Not Quite Normal Multiball II (Game Over)

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Post Post #800 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 5:52 pm

Post by Cephrir »

votecount 1.5
MonkeyMan576 (5) | butterchurn, Cat Scratch Fever, Nashville Dreams, cassowary, bnuuy

MalcolmTucker (4) | Menalque, NorwegianboyEE, Save The Dragons, MonkeyMan576

catboi (2) | Wallflower, tictac

Klick (1) | MalcolmTucker
Save The Dragons (1) | The Keeper
Menalque (1) | Well Done
mastina (1) | Klick
Tracer Bullet (1) | MegAzumarill
Wallflower (1) | Tracer Bullet
tictac (1) | catboi

Not Voting | Enchant, Flavor Leaf, Toogeloo, mastina, Sword of Ducks

With 23 alive, it takes 12 to politely ask someone to leave.

Deadline: (expired on 2022-05-09 09:41:00).
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Post Post #801 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 6:07 pm

Post by mastina »

In post 624, catboi wrote:not that it would have mattered because scum had a doc
We also had a roleblocker and literally the only reason we left you alive and unblocked is that we wanted you to vig town. :P So vigging me would've been indistinguishable between you hitting an unannounced protection and you being roleblocked.
In post 599, Nashville Dreams wrote:
I’ll just persuade Catboi to vig her for real this time
Actually, a vig on me would be,
conditionally
, not a bad thing!

If nobody is scumreading me, obviously, a vig on me is a bad idea.
If the majority of players really scumreading me are scum(spects), obviously, a vig on me is a bad idea.
But if the majority of players seriously scumreading me are town, then a vig would actually be a good idea. So long as it's a standard night vig and not a day vig, the mod confirmed that day would not be skipped if I was vigged during the night. So if there's actual suspicion on me that is valid, the best method would in fact be a vig.

That said, obviously, my plan is to be obvtown enough, accurate enough, and persuasive enough, that the scumteams have no choice but to kill me in spite of my claim dissuading them from wanting to. :P (Hey I've gotten shot as a town miller N1 after claiming D1, so I've done it before.)
In post 629, Cat Scratch Fever wrote:Why are some RVS votes town, another scum, and yet another classified as "town?" in and ?
Because I developed a whole entire RVS read nuance where I created a model where certain RVS entrances are +town and others are +scum, generically speaking. These RVS entrance reads have some nuance to them based on the context surrounding them, including game flavor, what has already been posted inthread, usernames/signatures/avatars, and player history with each other.

These generic reads are then refined by my knowledge of the player in question making them, and enhanced by the final determining factor of gut. I look at the post, I run the mental calculation on them, and I also crossreference it with other reads. If I see a player pick up on the same vibes I do, for instance, then that player is immediately going to be more town to me than they may otherwise have been. (Basically, if player A sees that player B's RVS is suspect and votes player B, and I share that opinion that player B's RVS is suspect, it's going to increase my read on player A.)

The greatest tragedy of mafiascum is that I once had this so well defined and mapped out that I almost wrote a post laying out the methodology used, and yet didn't, and since then, it's gone from something I did with active thought to instead be something I do automatically and instinctively, so I no longer can explain it the way I would've when it was something that was newer.

Basically, I developed an entire system, and the system was incredibly good but also incredibly complex. I still use the system that I developed, but I internalized it and thus, I lost the ability to explain the system I developed. I can share bits and pieces of the system when the thought is around allowing me to explain it, but I can't explain the whole system all at once the way I originally could've had I actually made the post explaining it that I wanted to.

It's obviously not a 100% accurate thing, but it's actually disproportionately accurate overall over the course of years of use. It tends to steer things in an overall good direction, even when its accuracy is lower.

If you want to ask about a specific read I had though, go ahead; I can explain any of them!
In post 635, Tracer Bullet wrote:except tictac/Meg cuz I don't remember any posts by either player(I've also got shit for memory)
tictac's looking like the same town tictac I've seen in my last two or three games with tictac.

MegAzumarill is similarly looking vaguely town to me.
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Post Post #802 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 6:09 pm

Post by Toogeloo »

Is this the scum pt? No? Whoops.

I'm not gonna read anything tonight.





Actually, I'm probably not going to read anything prior to this post at all if I'm being honest. But miracles do happen.
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Post Post #803 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 6:22 pm

Post by bnuuy »

This game is moving at a pretty comfortable pace rn
It went fast for the first 12 or so hours but slowed after
“Merely by existing, we hurt each other.
But it’s not always intentional.”

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Post Post #804 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 6:23 pm

Post by mastina »

In post 692, MegAzumarill wrote:People should stop acting like every role is forced to be able to be from any faction. The setup has elements of randomization but nothing says its entirely random. So, the takeaway should be any role can be any faction, but any role can also just not be randomized. Saying you don't believe a claim because it would be able to be randomized where the game would be unbalanced is not a valid arguement because that literally may not be a possibility
To be honest the main reason Meg's not townier to me is that Meg's posts are so townie to me that it's keeping me from townreading Meg harder because I've not townread Meg this hard when MegAzumarill was actually town. :P
In post 651, NorwegianboyEE wrote:Flavour Leaf you have been very useless today, thank you.
(I mean he IS scum so...)
In post 661, Save The Dragons wrote:malcolm's posts feel fangless
In a scum-indicative way, yes.
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Post Post #805 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 6:29 pm

Post by mastina »

Mala your scumgame and towngame are stupidly different. Like, night/day different.
In post 744, bnuuy wrote:have you ever "played" with momo before, Tracer?
I have and I seem to recall that statistically speaking, momo replaces out more often as scum than as town, so......

NorwegianboyEE
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Save The Dragons
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bnuuy = MalcolmTucker

Enchant
butterchurn = Flavor Leaf = MonkeyMan576



Locktown of Locktown, Locktown, Strong Town, honestly-just-assuming-town, lean-town, null, lean scum, scumread, Scum.
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Post Post #806 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 6:47 pm

Post by Wallflower »

I keep trying to read through the last 10 or so pages but right now my eyes glaze over and I keep forgetting what it is I'm even doing (I am quite tired rn!!) I do have some thoughts, such as being okay with the Malcolm wagon, but also that Malcolm's response to it will be telling. I also agree with catboi re: the MonkeyMan wagon whilst also remaining suspicious of catboi (yes, I cannot seem to just let it go) so that's probably going to need some sorting out at some point, but right right now that's just too complex a thought so it will just be staying there as mafia soup in my mind.
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Post Post #807 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 6:47 pm

Post by Toogeloo »

How do you have a scum lean on a slot that never even picked up their role PM?
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Post Post #808 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 6:53 pm

Post by Toogeloo »

In post 641, Cephrir wrote:momo will be replaced if they fail to pick up their role PM by tomorrow morning.
Momo didn't skip out on the game because they didn't like their role PM. They didn't even open it.

I am town because I made Ceph promise me that I would be town before I replaced in*. So, nyeh! :P

*not really, no mod would do that.
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Post Post #809 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 7:06 pm

Post by catboi »

In post 747, Menalque wrote:
In post 715, catboi wrote:Malcolm looks like he's genuinely solving
uh

where?
Don't like the initial vote on monkey but although underexplained is a start, and to looks like he's trying to actually analyze and figure out monkeyman rather than blindly pushing him. That kind of progression can be faked but monkeyman is still a wagon, could easily keep pushing it, instead forcing himself to give other thoughts. The immediate evaluation of Norwee unprompted in looked like he saw someone and decided to investigate, like he's pulling at threads to see what comes out. And again similar where he digs up a cassowary post in when it's not being discussed by anyone, and it's interesting, thoughtful analysis picking at someone's post. Not necessarily on board with a hypocrisy case but the reasoning feels more detailed than you typically get from noob-scum

For a newer player it's fairly decent, hasn't felt like he's making pushes in a dishonest way, and is looking for things to analyze. Don't get the hate? I get he annoyed you by pushing you but I don't think it looked ill intentioned.
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Post Post #810 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 7:59 pm

Post by Cat Scratch Fever »

mfw everything catboi said about mastina was right
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Post Post #811 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 8:12 pm

Post by MalcolmTucker »

In post 790, MonkeyMan576 wrote:I don't like being on the same wagon as Tucker now that I think about it.

VOTE: MalcomTucker
Out of interest, what changed your mind re voting for me? A while back you seemed pretty comfortable with how I was playing, even when I was voting for you. Strikes me as a bit of an opportunistic vote here.
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Post Post #812 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 8:15 pm

Post by MalcolmTucker »

In post 809, catboi wrote:
In post 747, Menalque wrote:
In post 715, catboi wrote:Malcolm looks like he's genuinely solving
uh

where?
Don't like the initial vote on monkey but although underexplained is a start, and to looks like he's trying to actually analyze and figure out monkeyman rather than blindly pushing him. That kind of progression can be faked but monkeyman is still a wagon, could easily keep pushing it, instead forcing himself to give other thoughts. The immediate evaluation of Norwee unprompted in looked like he saw someone and decided to investigate, like he's pulling at threads to see what comes out. And again similar where he digs up a cassowary post in when it's not being discussed by anyone, and it's interesting, thoughtful analysis picking at someone's post. Not necessarily on board with a hypocrisy case but the reasoning feels more detailed than you typically get from noob-scum

For a newer player it's fairly decent, hasn't felt like he's making pushes in a dishonest way, and is looking for things to analyze. Don't get the hate? I get he annoyed you by pushing you but I don't think it looked ill intentioned.
This is fairly correct on my thinking so far - for what it's worth I've not been as proactive as I generally like to be in terms of making reads up until now but I sometimes struggle with forming particularly firm reads in D1, especially if the game is a bit patchy with no central or definitive conflicts that have emerged yet.
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Post Post #813 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 8:15 pm

Post by MalcolmTucker »

I'm still really unsure what to make of Monkey so far, their plays feels inconsistent and opportunistic at times but not sure their approach is conductive to scum wanting to stay hidden or under the radar.
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Post Post #814 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 8:23 pm

Post by Cat Scratch Fever »

In post 670, Save The Dragons wrote:
In post 666, MegAzumarill wrote:
In post 661, Save The Dragons wrote:malcolm's posts feel fangless
Do you think this is scum or town indicative, I can see arguements for this meaning either
i think this is scum indicative

what do you think
I don't think "toothless" is a good reason to scumread Malcolm. I basically tunneled the guy for an entire Newbie game for writing the hedgiest posts and not having really strong opinions all game, and he ended up flipping town.
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Post Post #815 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 8:28 pm

Post by Cat Scratch Fever »

In post 714, butterchurn wrote:It's also worth mentioning that in the next post, Cat Scratch Fever says that it's "not a bad vote". This sort of tacit support for a wagon without following it or giving any reason behind it is something that catches my eye. Cat Scratch Fever, what made you think that this was not a bad vote?
Just generally not really vibing with his reads, especially his Mena toneread. His initial catboi push also pinged as reachy
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Post Post #816 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 8:30 pm

Post by MalcolmTucker »

I tend to have hedgy posts early game because inevitably we're all working in the dark. I'll suggest ideas and possible theories but generally be pretty open on my uncertainties and possible contradictions to what I'm saying. Occasionally I'll identify a player who I really think is mafia and push strongly but I'm inevitably incorrect when I do so.
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Post Post #817 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 8:31 pm

Post by MalcolmTucker »

I think CSF is quite townie for pointing the above out though given I know I'm town. Feels like a meta detail which wouldn't be worth bringing up for scum looking for a wagon to build.
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Post Post #818 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 8:34 pm

Post by MalcolmTucker »

In post 66, Sword of Ducks wrote:somehow I'm having flashbacks to my first mafia game, when I just walked into the thread and saw a bunch of things happening at once

that's this, again
In post 69, Sword of Ducks wrote:Anyway, how's everyone's day going? I don't have much to do today, so I can actually have free time.
In post 107, Sword of Ducks wrote:VOTE: catboi

honestly I don't know what happening but am choosing to go with it for the moment
In post 278, Sword of Ducks wrote:arg how'd I miss this much with a simple shower god

can someone fill me in please
In post 479, Sword of Ducks wrote:Can someone give me an update on what's happened while I was taking stupid mandatory testing?
In post 580, Sword of Ducks wrote:Alright, school's over, what'd I miss?
In post 586, Sword of Ducks wrote:
In post 585, Nashville Dreams wrote:
In post 583, cassowary wrote:
In post 580, Sword of Ducks wrote:Alright, school's over, what'd I miss?
What if, instead of asking this, you read over what was posted since you
last
asked this, and then told us what you thought about it?
He's not going to.
The general consensus is to vote me because I'm inactive, which is okay. I have PSSAs and can't play the 'catch-up' game when I'm in a room for two hours with no access to my phone to keep track of you people.
Looking through Sword's ISO, getting a bit of a townie vibe...I'm not sure self-conscious mafia would ask so many catch-up questions, other ways to post filler I think that are less likely to attract attention. Interested to see how they play going forward though.
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Post Post #819 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 9:06 pm

Post by Cat Scratch Fever »

Looking into MonkeyMan, I realized I have actually played with him before on his NoPowerOverMe aka David Bowie alt, and his inability to effectively answer basic questions is probably not alignment indicative. And I'm also getting the impression that he believes in his scumread on people voting for the BP claim

VOTE: MegA
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Post Post #820 (ISO) » Wed Apr 27, 2022 9:59 pm

Post by NorwegianboyEE »

Wouldn’t it be funny if Mastina’s huge explanation of their usage of an system they cannot really describe in full because of hod complex it is, is just an fancy way of saying: "gut check"
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Post Post #821 (ISO) » Thu Apr 28, 2022 12:21 am

Post by Sword of Ducks »

I can see this day going one of three ways:
I say something stupid and get shot, your loss.
Someone else gets shot, probably our loss.
We can't agree on a target and one of us gets shot, most likely definitely our loss.
So either we come to some idea of a target or this day is going to be lost. Alright?
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Post Post #822 (ISO) » Thu Apr 28, 2022 12:29 am

Post by NorwegianboyEE »

Yes, we have an idea right there. It's Malcolm.
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Post Post #823 (ISO) » Thu Apr 28, 2022 12:44 am

Post by The Keeper »

In post 813, MalcolmTucker wrote:I'm still really unsure what to make of Monkey so far, their plays feels inconsistent and opportunistic at times but not sure their approach is conductive to scum wanting to stay hidden or under the radar.
I think you've just been hit with a Rotten Tomato.
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Post Post #824 (ISO) » Thu Apr 28, 2022 1:04 am

Post by MalcolmTucker »

In post 822, NorwegianboyEE wrote:Yes, we have an idea right there. It's Malcolm.
Just read back and your main contention with me seems to be that I didn't go anywhere after initially shading you but I don't think that's a big issue here - I was pointing out that despite making a lot of posts you had a lot of filler content all the same, not as if I voted for you. Although your sudden suspicion of me afterwards, as you admit a proper conviction read, feels a little bit weird to me, and a bit of a desperate reason to be going after someone.
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