Not Quite Normal Multiball II (Game Over)

[MonkeyMan576]

Which wagon argument, that there are scummy people on Nashville's wagon? What's been disproven about it?

The argument basically was that too many people support the elimination for it to be scum. Which is ridiculous as you could make that argument for any elimination that goes through in a game this large. He'll probably say it again about bnuuy if that wagon continues to gain traction.

Okay that makes sense. Yeah that is obv a fallacy.

[SCP 682]

Nuance exists.

[Flavor Leaf]

Which wagon argument, that there are scummy people on Nashville's wagon? What's been disproven about it?

The argument basically was that too many people support the elimination for it to be scum. Which is ridiculous as you could make that argument for any elimination that goes through in a game this large. He'll probably say it again about bnuuy if that wagon continues to gain traction.

Minimizing it.

That is 1, hear it? ONE ARGUMENT

MASTINA HAS TOWN CASED NASHVILLE.

I have given my thoughts on the slot.

Do not minimize.

[MonkeyMan576]

The fact that you're willing to elim someone just to elim is sus first of all.

actually at this point it's v protown so long as it's not on an actual TR

hard disagree.

[Flavor Leaf]

Nuance exists.

you're wrong on catboi full stop.

[Ydrasse]

it’s also weird to contextualize norwee/catboi’s back and forth as teamed tbqh given that grudges were drawn into it

you don’t really fake stuff like that

passing thought

[SCP 682]

ok im out now
wagon bunny

[Menalque]

People are protecting catboi because they like catboi, not because they actually believe he's town.

It's day 1.

Menalque, you actively have town read Catboi hard early.

There's like so much damning things people just dont wanna see it.

Post game, I will be proven correct, and thus I will continue pushing.

actually it's because I think catboi is a strong player and that most D1 reads on him are worthless but he has a 13:9 chance of being town and I've jived with some of his posting/his reads are similar to mine

I don't think catboi is impossible to read, but I think it's a lot easier with flips, and I'm not willing to jettison him D1 based on some gut feel shit when I don't see any of it and when there's a bunch of slots with decent scum equity who are, frankly and with no offence intended, less likely to hammer and pick out scum later in the game if they're town than catboi is

the fact I like catboi personally probably plays into a bit, sure, in the same way I'm not seriously pushing you today for much the same reasons (even though in your case I think the odds you have a non-town alignment are much higher)

[Ydrasse]

like ig flavor you feel salty that you’re not being given a pass for ... being salty

idk

[SCP 682]

i town read norwee already but ydra solidified it

[catboi]

hi ydrasse welcome to the hellgame

[Ydrasse]

nya!!!!

[MonkeyMan576]

it’s also weird to contextualize norwee/catboi’s back and forth as teamed tbqh given that grudges were drawn into it

you don’t really fake stuff like that

passing thought

Even if catboi is town, there are too many people on the record on him to ignore him as todays elimination. But he's probably not town.

[Menalque]

hi ydrasse welcome to the hellgame

we're killing bnuuy again, get onboard

[butterchurn]

Which wagon argument, that there are scummy people on Nashville's wagon? What's been disproven about it?

The argument basically was that too many people support the elimination for it to be scum. Which is ridiculous as you could make that argument for any elimination that goes through in a game this large. He'll probably say it again about bnuuy if that wagon continues to gain traction.

Minimizing it.

That is 1, hear it? ONE ARGUMENT

MASTINA HAS TOWN CASED NASHVILLE.

I have given my thoughts on the slot.

Do not minimize.

I was clearly not referring to your entire towncase. I'm aware that you have other reasons for townreading the slot. I was mentioning that I don't think that one argument is a good one, and MonkeyMan asked me to expand on that.

[Flavor Leaf]

Spoiler:

I don't find that bnuuy's latest posts are out of the range of what I would expect them to do if they were scum here. The wagon feels like it fell apart a little quickly. Maybe just because I was raised in the mafia of an earlier time, but I tend to have more inertia than is typical on this site these days. It takes me longer to turn towards scumreading or voting someone, and once I do, it takes me longer to turn away. These sorts of speed wagons rising up and falling away are not really something that's familiar to me. It feels closer to chat mafia at times. Which is not always a bad thing, but it may mean that I should be relying a bit more on gut reads. I agree with Menalque, though, that there's no point in wagoning for pressure if the pressure drops away at the slightest hint of a towny response. This makes me feel like some of the people riding the wave of the wagon didn't genuinely want it to go through, and were just waiting for an excuse to jump back off.

I think the wagon was super scummy. Makes bnuuy lock town and catboi or wallflower likely scum.

I think Menalque just lives in Catboi's pocket, and did what he could to get pressure off of catboi. I think Menalque jumped in by themselves, for the most part.

Menalque's see my towngame and my scumgame, and this isn't my scumgame.

I don't find that bnuuy's latest posts are out of the range of what I would expect them to do if they were scum here. The wagon feels like it fell apart a little quickly. Maybe just because I was raised in the mafia of an earlier time, but I tend to have more inertia than is typical on this site these days. It takes me longer to turn towards scumreading or voting someone, and once I do, it takes me longer to turn away. These sorts of speed wagons rising up and falling away are not really something that's familiar to me. It feels closer to chat mafia at times. Which is not always a bad thing, but it may mean that I should be relying a bit more on gut reads. I agree with Menalque, though, that there's no point in wagoning for pressure if the pressure drops away at the slightest hint of a towny response. This makes me feel like some of the people riding the wave of the wagon didn't genuinely want it to go through, and were just waiting for an excuse to jump back off.

I think the wagon was super scummy. Makes bnuuy lock town and catboi or wallflower likely scum.

I think Menalque just lives in Catboi's pocket, and did what he could to get pressure off of catboi. I think Menalque jumped in by themselves, for the most part.

Menalque's see my towngame and my scumgame, and this isn't my scumgame.

how many times has he caught scum you?

He hard guiltied me in one of the games I lost last year, I would've been primed to go the distance if he hadn't re-evaluated on me. I took a gamble that he wouldn't investigate me and lost. Was scum with me in my last game where I basically sobbed and AtE'd my way out of pressure all game.

this is another pairing that I've been bringing up to case Catboi.

They tried to use Menalque as being able to read them since they know town and scum them, but then after I pressured on how many times has he caught scum him, he brought up Menalque town reading Catboi early for days on end, and then reevaluating scum him, meaning that Catboi knows that Menalque has the capabilities of town reading him as scum, especially early game yet he still tried to use this as a defense reasoning.

Spoiler:

damage control for what

Probably a Catboi partner

There’s definitely scum in the people that are defending/town reading Catboi. At least 1, even if Catboi ends up being town

I'm fairly certain there's much more than 3 people defending me, so it's not like they can all be my partners. I wouldn't doubt that there's some scum defending me, just by sheer amount of numbers and the fact that not every scum is going to want to push an elim, especially if they think I'm town, but this is a very vague accusation. It's a broad brush stroke that avoids getting into specifics about who might be scum to instead blanket discredit the people defending me.

Another instance of my being minimized by Catboi.

I say at least 1, then they say not like they can all be my partners. They paint it like i'm pushing a vague accusation, yet they agree that there's scum defending me.

I'm not there to avoid getting into specifics, I'm specifically making note of who defends. I actively talk about who I believe is town in those scenarios, such as when I say I believed Menalque to be pocketed, and that I believed Nashville just wasn't in the game.

So Catboi acting like I was avoiding getting into specifics when I had actively been analyzing each set of this is just untrue.

I super dislike flavor leaf maneuvering toward a possible elim of mastina for the beloved princess claim

Another minimization, and shows that even back then Catboi was minimizing my reasonings for scum reading Mastina.

VOTE: Catboi

Forgot the vote.

and here I almost had faith in you

classic, honestly

This is the kind of thing Catboi's been doing, and I think SCP fell in the pocket after this.

If you notice this leads into Catboi butterchurn protection and turning SCP's butter scum read around, and then SCP gets cold feet on Catboi after seeing it.

They actively got played and turned around by Catboi.

And this is the type of play Catboi's been subtly doing all around.

he rewards the players when they town read them, and then talks in a "disappointed" kind of way.


This is also the type of thing they would try to say I'm doing, but I don't talk in a disappointed type of way, I push/go after, which is not helpful if I were coming from a scum perspective, correct? Just makes noise.


Catboi uses this tactic to get players to switch.


Catboi is using their tone to get people to read them as town.

Regardless of whether you/Klick are scum together or not, I think that you presented an invalid reason for why you/Klick cannot be scum together, claiming my theory to be dumb as a result.

On an unrelated note, I didn’t like the implication that if Klick were your scumbuddy he wouldn’t have the autonomy to do something like vote for you without it being your command, but that’s just a separate pet peeve sort of thing.

To elaborate: it is not just "lol scum RVS distancing" (though that tell is

so old

it can probably legally buy alcohol and is almost never accurate) but that klick made a serious effort tostart a wagon on me and made a case on me to the point it would amount to an intentional throw if scum

the way you are talking about this feels more like you just

want

it to be true rather than whether you've considered if it's

likely

I don't think this is as clearing as you're making it out to be tbh

i just tend to get annoyed when people suggest really dumb theories

Another Catboi-Cat Scratch potential partnering post.

And another instance of Cat

Scratch

boi tone manipulation.

In no shape or form is the Klick/Catboi a 'dumb theory'

This is completely a discrediting tactic to wallflower here.

It might be wrong, sure, but it is not a 'really dumb theory', especially on Day 1.

[Menalque]

there are too many people on the record on him to ignore him as todays elimination

lolwhut

[cassowary]

Yeah I feel like FL's town-ND argument can equally be applied to any wagon that has traction to reach majority which makes it seem like FL just doesn't want to eliminate ND

I could go for bnuuy elimination today as well

nice do it please

Yeah ok

VOTE: bnuuy

I am not liking cassowary ftr. First he is on the Nashville wagon and now he's willing to hop over to a bnuuy wagon, pun intended.

(she)

I mean, I'd rather get rid of someone than have a no-elimination, and I think ND and bnuuy both look kinda sus, what's the issue?

The fact that you're willing to elim someone just to elim is sus first of all. I don't think you really think they look sus except that they have had wagons against them.

Oh yeah? Well,

I

think I

do

really think they look sus! Check and mate baybee

Like... I mean yeah there are other people I think look sus who it would be harder to gain traction on, but I'm not gonna pull out a wild vanity wagon, that's not actually helpful, so I'm gonna give consideration to the major targets and vote them if I agree with the wagon. That's just how you play the game

[MonkeyMan576]

there are too many people on the record on him to ignore him as todays elimination

lolwhut

If we flip him, we know his alignment. Then we can look back to what other people said or voted to discern their alignment.

[Flavor Leaf]

Which wagon argument, that there are scummy people on Nashville's wagon? What's been disproven about it?

The argument basically was that too many people support the elimination for it to be scum. Which is ridiculous as you could make that argument for any elimination that goes through in a game this large. He'll probably say it again about bnuuy if that wagon continues to gain traction.

Minimizing it.

That is 1, hear it? ONE ARGUMENT

MASTINA HAS TOWN CASED NASHVILLE.

I have given my thoughts on the slot.

Do not minimize.

I was clearly not referring to your entire towncase. I'm aware that you have other reasons for townreading the slot. I was mentioning that I don't think that one argument is a good one, and MonkeyMan asked me to expand on that.

Yeah, people just don't know how wagons work.

[Ydrasse]

it’s also weird to contextualize norwee/catboi’s back and forth as teamed tbqh given that grudges were drawn into it

you don’t really fake stuff like that

passing thought

Even if catboi is town, there are too many people on the record on him to ignore him as todays elimination. But he's probably not town.

i can ignore it by simply voting elsewhere

~

known as i am to divine ate and all that i do feel that the nature of why catboi got upset makes more sense as town than to think the cat decided to fake a joker moment and lower his mafia moral scruples for this game

maybe he did but it’s enough to not make him a priority to vote today

[SCP 682]

would you say that abt nsg or rc lol

[Flavor Leaf]

like ig flavor you feel salty that you’re not being given a pass for ... being salty

idk

Nah, this was happening far before I was salty here.

[Menalque]

there are too many people on the record on him to ignore him as todays elimination

lolwhut

If we flip him, we know his alignment. Then we can look back to what other people said or voted to discern their alignment.

we can... do this with literally any slot? if people haven't taken stances on another slot then we can make them/their own votes and willingness/unwillingness to talk about said slot will reveal stances related to it

this is not a good argument for doing any slot in the game over

literally any other slot in the game

[SCP 682]

just passed by a no salt allowed sign
The irony