

i'll cool my jets a lil bit since people have shown offense

we can all stay in the game

we can all lynch scum (maybe)

we can all not make a big commotion over something that isn't worth making a big commotion over.

just maybe.

im down ^_^

what do u say thor?

[kraska77]

:/

[kraska77]

Dw I'll protect u Maria!!!!!

[kraska77]

Yessss

@mod do that

[kraska77]

Hi, I'm slowly catching up!

UNVOTE:

I just started reading, I'm on page 9 and I currently have pretty good townreads on Thor, Nero, Kraska, and Maria. Since there's still a lot to go and the deadline is near, I think I'll save my closer readings/note-taking for the night.

Kraska

, since Elyse looks like the biggest bandwagon that isn't on someone I'm townreading, can you talk to me a bit more about her? I saw some of your points against her and agreed, I just would like to know if anything has solidified that scumread on her. I don't want to vote for her on my own until I get a good feel of the current gamestate, so some selected reading on that would be nice so we can expedite that a bit.

Also, in the case Transcend hasn't mentioned it yet, I'm negative utility (Ascetic to be specific). I'm still kind of new to the site but I'm under the impression it's correct town play to claim any NU as soon as possible.

Read my iso

[kraska77]

Also fwiw blitz is currently a stronger scum Read than elyse
If what transcend said is true and they've played with blitz before then the bullet points they were using against transcend were just a facade to resonate with the rest of the playerlist's perception of transcend's play
No way they've played with transcend before and yet thought he's scum for the reasons that provided

[kraska77]

Read my iso

Hm, not as helpful as I was anticipating, I'll read her ISO for myself. Has a lot actually happened this game? It feels bloated and it's kind of hard to read through

i don't think i'm ever shitposting again in mafia btw, god have mercy on people who replace in

Lol now that u mention it...I dodnt even notice this is now at 40 pages
Also be a g like me and never read the games you replace into (not this one tho)

[kraska77]

I gave you your other lynch choice Elyse so you can pick join this wagon with me or I'll vote you again and make sure you get lynched I will force this.

what do you think of giga's post on elyse
actually could you provide a reads list? you dont have to explain your reads, just want to see where your head's at

[kraska77]

so you do have elyse as bottom tier :/
why are you trying to meet midway with elyse then

[kraska77]

okay
it better be good
because im beginning to wonder if im wrong about you

[kraska77]

Did elyse even talk about karnos before for you to expect her to consider a hop on that wagon at all?

[kraska77]

I would vote kraska or shadow

And you're not voting either of us because...?

[kraska77]

Who's the "other scum"? karnos?

[kraska77]

No that was me

[kraska77]

Edited list

town: nero, jar, giga
lean town: iai, gerryoat, michel, shadow, maria
dunno: thor, karnos
scum: blitz, elyse,

is where I'm at right now

[kraska77]

boy do I have a tinfoil theory!

Go on

[kraska77]

boy do I have a tinfoil theory!

Go on

Ira is largley considered a Vi. You could light defend him and try to put it in the minds of town that Michel is a Vi like Ira and thus we shouldn't think his bad and convoluted logic is scummy.

Why am I not surprised

[kraska77]

It was obvious you were getting there
Anyway I already explained why I don't want him lynched today, he's a slight townread so it's not like I have any reason to defend him if associations start pointing towards him being scum

Pedit: my scum games were a fail and I'm not playing like I did in either of those games next time I roll scum

[kraska77]

I think I'm gonna re-read the game Tom
I feel like my reads are off

[kraska77]

UNVOTE: for now

[kraska77]

(Giga Kraska)
(Jarjar Nero)
(Shadow IAI Gerry)
(Thor)
(Bliz)
(Elyse Sable Karnos)

less than 2 days ago she had 5 people scummier than me. all of a sudden is ok with her scumread voting me as well (despite the fact that i was voting her scumread)

Ya...I don't understand this either
my strong initial town read on her dwindled when she backtracked on her scum read on you after being pressed about it
I don't understand how the opinion of others could so easily ebb her more intimate+intuitive read on you

[kraska77]

I can do blitz
VOTE: blitz

[kraska77]

Shadows not scum btw

[kraska77]

He waltzes in this late into day 1 with enough heat on him but still refuses to provide any content
That's not scum

[kraska77]

ok changed my mind shadow/michel/kraska team

Shadows not scum btw

She says this b/c I'm right on her and Michel. Maybe JJ is the third.

[kraska77]

I think a thor/michel/blitz team makes a lot of sense here
But idk

[kraska77]

What do you think of iai?

[kraska77]

At the time I mad that post it reall looked like he's just lynchbait town
Now I'm reconsidering...I think I'm probably wrong about elyse so...

[kraska77]

to scum on Michel

I'm not really there yet
I just feel there's somehing off with the elyse wagon since so many seem to have a problem with it yet it still went through so easily
I'm pretty sure blitz is scum and Michel kinda makes sense as a scum buddy

[kraska77]

The way he later tried to handwave the seriousness of his early posts on blitz when he received their naked vote as scummy is sketchy

Though now that I read his iso again...I'm not feeling a blitz/michel team at all so nvm

[kraska77]

Described* her* makes vote

[kraska77]

Naked* Vote
I need sleep


Perit: dunnoooo

[kraska77]

Giga why do you think shadow is scum?

[kraska77]

Thor who are you reading as town?

[kraska77]

Thor so far:
"Lynch Maria for erratic play"
"Lunch elyse for opportunistic vote on Maria"
"I'd policy shadow"
"we're not lynching gerry because thats who Maria says is scum"
"I'd lynch kraska for being low activity"
"Both the Maria and gerry wagons excite me"

[kraska77]

Why is Michel a strong townread(on par with nero and jar) when you have pointed out lots of inconsistencies/bad logic in his arguments?
Feels like you're approaching two similar situations(Maria and michel) differently

[kraska77]

Also gerry and karnos have been equal levels of useless so I'm assuming you want gerry lynched now bc you think gerry vs Maria is scum theatre?

[kraska77]

Why post this (with, as usual, no actual opinion being expressed)?

You're decentralising pressure and calling for like 5 people to get wagoned
On the surface it looks like you're doing stuff but all your pushes have been weak

[kraska77]

GIGA, TALK TO ME
Blitz is scum, shadow is town
Why do you disagree with this
Especially shadow...I thought you of all people here would see this given that we just finished a game with him
Also I can explain why blitz is scum but why aren't you even considering that....



(I'm replying to thor later)

[kraska77]

Don't hammer
Maria explain your swinginess on gerry pls

[kraska77]

There's 17 hours left so....
If she comes in here and explains herself I'd rather we rope blitz
Or karnos bc that was a do nothing reads list

[kraska77]

This Maria wagon is bad
maria, Nero, iai, giga, shadow, gerry
Get on blitz or karnos with me pls

[kraska77]

Jar stop getting in my way
I'm trying to save Maria here

[kraska77]

This Maria wagon is bad
maria, Nero, iai, giga, shadow, gerry
Get on blitz or karnos with me pls

I just said ur working up my scum list and you want me to vote with you?

How about u bus shadow and try to gain some town cred?

Idc what your read on me is, we both don't like the Maria wagon so we should work together

[kraska77]

I thought that was only "if she comes in here and explains herself" ??

I want blitz or karnos run up to l-1 too so no one derphammers Maria and chalk it up to looming deadline

[kraska77]

Shadow also pissed off everyone in open 649, was very low activity and focused on only one player the entire game
He almost got lynched when he announced his guilty bc no one believed him lol

[kraska77]

So no I won't vote him

[kraska77]

I must be scum because I'm not voting MariaR, who you think is town?

No
Bc Your reads list is bad
And don't you hammer

[kraska77]

I must be scum because I'm not voting MariaR, who you think is town?

No
Bc Your reads list is bad

How do you know? Do you have perfect knowledge of the scum in this game?

You put the entire playerlist as either null or probably something

[kraska77]

unvote first then we talk

[kraska77]

I h8 u karnos

[kraska77]

Nero, Kraska, was that just wagoning the hope of getting a claim from her?

No...lol
And I don't like her coasting after her wagon dissipated

[kraska77]

I'm not happy to see Maria lynched ftr

[kraska77]

Investigatives on blitz pls

[kraska77]

I'll reconsider if Maria flips scum
But I don't think she will

[kraska77]

How confident are you on gerry being scum? Because you did back off him for a while

[kraska77]

This is why I asked you to unvote -_-
Don't be surprised if you get flashwagoned tom by elyse and co

[kraska77]

Okay cop on gerry tonight pls

[kraska77]

Hey
VOTE: karnos

[kraska77]

Actually no
VOTE: blitz this is a better vote

[kraska77]

Dear giga
Pls stop pretending u didn't play that game with me where shadow was being an aggro alien lurker that no one townread...just like here
Move ur vote

[kraska77]

ahem... moderator....

Question to everyone else
Are jesters allowed in normal games?

fake

Kiss my ass

^ town post ^

[kraska77]

no no no. In that open game that you are reffering to both you and Shadow are doing way more scumhunting.

Me? Are u serious?...
I did nth that game that's why I got lynched in mylo
I'm putting more effort here for reals

[kraska77]

Imo
Blitz>karnos>gerry>>>>>>>>shadow/thor

[kraska77]

SIpeaking of which, i don't understand why everyone seems to blindly trust thor
There's nothing particularly towny in his iso

[kraska77]

VOTE: Blitzkrieg

there are enough votes on shadow for now. Kraska, are you nullreading Thor or...? He seems pretty town to me, his vote park on Maria was a little weird but I think his posts and reads are pretty good.

Thor is an experienced player. I imagine tonality is easy to fake
I'm not happy with his day 1 play. Comparatively, Nero and iai showed more genuine fluidity of reads. i don't really see a reason to suspect him yet, but I don't trust him either(same with shadow)

[kraska77]

ever walk away from a game for 2 hours and then realize u miss something really obvious

What epiphany did you get

[kraska77]

ever walk away from a game for 2 hours and then realize u miss something really obvious

What epiphany did you get

nero should i tell kraska and michel what's going on or do u think elyse will catch on and l-1 shadow...?

(maybe i'm utterly wrong but i think i get what's happening)

What...
I feel dumb =(

[kraska77]

Other than Nero, who do you think is scum karnos?
Also what do u think of blitz

[kraska77]

And where would u place blitz in your list? Null? Town? Scun?

[kraska77]

Hey guys can we stop this shit and wagon blitz now

[kraska77]

hrmmmm....

I

was just about to buy into the blitz/karnos/shadow team and then I looked at 649.

Shadow was a town cop. He did not lurk, you were active and were trying to game solve. He

WAS shot

on n4 but still...

Shadows

claim that he was lurking and being lynchable here doesn't mesh with 649. I mean Kranksa could just be horrible but I'm back to thinking she might be scum especially if he flips scum.

Like he said, he was bottom of the draft that game so u can't compare to this game . He also was lynchbait and was wagoned many times until he claimed his giilty. Now if ud stop the mudslinging and help get people on blitz, that would be appreciated. Even if it turns out im wrong about blitz, I'm not wrong on shadow...so you need to reevaluate your reads if they're based on shadow being scum

[kraska77]

Jar don't you feel you're doing your Maria tunnel all over again
Things are not so clear cut. inconsistency is not necessarily a scum tell. Scumtells are usually more covert than that. You can go on with this dumb wagon and see shadows town flip. Or we can lynch obvious scum Titus and sort people like karnos and gerry instead because this is more pressing

[kraska77]

Nice try
This is giga's way of poking people
And scum try to opportunistically push wagons on her every game she's in for this reason
Your read on karnos and gerry pls?

[kraska77]

Hey shadow, put blitz at l-1 pls

[kraska77]

I think giga is scum. I think transcend did a gambit and tried to buddy maria the town. giga has also seemingly been ok with voting pretty much anyone so far.

VOTE: giga

This.

Giga will vote anyone and practically every slot has been counterwagoned against Giga. Might as well be a neon sign scum aren't bussing and Giga is scum.

Probably won't be active during weekend so I'll just go ahead and say the above feels like blitz painting a target on gerry's back

[kraska77]

I'm not happy with the blitz wagon

That's a good sign

[kraska77]

Ya I said "pls"!!!!!

[kraska77]

I would like to listen to the dead...especially since Maria seems to be very familiar with him, but then again... the stuff i said in post 1602
What do you think of that? Blitz is toast, so obfuscating associations is what I expect her to do

[kraska77]

I think it's the latter. I mean she has nothing else to say at this point anyway. But that's not even distancing
It doesn't look like one atleast

[kraska77]

There's not much else she could say at this point*
Is a better way to word it

[kraska77]

I'm particularly disliking Nero's play here. Both with the Elyse wagon day 1, and the shadow and blitz wagons today, he seemed more interested in getting them to claim then in actually getting a lynch. It's in large part due to him that there are two powerroles out in the open now. That's not scumhunting, that's powerrole hunting, and more likely to come from scum then from town. Add the way he was smearing me day 1, and I would be happy to see him lynched.

What a coincidence...you start calling Nero scum just as the "Nero is scum" sentiment starts flying about the place

[kraska77]

More votes on Giga would be gr8

Why is giga scum, again?

[kraska77]

When I look at Blitzkrieg, I see a player who focussed almost exclusively on Maria and Trans/Giga. That's not surprising, given how scummy that fakeclaim is, but it makes it difficult to know her thoughts on other players. That being said, I don't think she did anything super scummy. Yet JarJar, Giga, Nero all joined that wagon while giving virtually no reasoning, and shadow's willingness to hammer also comes after he didn't discuss blitz at all. This is a poor wagon.

I'm particularly disliking Nero's play here. Both with the Elyse wagon day 1, and the shadow and blitz wagons today, he seemed more interested in getting them to claim then in actually getting a lynch. It's in large part due to him that there are two powerroles out in the open now. That's not scumhunting, that's powerrole hunting, and more likely to come from scum then from town. Add the way he was smearing me day 1, and I would be happy to see him lynched.

I still prefer a Giga lynch though. Given how many players in this game were willing to give him a free pass for fakeclaiming, the mason claim is a relatively low risk way for him to potentially coast through the first couple of days, and build some towncred with maria in the process.

Vote: Giga

Shadows claim is conveniently safe for scum. It gives us little information, particularly when he's using it to confirm claims.

Karnos hammer yesterday was terrible, and it still looks like he's getting away with not adding much.

Unless I hear some very good arguments for someone else, I want to lynch one of these four.

This entire post amounts to nothing more than "geez everyone is scummy I don't really know" I'm almost certain this is scum

[kraska77]

He just listed all the lynches on the table today as lynches he would partake in

[kraska77]

Karnos wanna declare hammer intent on blitz?

[kraska77]

Wait lol did u just call urself annoying pr haha :p

[kraska77]

but I think it would be better to explain to people off the wagon why this is the lynch for today tomorrow.

For starters, everyone voting blitz right now is town
Wagon is stalling because scum are trying to derail

[kraska77]

I'm not hammering Blitz lol. He seems townish to me. I also will not vote who giga is voting, as I think he's scum. Mostly looking back on what Transcend did. I think he tried to buddy town by protecting Maria with the mason claim.

Didn't you think Maria is scum? and were one of many who advocated that lynch or didn't fight it? Why couldn't transcends actions reflect a town motivation of wanting to protect his townread? Did you miss the part were he retracted his claim after being threatened with blacklisting? Why would scumtranscend who's using this gambit to his win condition be afraid of that

[kraska77]

I'm not hammering Blitz lol. He seems townish to me. I also will not vote who giga is voting, as I think he's scum. Mostly looking back on what Transcend did. I think he tried to buddy town by protecting Maria with the mason claim.

Didn't you think Maria is scum? and were one of many who advocated that lynch or didn't fight it? Why couldn't transcends actions reflect a town motivation of wanting to protect his townread? Did you miss the part were he retracted his claim after being threatened with blacklisting? Why would scumtranscend who's using this gambit to his win condition be afraid of that

Yes, I thought one of them was scum. I thought Maria was scum cause she had an awful reason for fosing me. Not my fault she had a bad reason

Why couldn't transcends actions reflect a town motivation of wanting to protect his townread? Did you miss the part were he retracted his claim after being threatened with blacklisting? Why would scumtranscend who's using this gambit to his win condition be afraid of that

[kraska77]

Wait since when do you read thor as scum

[kraska77]

someone hammer titus already. no progress and everyone's getting more and more tinfoily the more this day drags out

[kraska77]

Giga what are you doinggggģ
Get back on Titus she's scum

[kraska77]

come on karnos
here kitty kitty
hammer time ( ◕‿◕ )

[kraska77]

I'm not voting giga Tom or ever karnos so good luck trying to get her lynched

[kraska77]

[kraska77]

This was also a little odd since she made a post earlier about how Thor had done nothing towny

In post 1815, kraska77 wrote:
Wait since when do you read thor as scum


So I was kinda concerned if she was scum

you do realise that was a valid question since jar called that post(the one where i said thor did nothing towny) crazytalk, right? or are you gonna dumbpost now?

[kraska77]

"you had made it seem like you were lightly scumreading Thor"

i don't really see a reason to suspect him yet, but I don't trust him either

[kraska77]

I still don't think shadow is scum fwiw
Shadow I'd be impressed of you somehow manage to swing a wagon on someone else at this point but I don't think you'll be able to do that. So. What are you waiting for? Hammer Titus ffs

[kraska77]

would you hammer me if i self-vote

BAD GIGA BAD

[kraska77]

So. What are you waiting for? Hammer Titus ffs

He is not town. He either doesn't want to bus or is holding out for a no lynch. Stop looking at meta and look at intentions.

Why don't you look at intentions and tell me how they fit within a scum agenda when shadow can't get any more disgustingly obvious about not wanting to vote Titus. How the hell is this helping him pray tell

[kraska77]

It's helping but not lynching his buddy who is toast anyway?
Ok.

[kraska77]

By* not

[kraska77]

alright i can see now why jar was positive shadow is scum
neapolitan is redundant when there's a gunsmith around

VOTE: shadow

[kraska77]

karnokarno you're not scum are you?
who do you think is the 3rd scumzer?

[kraska77]

same shit boi

[kraska77]

who's nc?

[kraska77]

UNVOTE:
tbh i didnt think ure scum at any point in the game before so i wanna think this thru

[kraska77]

my guess is karnos and some outside shot too
probably thor

[kraska77]

Giga is unlikely to be scum. I have a vanilla on Kraska.

That leaves elyse and Michel. One of them could be the SK.

you do realise it could be and probably is a vig too right?
why the hell did you out your result

[kraska77]

VOTE: karnos

[kraska77]

@shadow probably because theyre x-shot?
lots of people looked suspicious n1, the fact that there was no kill makes me feel we're dealing with a vig here

[kraska77]

why would sk skip a kill?

[kraska77]

@karnos i trust my read on him from days 1 and 2 though
and im glad i wasnt wrong about gerry. his interactions with titus looked like titus was setting him up to be a sitting duck day 3
interactions between you and titus looked strained

[kraska77]

i dont even remember you two interacting actually
and whenever one of you was asked for a read on the other, you gave an awkward townread you couldnt back up
and you're still pushing for a giga lynch when everything points towards her being town, especially after titus' flip

[kraska77]

why is giga scum again?

[kraska77]

1986

you're still hung up on the mason episode :/
go through blitz/titus iso and look at her interactions with transcend. doesnt look like distancing, looks like legit mudslinging

[kraska77]

ok im giving you boftd
read early blitz/transcend interactions and tell me if you still think giga is scum
and yeah i was talking about shadow

[kraska77]

wow that was disappointing
read the part of blitz's iso where thor was going to replace out

[kraska77]

wow that was disappointing
read the part of blitz's iso where thor was going to replace out

Do you read my comments in that part of the thread? Persivul did the same thing to GreyICE, and greyICE was replaced (just like transcend), and in the end it was revealed Persivul & GreyICE were both scum.

that is one thing, the bullet points blitz posted on why transcend's playstyle was scummy is another
they're blatant shit because titus has lots of meta with towntranscend

[kraska77]

you can see how transcend immediately did a 180 on his read on titus after that too

[kraska77]

but no town protective role? Giga is a sorta protective though....

?

[kraska77]

Yeah exactly, asceticw claim day 1 so scum actions get concentrated on a smaller pool where it is relevant anyway so...

[kraska77]

yes, yes it does.

I'm just having a hard time getting my head around a 4th town pr.

Hmm gimme a sec
This is reminding me of a past game I'd like to forget

[kraska77]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=67535
This had scum doctor and tracker
Town had tracked, followed, masons and a vig

[kraska77]

I was vigged n1 lol ;_;

[kraska77]

Dunno honestly
But that game is a good example bc people also thought watcher and tracker together seem redundant and that town had too many powers

[kraska77]

Keep in mind that Titus kept claiming this is role madness
I think that's because scum has two PRs
4 town PRs and an ascetic to balance that isn't too far fetched
And having town prs nerf eachother makes sense

[kraska77]

Okay we lynch shadow today. Even if he flips town, no one goes after giga tom bc she's town as hell

[kraska77]

I think he's town but I don't want people having these shenanigans in late game
Better to resolve this now

[kraska77]

Oh right o.o
Forgot we're 8 now
Hmm
I wanna lynch karnos

[kraska77]

Actually it means my reads are probably dead wrong, so scum are happy to lynch me now.

But whatever. I can't debate "i wanna lynch karnos". If people want to play like town and give reasons why I am scum, I'll debate them, but apparently logic is not a part of this particular game.

youre still arguing giga is scum and havent followed up on your iso dive after my last post at you

[kraska77]

and you havent done much day 1 and day 2
im trying to engage you but youve given me nothing to work with other than a call for a lynch on town

[kraska77]

Hello thor
Who do you think scum are

[kraska77]

Seriously what was his reason to scum read blitz pre-claim?
Ans. Meta
blitz was a goon anyway, NC setting up a hard bus on blitz from day 1, isn't unlikely at all.

He called everyone scum on day 1 at some point so this is meh
He only got serious about lynching blitz day 2

[kraska77]

And i feel meta was valid
Anyone who played with town Titus before would have noticed she's off

[kraska77]

why massclaim today and not tomorrow?

[kraska77]

i dont think tom will be lylo if we lynch karnos today :p

[kraska77]

Do you see any giant win in waiting a day for the claims?

no. youre right

[kraska77]

@Giga - Scummiest should go first, but enough people have issues with Shadow that him going first makes sense to me, and if you think he's town then he'll theoretically still pick the 'scummiest' to claim next regardless - so I don't get the issue if he starts or if Karnos starts. Unless you think his scummiest read isn't Karnos.

i guess that's true, there wouldn't be much of a difference. especially considering shadow already claimed, so?

is it normal for people to claim again in massclaim? i just realized that this is my first closed game onsite so this is a bit different for me

whats the difference between close and open games? i still dont know