League of Legends (Old)

[RayFrost]

More a matter of I had a fuckton of technical issues which lead to my neck getting shit down due to the d/c'ing, so not much learning or arrogance but a lot of frustration for all parties. That and solo top.

Though the fact I was playing with nuwen might have something to do with it too (I'm kidding).

Admittedly if you didn't have game shut downs / internet shut downs mid-game you'd have a more pleasant experience.

[RayFrost]

Mercs stop snare, yes.

Though ryze's build is funny as hell.

[RayFrost]

Alternatively you can beat the crap out of zilean and force him to ult himself and then kill his team.

[RayFrost]

Right, my thought was that Yorick can't stop a carry from dying entirely with his ult all counters being ignored.

Yorick's ult is

very rarely

used to revive. It's more of a dps-adder to the team. Think of it like a (ad) shaco clone: you make it to increase the deeeeeps by creating a

second version

of the deeeps bringer. (thinking about it yorick ult on shaco would be funny as hell). Two full health caitlyns beating the crap out of the enemy team and then if you happen to kill the original caitlyn she's still bringing in some extra dps.

[RayFrost]

Your focus was "LETS FOCUS ON WHAT ZILEAN DOES HERE AND THEN SAY THE OTHER GUY DOESNT DO IT" tho? Since yorick's ult is not an "extra life" ult.

Seems a bit out of whack.

[RayFrost]

Disclaimer: I am barely qualified to teach her anything and just basically repeat "STOP SPAMMING ALL YOUR SKILLS AND GET SOME FARM DAMMIT"

[RayFrost]

Abilties:

Rolling Thunder:

Volibear drops to all fours and runs faster if chasing an enemy champion. The first enemy he attacks is knocked into the air.

Frenzy:

Volibear's repeated attacks grant him additional attack speed. Once Volibear has repeatedly attacked four times, he can perform a vicious bite on his target.

Majestic Roar:

Volibear lets out a powerful roar that damages and slows enemies. Minions and monsters are feared as well.

Thunder Claws (Ultimate):

Volibear channels the power of the storm causing his attacks to blast his targets with lightning that bounces to other nearby enemies.

Chosen of the Storm (passive):

Volibear heals rapidly for a few seconds when his health drops to a critical level.

W: Mini jax ult

Q: combo of vayne passive and one-strike xin q

E: holy fuck junglebears everywhere

Ult: Melee based brand ult?

Passive: FREE HEALZ

[RayFrost]

I'd figure more sustainable but still speedy junglers would become more popular, and cho fits the bill rather nicely. WW is going to go more and more out of fashion, I think. With the ability to farm all day erry day, faster clears are superior, and ww is simply too slow to really capitalize effectively. He'll end up even further behind.

And I think nunu's probably not going to be in fashion anymore: counterjungling has far less benefits with a faster respawn rate.

[RayFrost]

If you didn't jungle him, I have 0 respect for you.

[RayFrost]

On deathcap:

What's the benefit of rushing deathcap over getting, say, the catalyst and then going for deathcap after? I understand that deathcap provides a

tremendous as fuck

boost to your damage, but catalyst provides 1) sustainbility for spellspamming, 2) the ability to heal up after harass. How do you come to a decision on whether to rush the hat or get the sustain and delay the cap by a bit?

[RayFrost]

so if there is an item that is 50,000 AP for 50,000 gold are you going to save up and buy it? because that is a really good ratio!
Also Fizz does not have high CC.

If something provides 10 ap for 200 gold are you going to buy it? It doesn't cost much (or build into anything but that's nbd rite)! Not really a good point.
Also fizz has high burst.

Espy: what da fuck would an ap youmuu's be? Cdr over a short period of time and ap boost? I really don't get the concept.

SRG: Dunno how what you said relates to my catalyst / cap question.

[RayFrost]

I always get a wriggles when I junglesion.

Is that k?

P.s.: I'm being serious.

[RayFrost]

Dear derp1 and derp2, notice we discuss item order not just if you get them.

But if you want to keep herp derping along then feel free to ignore us.

I always tend to go madred's razors -> boots -> wriggles when jungling sion.

Is it an okay build order or are there better items to go for beforehand in some instances?

Also asked a question about catalyst into deathcap that never got answered.

Apologies if I'm too much of a derp to be very clear.

[RayFrost]

I'd say, if you can, feed the blue instead of getting red, go b, get red, then gank - don't waste the red time.

[RayFrost]

Ok... I just got stomped. So damn hard. I was playing with a friend who usually plays at a high level... and I was teemo in bot lane... I got harassed just a bit by janna + cait and died so fast. This was the very beginning. Omg...

And I really need to get on my CS. I don't usually have good CS.

Any tips with CS? Like what's the best action (attack + move etc) and how to prevent yourself from hitting the wrong minion? And timing too. My timing is always off...

Practice with CS'ing is what is key. With someone like teemo, it's actually easier to last hit with your auto since it's got a damage proc.

I'd say look at the number of minions hitting it: if there's two casters it'll lose health at a different rate than if it's a siege and a caster. Take the animation of their attacks into account as well as your own (often the key to getting a minion is timing your auto to hit just after a minion's auto). Basically all auto's have a projectile speed, etc.

On hitting the wrong minion: just make sure the re aura is on the right one.

Always be mobile in lane. There is never a time in lane where you *want* to sit still. Most of the CS'ing mastery comes from practice, though.

[RayFrost]

DJPON3: you'd benefit yourself if you changed the URL for the link to "own3d.tv/djpon3/" instead of "own3d.com/djpon3/" - the first brings it to your stream, the other doesn't.

Edit:

KASSADIN

LEONA

FIZZ

TALON

FREE WEEK.

[RayFrost]

KASSADIN

oh dear god please no

welp, guess this week's a good time to finally learn to play AD champs <_<

Urgot happens to be free too.

Good luck with that ad learning. Try not to get spiked in the face.

[RayFrost]

Ahhh the joys of blitzcrank.

Pull everything for days, mana shield tank everything, knock bitches up like genghis khan.

[RayFrost]

I've had this problem where the game's frame rates go so low that its completely unplayable. But that's probably my computer.

How low are talking? If it's around 10, man up. It's what I do every game. >:|

Espy: you need to update lolrecorder or go to your task manager and shut it down before a game. That *should* fix it. If it doesn't, direct yourself to the support forum.

[RayFrost]

I feel really alone in being excited about the new support.
WHERE IS JD TO SHARE MY ENTHUSIASM!?

My excitement is held in check by the possibilities that 1) this isn't a support and 2) that it's horribly made.

[RayFrost]

Btw, new tiamat #1 es fiora.

[RayFrost]

I have come to the conclusion that I play my best when absolutely silent while solo q. Only mia and pings. Mostly because I'm bad and typing is too distracting.

[RayFrost]

talk more rayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyfrostttttttttttttttttttttttttttt
use your mouth wordssssssss
ffffff

Note "solo q"

Also, no.

[RayFrost]

I have come to the conclusion that I play my best when absolutely silent while solo q. Only mia and pings. Mostly because I'm bad and typing is too distracting.

You DO type a shitload whenever we play. >_____>

Screw AP Yi, DUNKMASTER YI.

In premade q I don't plan on speaking at all. :p

[RayFrost]

So guys, I've come to the conclusion that the only champion I can be beastly with is Janna.

Is this a good or bad sign.

[RayFrost]

Getting 420 cs as an ad carry feels

amazing

.

ROLLIN IN DA GOLD.

[RayFrost]

If riot hates sustain so much, I'm confused by the fact they're leaving udyr's so completely untouched: doesn't he have one of the highest sustaining abilities in the game?

[RayFrost]

1. WW is still a jungler.
2. Unless you're Vayne?
3. Can he reach the carry, was the support out of position?

[RayFrost]

So I've been trying sivir out lately. I don't hate her as much as I used to. I actually think I figured out my problems with her before aside from it being pre-rework shittiness: I didn't know how to really use her spellshield or time my poke. Ended up wasting too much mana before fights really happened. Now I'm all farm farm farm take three towers while my team's fighting farm farm. Feelsgoodman.

[RayFrost]

Something more believable might be that he works better by using familiar sounds (his playlist) to drown out the potential random sounds of the environment (birds, cars, phones, etc), as the latter is more distracting than the former, yes?

[RayFrost]

Better off?

An attempt to do self-deprecating humor.

[RayFrost]

It really depends on what you're using in the jungle / what you're up against, but the general rule to avoid being counter jungled is ward fucking everything. If you ward all your jungle entrances, you can always catch them when they go in, which allows you to coordinate a gank. There's no real way to stop them walking in, but if you can punish them, then they'll stop doing it.

Edit: in the case of a not-helpful team, you can try and take their shit in retaliation, or gank the lanes more often, to try and make up for lost value.

[RayFrost]

God I fucking suck at everything but support.

I need to play non-support more often

Edit: I think the main problem with playing support so much with teammates that are very farmy is that I no longer do much aggression. I never try and push at my lane opponent, so I end up just eating harass all day with no retaliation

[RayFrost]

That sounds like a poor way to play support. One thing practically every support can do very well is push opponents out of the lane agressively. All have relative high base stats. You should be making room for your ad carry, and trying to shut down the opponents one, only occasionally needing help from yours.

I actually misrepresented what I do as a support: I'm extremely fight-happy when I go support. I don't do a lot of harass, since what I go for is simply going in, killing them, done (note: I do JANNA and JANNA and JANNA and the sometimes-rarely-almost-never alistar). I've got decent/good situation assessment for the support, imo, but this judgment doesn't extend to ap mid or solo top (I'm

never

ranged ad).

I try to focus on farming and end up poked to death, but the times I do try to fight I lose. I don't have the skill to assess

why

that particular fight was bad, or when to pick a fight, so learning is rough. Basically just me expressing frustration with about three/five repeated failures in mid today.

[RayFrost]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaBLqLCT ... re=channel

[RayFrost]

Uhhh tantrum does reset on minion autos. Tears are % max health, a lot of reliable damage on even bruisers. It's a soft garen e that scales into late game, basically. AoE non-minion-aggro, annoying damage abilities = amumu's laning. Even at level one, tantrum reduces minion damage by a note-worthy amount: minion damage isn't

high

, there's just a lot of it which adds up. If you reduce every hit of the low damage, you win auto trades, np. Same principle as fizz's passive (or even eve's passive trololo). Add in mr shred from amumu's passive, and you're probably dealing near true damage levels on your abilities (if no mr runes) or at least a lot more than they can do to you (mr shred vs no armor/mr shred). Even if they've got higher base damage, minion added dps + your shred boost means you've got the edge or it's even. Also "sustained" damage is consistent dps, not heal-sustain. ;P

Anecdotal pre-30 information is iffy - you didn't have the runes / playing experience / etc to really judge it at the time or necessarily play it properly. Not to mention you could've been in a counter lane (ranged harass trololo), etc, etc, other anecdotal post-30 evidence of good lanemumu shit here.

[RayFrost]

On jd / brandi rawr-off: I feel jd's stance here is impacted by brandi's inappropriate application of the same attitude in the past, etc, etc, stop biting.

Edit: Also, dram's comment was pointless. Come now, huggleowl, provide content to back your opinions (and try not to be rude).

[RayFrost]

You are right but, I was being dumb for some reason. It does reset by .5 seconds like it says it does. I tried it in a custom game really quick to be sure and I guess it didn't seem like the ".5" was going as fast as it said. But it definitely was.

Point of interest, tower hits also proc the passive.

Tears are % max health, a lot of reliable damage on even bruisers.

But it's not significant at all at rank 1.

Even if the minion damage isn't a lot, you are still possibly taking damage from your lane opponent.

Base + max health is "significant" in that it's around two extra melee minions of damage per second. And on the second point: and they're possibly taking damage from you? Kinda don't get your point: mine was that

you and your opponent are both hitting each other and taking minion aggro, you're hurt less by minion aggro

.

Also "sustained" damage is consistent dps, not heal-sustain. ;P

I don't believe that constant DPS is enough to 1v1 anyone toplane at the early levels.

I actually just tested my amumu laning slightly against bots: amumu's e is significant harass with an auto-e-auto even if you don't do a full out trade. This idea wouldn't change much against a real person, I imagine (tho minor details like the fact I've got runes and bots don't would play in blahdeeblah).

On the other hand-

the reason this could be is because of all the new champions there are- that people just don't like playing Mummy and he is unpopular. In the way that Yorick is unpopular but actually very very good.

However- I have seen amumu's in 3v3's. I think the very last 3v3 I played there was an amumu. Though that was a while ago as well. (I was fizz- amumu was on the other team. I can't remember the game itself I just know that I won. But probably because I got carried because I suck with Fizz.)

Ignoring elo stuff.

Also see: karma.

I also think you mentioned amumu's mana costs: his e is consistent 50 mana, np. 8 mana per second is also p. small. A *tiny* bit of mregen in runes would offset it, p. much. Just don't keep the shit on all day.

[RayFrost]

Solo Tops WITHOUT ranged CSing tools WITHOUT sustain: 9

Singed

Fizz

Leona
Sejuani

Volibear

Poppy

Wukong

Rammus
Amumu

And 4 of those are some of the strongest picks you can have for top lane, while at least 2 more are really good.

Curious, which is the fourth "some of the strongest picks" and the 2 "really good"?
I assume the bolded are three of the four...

Bolded a couple of others, no idea on the sixth between amumu/leona.

[RayFrost]

I've been witness and a part of a pretty good number of quadra/pentas.

I've had none.

[RayFrost]

Nocturne top, fid jungle, shaco/jarvan bot, anivia mid.

So much fears.

[RayFrost]

I'm pretty sure teemo skins are all slut skins.

Because it's fucking

teemo

.

[RayFrost]

I have no idea what you are talking about, I have wet dreams about Anivia nightly. They're always pretty chill.

I read brandi's post and was going to say basically the same thing.

Molla, y u so cool?

[RayFrost]

So it's a battle for cutest?

[RayFrost]

I am a huge supporter of cutecrank.

[RayFrost]

Not sure how big of an impact getting a lot of ms will have considering the soft caps on ms. Probably going to be a trinity fon ho-hum tankydps type champ rather than a dunkmaster or "lol swiftness because who needs to deal with cc" type.

Also, do slows reduce the bonus movespeed for the calculations of his abilities? If so, nasus says hi.

[RayFrost]

Blue team skin and hat advantage won the game.

Also: no haunting guise on leblanc when purple went like no mr es sad face.

[RayFrost]

Also, leblanc early d/c completely obliterates her relevance. I mean, if urgot d/c'd or some shit, you could deal with that by delaying for him to farm up, but lb? She gets ahead by putting all the things behind. Can't do that when you're sitting at level one across from ashe with trollface level six.

Tbh, JD, I felt your top play was rather good: annie wasn't aggressive, so you got a lot of leeway (and good ganks). Your ults were overall well timed, etc.

Highlight of that game for me was the reversal on shaco in mid where the shen ult on spygot gave spy the shaco kill and life. Big plays, big plays.

Edit: Ank said some of the things.

[RayFrost]

Yeah, that game was overall really solid play, especially spyspy. 6/0 forced mid still destroying all the things (I WISH I WAS AS GOOD AS THIS GUY HERE).

[RayFrost]

Morgana, vlad, talon (counterpick trololo), kassadin.

[RayFrost]

What are you looking for with a mid?

CC whore? Single target nuker? AoE damage dealer?

[RayFrost]

Maybe its a toggle like frost shot or old ricochet?

It says "Passive: x".
Besides, an on-hit with a manacost of 55? Actually, that'd be interesting, but this one ain't powerful enough.

15% of max health in magic damage every three auto + skill seems powerful (+150 from auto procs of the other bit on top of this).

What are you smoking?

[RayFrost]

You could just tell us your username and play with us, bro.

[RayFrost]

Infinity edge vs bloodthirster. Under which circumstances do you get each one first?

I'd say it depends on your situation and your champion:

are you going to be sitting there chillin' and just auto attacking all the things np? IE.

will you need to sustain yourself through a bit of damage? Perhaps they've got a poke comp for example. BT saves the day.

Someone who benefits a lot from raw ad (example: graves skills, corki passive/skills, ez skills)? I'd say BT is better.
Someone who doesn't have amazing raw ad scaling aside from being an ad carry (trist, mf to a small extent - her ult does have scaling, kog'maw to an extent - IIRC his ult has scaling)? IE.

I'd also have to admit to lately just going IE every time with a vamp scepter along the way. Also have to admit I'm a pretty mediocre ad.

[RayFrost]

It didn't have the best player on MS, espeonage, in it. Couldn't have been the greatest.

[RayFrost]

Those were the most intense, close cut blue buffs ever. Trundle almost managed to take 1 damage one of those times.

[RayFrost]

That decision to go to top tower was really dumb. In theory it would've worked with a completely perfect team since Trundle could've died and then rezzed with his GA at full health, but in practice...no.

Plus the ward placing PRETTY MUCH FUCKING STOPPED after about 35 minutes

Couple things.

1) GA doesn't heal to full health, only 750
2) The entire enemy team was also there

[RayFrost]

Trundle passive doesn't work if no enemies are dying. Only enemies there were the enemy team. You didn't stand a chance in hell for that team fight.

It was really just a poor move theoretically and realistically. Just take the open inhib, you win on even terms, push shit in, push shit in, make

some kind of use

of your advantage. The one you'd been sitting on for half an hour.

But anyway, that was... "fun" to watch. I learned many things.

[RayFrost]

I still don't know how we were able to come back from that.

Staeg making big plays.

All the big plays.

[RayFrost]

"initiated properly"

doesn't work with

"under the enemy tower"

So, no.

Also, JD does cast. His casting works by pointing out all the dumb things / things he finds good, but focusing on the dumb things.

[RayFrost]

...

LETS FACETANK THIS TOWER AND HAVE TRUNDLE LOSE HIS GA AS WE GET INTIATED ON BUT WELL BE K BECAUSE WE WIN THE TEAM FIGHT UNDER THEIR TOWER AGAINST A HIGH AOE ULT ENEMY TEAM.

Makes sense.

You can initiate under a tower easily in some circumstances. That shit definitely wasn't one of them. It wasn't "we messed up the follow through" it was "we messed up even trying that at all because it wasn't a situation we could afford it"

Note: nocturne ult allows jumping on the ad carry. Wukong charge and ult allows nuking of the ad carry and anyone else he hits. ziggs ult allows nuking of everything. Janna ult can easily push back the sona initiation under their tower, causing mass mayhem, etc. It was a bad idea.

[RayFrost]

what fucking part of THEORETICAL versus IN PRACTICE are you not fucking getting

Theoretically you had baron, they were all half health, and trundle had triple warmog's ga atma's fon and tanked that tower like a boss and you won because the enemy team was a buncha morons.

[RayFrost]

Ehm. Nobody aside from DRK has ever expressed distaste for playing with me. And he's since changed his mind from that, afaik. Edit: Nvm, he actually still doesn't like me at all but tolerates me for the sake of playing with others

And really I'm only reacting with as much snark as you are with assholeish comments (calling me retarded: real smooth, bro).

If you do it with "in theory it works" you can say a lot of things that would work if you change a the variables. In theory, we can send things into the core of the sun. We have current materials that can withstand the sun's core temperature. Let's ignore the fact the surface of the sun melts the shit out of it.

So yes, in theory, if you ignore the fact the entire enemy team was there and that they had stronger team fighting presence, you were tanking the tower before the fight started, and they had a shitton of shit to fuck you up, etc, it'd have been a brilliant move. I admit it. You're completely right.

[RayFrost]

Meh, I'll take the stick up my ass comment. I shouldn't be correcting people on anything. Seriously not emotionally involved in this, so yehhh. I'll bow at the knee.

The "didn't use to be such a dick" thing is kinda strange to me. Reck, have you played a single game with me where I used my mic? I can't recall any. I actually can't recall us having played since the dawn of time, almost. Like... when I said basically nothing ever.

[RayFrost]

The most intense moment for me was when our nexus was like 2/3 hp and riven came in for the bd. She got it to literally ONE hit away from dead when I finally killed her.

Really the best game I've had. Was insanely close cut and intense. MY HEART. STILL PUMPING.

[RayFrost]

Anivia's really blue reliant, so losing your blue as often as it happened was painful. That and morg is imo a pretty good counter to anivia: black shield the ice ball, black shield the ice storm, give no fucks.

P-edit: four hours of video. I think I'll watch them while I eat. I enjoyed the one I watched before I started playing, though.

[RayFrost]

So neRUZ, I think a lot of your issues in top lane against me stemmed from leveling your q over your w: you did more damage in the exchanges, but I had the sustain to bring myself back. You didn't. If you had leveled your w, it'd have given you sustain both during and out of the fights as well as giving you more armor/mr to deal with my damage output. I think that would've given you a significant advantage in the lane compared to the dps boost.

[RayFrost]

Me? WAT

Oh sorry.

Neruz. I mix names up. D:

[RayFrost]

I can technically co-cast if I'm 1) available when it's happening and 2) able to even spectate properly.

[RayFrost]

The problem with that is the number of purely unranked players. Take amrun for example. I'm largely in favor of just having jd pick five people to captain regardless of skill level or whatever.

[RayFrost]

OH BY THE WAY ESURIO HAS THE CUTEST SNEEZES EVER.

FORGOT TO MENTION THAT AFTER THAT ONE INHOUSE.

[RayFrost]

Go ahead you three, be negative.

I, for one, appreciate shanba's puns.

[RayFrost]

Scotmany.

[RayFrost]

ALSO who is Syndfull?

Hindu

[RayFrost]

/out for inhouses until I get a better computer.

Weighed my team down way too fucking much that game to feel right about doing more.

[RayFrost]

On the kog'maw pick: we were really worried about the lack of good initiation and blue team took ashe, so we went for something more poke-y since we didn't have the hard cc to win a team fight outright.

Edit: I could've bought a tear, but I felt I needed boots to avoid q's from peg (NOT THAT IT HELPED FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF). I would've been better off with tear stacking earlier, I agree.

Edit again: the kog'maw getting caught out was a misunderstanding by neruz: we said "POKE THE TOWER DONT JUST SIT BACK" and he went to tank the tower instead to try and get it.

[RayFrost]

I don't usually get a queue, but I live in Japan so.

On veigar: I play veig enough that I could

try

to face esurio if she wanted, but I have to admit to having both sub-optimal runes and less practice than patrick.

Also congrats brandi.

[RayFrost]

Also don't be afraid to use your w to last hit if you don't feel your auto will manage it.

You can also go a bit of early damage in items like building toward a phage instead of just rushing [insert tanky tank mctank item here].

[RayFrost]

I get confused when people yell at me for not throwing spears as nid when I've already placed three traps with them watching me do so.

[RayFrost]

Is ziggs so low on the list due to his relative lack of hard cc to help his team with? I notice basically everyone in the top tiers has a hard cc.

[RayFrost]

So guys.

I need an intervention, I've started playing eve and I've won three games out of three with her. I don't want to become addicted to something bad for me, but it feels good.

[RayFrost]

won three games out of three

That's definitely something that will take care of itself if you don't.

True.

Really really don't get how even with the enemy team having oracles on two people I manage to get by with rather few deaths. My god my solo q normal elo has gone to shit. Edit: or whatever fucking thing riot uses to determine solo q matchmaking.

[RayFrost]

Ohshit, shanba.

ONM GOING UP IN THE WORLD.

Btw congrats on getting so far guys. Sadly, I wasn't able to watch, but I should be able to check out the games from JD's recordings, so I can still be rooting for youw hile you play or something.

[RayFrost]

Finished watching the first game. Was beautiful. I need to sleep, but I'll watch other stuff later.

Note to self: 3 hour, 5 minutes.

[RayFrost]

Bonus gold from smite mastery.

[RayFrost]

Stream log watch.

25 minutes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[RayFrost]

So I heard brandi needed votes.

Like 5 from me, there you go. One short of 300.

[RayFrost]

Ryze changes make me laugh.

Oh you want to make my build for ryze stronger? Fuck yeah.

In case you aren't aware of my build, it ends up with ~4k mana, ~200+ ap, and a lot of tankiness.

Wota has always been good on ryze, it just got better.

[RayFrost]

K so I was looking at the pony things.

The nautilus. My god.

I'd honestly have a hard time choosing between brandi / that if I removed the whole "brandi's an awesome person that I knowwwwwwwww" stuff.

It and the mundo are my non-brandi favorites.

[RayFrost]

Why don't I ever run into scummers?

[RayFrost]

Congrats.

Meanwhile, at riot:

[RayFrost]

Also: guys, I can't seem to get spectator mode to work. I get to loading screen and everybody gets to summoning and then it just sits there. Forever. Any tips?

[RayFrost]

PROS OF URGOT:

Big tits
Shoots long distance razor blades all day
Even oranges don't make urgot ult k
People cry
Crabbbbbbbbbbb peopleeeeeeeeee (only applies with crabgot skin)

PROS OF MANTHEON:

MAAAAAAAAAAAAANDROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOP
Shield bash tower dive for dayzzzzz
Throw spears, stab with many spears, spears, spears, spears
Bakers are cool

[RayFrost]

It swaps anyway.

[RayFrost]

Hey esurio, drinks this weekend?

In serious:

how much sense does this make?

Don't really buy it.

[RayFrost]

That was kinda my thinking too.

If you wanted a ranged counter to bruisers, bruiser nid / lulu would fit more easily (and have better kit synergy imoimo).

[RayFrost]

kog'maw mad at everybody all game

kog'maw bad manner

make janna sad and mad

[RayFrost]

It`s the chinese stuff.
and how DARE Rayfrost play with pheonix after all the "ill never play with scummers again" talk ;_;

FULL PREMADE

INHAUS

v. different

edit: also, no longer get black screens, still low fps tho

[RayFrost]

Went top against a gp as vlad.

Our lee sin early ganked, getting gp pretty low. I then tower dove him for a kill. This puts it at gp level 2, no farm, against vlad level 4, some farm.

From there it snowballs into me freezing the lane by my tower and being level 8 when he's level 4, him having only 6 cs for 90% of the laning phase, and him not even being level 18 (he was 17) after a 54 minute game.

I have never felt more like a bully in my life.

[RayFrost]

It just seems restrictive to me. Not a lot of people try a champ for the first time there, but a lot of people don't want to spend a ton of money or time to own all the champs. Free week is often the only time people'll play them.

I'm pretty sure it's not actually possible to get to level 30 without earning enough IP along the way for all the 450 champs, so that's 9 champs right there. It shouldn't take very long at all to get enough IP for some 1350 champs, especially since you probably picked up enough to buy a few along with the 450 champs on the way to level 30.



TL:DR - If you're not an idiot and you buy the cheap champs it's easy as shit to get enough champs to play ranked. Want to play ranked? Buy the fucking cheap champions to pad out your selection.

You're misunderstanding bv's point:

Not everybody is willing to spend money to get riot points to unlock [CHAMPION X] + [CHAMPION A] + [CHAMPION V] +[...]. You could have experience with them all but simply have preference for other / not have the ip for them / etc.

The point is "oh people won't be able to play the champions they want / will have a more limited selection in ranked (an undervalued thing: counters can make/break a lane)"

If you play this game long enough, you'll likely become comfortable / good with a lot of champions, many of which you won't own unless you get RIOT POINTS OR RIOT POINT ACCESSORIES. Free week's your chance to show off your super sexy swain abili- oh wait no free weeks allowed.

[RayFrost]

Or play DotA and have a screen.

A green one.

100% green.

With a side order of other green.

[/rayfrostdota2]

[RayFrost]

In other news: double buff soraka op. Auto harass bot lane allllll day, get kills on all the things.

[RayFrost]

Games against bots can give you a place to practice last hitting / learning what exactly each champion does on a basic level, but they don't really give you a good understanding of the other things.

Starting with them's probably fine, and having people play with you allow you to get some knowledge and such while you do things. From there, against people mayyy be a bit rough without some guidance, but it really depends.

[RayFrost]

The problem with squishes like annie top is they likely will never survive a gank if they are pushed up a little bit.

Well, annie specifically has a nicer spot up top than a lot of other squishies:

highest base auto attack range
a controllable pretty decent duration stun
mr/armor steroid on her e

[RayFrost]

The pleasure of being olaf, having the low health yi q onto you thinking that you being low health means he kills you, throwing an axe, and having it cleave his face.

AXES TO THE FACE.

[RayFrost]

Anyone who considers a low health Olaf to be anything but a serious threat is an idiot.

SO TRUE.

I WENT 1v3 AND JUST LOAFD MY WAY THROUGH IT.

Trow-axe kills are the bestest feeling.

AXE TOSS MALPHITE HAS BEEN SLAIN
AXE TOSS YI HAS BEEN SLAIN

AXE TOSS

[RayFrost]

If I wanted to play support, I'd... well... I'd just play 5s in general.

[RayFrost]

As far as I'm concerned, janna counters every other support in bot ever.

And cho counters every top.

[RayFrost]

I STILL DONT UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE STILL BUY SWIFTNESS BOOTS.


AGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGH

Because it helps you to reposition more easily as ashe. And if you get caught, you are dead anyway, mercs won't save you and attack speed boots are a bit mediocre anyway.

So it's "I don't know good positioning so I'm going to rely on this very small ms boost to make all the difference" type thing?

Don't get it.

[RayFrost]

If I random literally any hero in DotA, I don't need all four of my teammates to pick heroes specifically to support me in order to be effective.
Hell, I don't even need one.

You CAN do silly death combos to maximize the potential of your heroes, but you certainly don't need to.

If anything, DotA promotes more teamplay because you have to adapt to your teams picks.

?

[RayFrost]

What I see on chrono's team: poppy

What I see on the enemy team: vayne and lepop.

Squish.

[RayFrost]

Fucking riot servers.

I'm so mad I'm melting.

[RayFrost]

Ohey guys.

Remember that improvement to the fps thing they did?

I no longer game freeze. (still drop pretty low sometimes, but usually running ~15 now, which is more than manageable)

[RayFrost]

Not everyone follows the ways of sivhd, brandi.

[RayFrost]

I was under the impression you could lead the attacks to where you wanted while the particle was in motion.

Also what vital attacks are you missing? Last hits? Why use q to last hit in the first place? >_>?

I spoke with him about this:

He meant that if you're moving to catch the axe you're not auto attacking meaning you're losing dps and if you're not catching the axe you're not getting the q damage and you're losing dps.

Makes it awkward to 1v1 dig dug with someone if you're moving about trying to catch your flying thingy. Or if you're not.

[RayFrost]

I've only seen non-skinned dravens do well... if they're on my team.

Darius draven kill lane too strong. All the dot passives all the time. Even trondeemur can't survive.

[RayFrost]

He showed is credit card info, so he shut it down.

It's back on now.

And I was watching before the credit card info

[RayFrost]

It's a competitive game. On the internet. I seriously doubt any one of us is completely innocent of trashtalk

(especially if the other team started it, in my case <.<)

Fun fact: for the other team, her [esurio's] team was the other team.

Mayyyyybe fixed?

[RayFrost]

I love you guys. I love my teammates.

I may some mean things now and then when I lose my cool, but I don't mean them. I appreciate each and every one of you, despite our differences.

Let's cut through the shit and just make a hug circle.

[RayFrost]

So I just met a couple of players that told me you should never get roa on singed.

I'm confused by this.

They said "catalyst sure but it's only for the sustain, then you go shroud into rylai's and turn the cataylst into banshee's always"

I don't follow. Roa is one of the most gold efficient items in the game, and singed makes it even better from his passive and it generally fitting his kit. Is the issue "oh noooess you'd build TWO CATALYSTS IF YOU WENT ROA BVEIL" or something? I just really don't get the logic here.

[RayFrost]

I know draven's one, who's the other?

Darius is melee and Pulsefire ez is just a skin.

[RayFrost]

It said the patching would take an hour for me. That was like eight minutes ago. It now fluctuates between 50-100 hours.

Edit: it now says I'm updating at 0 kbs... da fuck

[RayFrost]

So the patch then went basically to finished and took five more minutes to apply patches.

Waited the 15 minute login queue, first time and I get in.

You guys are freezing for the login queue?

[RayFrost]

I'd play if I had a level 30. >.>

Nobody cares what level you are~

Come, join the party and tell us your name, we shall teach you the ways of the league or some other some such.

[RayFrost]

No, you just have to be invited.

[RayFrost]

I never get a login queue.

[RayFrost]

Server's messed up, yes.

[RayFrost]

There are now three champions that you are a man when playing: xin, mantheon, and CAPTAIN TEEMO.

[RayFrost]

It'll be interesting to note that he doesn't have a summoner name yet.

Uber did the username portion.

[RayFrost]

PS: this is awesome

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/sho ... st26260416

omg please say we have someone that can play Sion

Sion's one of my favorite champions... if ad. Not sure about ap sion (as in the one time I tried it things went like shit and I had a sad).

[RayFrost]

So uh I joined a ranked team because a lol friend asked me to.

Then he told me I'm going to be our ad carry. I have mf, trist, ashe, urgot, sivir. Order of strength: trist, sivir, mf, urgot/ashe.

Who should I be getting next for an ad? I feel like I'm generically covered for the different style of ad but I'm not entirely sure.

My understanding is trist god tier late game, decent early game, weak mid game. Mf / sivir godly mid / strong early game, slightly drop off late game - mf ult placement make/break for team fighting potential. Urgot godly early/mid game, drops off into late game. Ashe weak early, decent mid, strong late - arrow being a make or break for team fighting potential. So I'm guessing I need to get graves because fuck yeah, but aside from him who all do I really need/want? Corki? Kog'maw?

[RayFrost]

Order of strength overall in terms of the entire game is more along the lines of Urgot/Ashe/Trist, Sivir/MF. If you meant who you're better with, my bad. MF arguably has the strongest early game just falling short of Draven(that Q is op but it's dumb). Get all 3 of Graves/Corki/Kog. Graves will be the most versatile so I'd pick him up first. Kog'Maw and Corki both scale really well. Corki has overall strength throughout the game. Kog can lane pretty well but has no escape(so he needs more comps centered towards him). You can get either of those two depending on your team and what they want you to run. Kog'Maw definitely has the better late game overall if it's an actual team you're playing with, though.

Yeah it was order of skill level from best to worst for that strength thing (and when it comes to actual game strength I think urgot's the weakest as far as being an ad carry, then the rest are different rather than better or worse than each other).

I think kog will be the hardest for me to adjust. I can play the others because they have something built in that I'm really comfortable with using, like the spellshield blocking the taric stun initiation or just jumping with trist, etc.

Also, just realized I left ez / vayne / draven / varus off the list. I don't want vayne or varus tbh. Draven would be rough to play the q properly when I'm running 10 fps and shit (skillshots np, clicking tons of shit big problem).

I know eventually I'll want essentially all of the ad carries, but I want to know the highest priority for me to be team-comp flexible given my current lineup.

[RayFrost]

Sure is fun being able to play the game.

Literally. I can't play the game. It won't even log me in. I've been trying for the past hour.

The patcher wouldn't open for me at all for a few days but it worked last night.

Dunno.

[RayFrost]

also, went into ranked and had a ryze on our team building sorcs+roa+hat+wota... still won because pie!mundo is (now) 5:0 in ranked

roa is fine, hat not so much, wota is fine.

Hat should be fh or bveil depending on enemy comp etc.

MY RYZE BUILD FROM THAT ONE INHOUSE GOT BETTER WITH THE RYZE CHANGES FUCK YERRR. I really like having ~4k mana, ~200 ap, and all the tankiness of a tank. This reminds me that I need to play ryze more.

[RayFrost]

Riven does really well against udyr. Udyr won't ~lose~ if he's careful, but he definitely doesn't win. Riven's got much stronger trading in lane and has the ability to chunk udyr without needing to manage mana to keep herself going, udyr has to be a bit more conservative. This makes the difference, ime. There's a limit to how much damage avoiding one can do with bear stuns. Riven hitting six is more significant in the lane than udyr hitting it, too.

[RayFrost]

Maybe I'm just playing fate level rivens all the time and I'm just not good enough.

[RayFrost]

I could've sworn I had bveil that game.

And a GA. I felt really awesome. Feed peg in mid lane still win game because teammates carry me np.

[RayFrost]

That means you didn't bd hard enough.

Huehuehue.

(In seriousness, that's not really normal: it's usually one side stomps the other *or* it goes back and forth then one side gets a good fight and wins - a rush to break the nexus is pretty rare in all the game types except dominion, where that's kinda the point)

[RayFrost]

I pine for frost queen janna but lack the moneys. I PINE SO HARD.

Cho'gath is awesome, andy. Learn to play him! You will enjoy it! I can even teach you some basic stuff sometime if you like. Builds and skill order and lane behaviors blah blah.

What we need is a slime champion. Like flubber.

[RayFrost]

No, no, best cho'gath build is actually attack speed and maxing e first. Ionic spark-malady-bloodrazor-wit'send-pd-serkers.

[RayFrost]

if you're in range to get hit with a cassie q, you're in range to snare when xin is ganking

Only if the ryze is flashing.

Cassie q has a lot of range on ryze w, and it gives her movespeed to make catching her post-hit really hard to do even with man zhao incoming.

edit: but I'd flash for it so w/e

[RayFrost]

AP NUNU IS A GO

CHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARGE

Oh god I remember this one nunu game.

I walked into their inhib tower and channeled ult. Suddenly, entire enemy team has no health and my team kills all of them almost simultaneously even as I'm saying in skype "I uhh... have a black screen, but I ulted!"

Nunu too strong for old rayfrost black screens.

[RayFrost]

MF is getting a buff to her double up range? Or did they just word it wrong?

Make it rain is practically useless for her in general. It isn't impacted by a very small increase in slow %. Worthless change.

Ori got smaller ratios on passive/q a tiny base damage buff on her passive

a very important projectile speed nerf

on her q (shit was already slow as hell for something so important to her efficacy) and w still eats too much mana and now q is even harder to land in lane (and does less damage if you do). The e change is nice along with the qol changes but aside from that there's nothing worth wanting here.

[RayFrost]

What I hate: blind pick going lb and loading up to see flash tp galio in your mid lane.

And shyvana jungle with blitz support. Fffffffffuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

[RayFrost]

All right, well, my mouse being a piece of shit means I can't play this game anymore.

Learn to touch pad? Or not using a laptop?

Also I've only done well with tanky champions lately (mumu blitz sej). Seems like the game is telling me my role is TANK OR TANKY ACCESSORIES.

[RayFrost]

Xylthim combined with amumu galio alistar mf. GG huehuehue.

But yeah thing is her laning phase was weak before and now it's horrible because q does quite a bit less damage. W is a huuuuuge mana sink early game so they hit her already weak early/mid game to strengthen her late game a tad. Doesn't seem like a very good trade off compared to the positions other champions are in (a la ahri, fuck her).

[RayFrost]

YOU FORGOT NASUS

Also I haven't figured out how to counter jayce yet but he seems like an actually interesting champion after these last few

[RayFrost]

Clam dwon

Clam dwon

[RayFrost]

Guys. I just pulled off the 5v1. You go into a custom game by yourself and get 5 random bots on the other team and you play 5v1.

This was my third try. After already trying Jarvin and Teemo I went with Heimer and pulled off the win in a few seconds shy of 28 minutes. The challenge has been laid down. Also kills don't win it for you. I only got 8 kills.

tp ghost mobi boots ap soraka pushes down mid lane super fast to win the game

or morde

or nid

any super pusher really, get through inhib, get through nexus, win game

Just a guess, though.

[RayFrost]

Buying on release

p-edit: I actually did ykyhbptmmw

[RayFrost]

Guessing from lilg's comment that panzer was jungling.

gj jungle soraka triple kill

Edit: RON AKIN <33333333333

Also tristana gets all the pentas

espy's first penta? trist penta
this penta? trist penta
every penta? trist penta
vayne penta? trist penta

[RayFrost]

AP sona is really fun lately

[RayFrost]

Thread needs more blitzcrank heimerdinger/viktor tag team love.

[RayFrost]

Ahallucinogenic is his summoner name.

[RayFrost]

I have, literally, never beaten rumble in lane. I've tried with olaf cho'gath nidalee (bruiser AND ap) warwick rumble kennen and singed. I've lost every time. I am sad.

[RayFrost]

I've come to the conclusion that going top in blind pick is a bad idea for me. I don't know enough to be doing that.

[RayFrost]

Well it's written in the image if you look at the first panel, so

[RayFrost]

From the looks of things graves did pretty sexy too.

All the aoe ults in your team, though. Vlad mummy graves = tons of damage in just hitting r.

Also congrats on the win. did mumu take top?

[RayFrost]

She meant lee.

[RayFrost]

I had a similar problem a bit ago where the bar on the bottom was just simply not there at all except to show cd numbers. I haven't gotten it in a while, though.

[RayFrost]

I played some 100 games with cho before I realized he had mana.

Fucking. Nomnoms.

Also don't like draven. Found him unenjoyable and unimpressive ad. Prefer graves/trist/sivir for various things.

[RayFrost]

I tend to go 9/21/0 with yorick: his late game damage scaling isn't so hot, but he gets absurdly tanky, so that's more of his role.

[RayFrost]

I've gone eve twice both times in 3v3, and both times I went against another eve.
Both eves I went up against rushed trinity while I went sheen -> gunblade -> dfg -> rageblade. They were obliterated. I find it really satisfying to see that playing pre-rework eve is actually making playing current eve easier.

Edit: just had a malphite game where I was stuck between two options: ult and have my team be unable to follow through or just stand around dying. I was caught between myself and a hard place.

[RayFrost]

So I've played a bit of ranked lately (1300-ish elo stuff mind you), and I've been first pick every time. And what I've been doing is banning from a pool of kennen (ALWAYS BAN KENNEN), malph, shen, shaco, [insert champs I don't like] before first picking soraka. I then (except for my last game where a guy picked blitz so he went mid with soraka I took blitz blah blah) trot my happy pony ass down to bot lane and proceed to have my ad carry shit all over the other guy.

I haven't seen soraka lanes do poorly since the dawn of time, and it's making me wonder about the dynamics of it. I understand blah blah soraka really easy gives sustain all day blah blah, but is this negated by ignite or a trist / mf pick? Would ignites in bot lane make this null?

The reason I'm wondering about it from the perspective of the other side is the fact I want to know how to deal with this situation if I come up against it. Do I just go with healing reduction in all the things? Do I just play hyper passive and avoid attempting trades? Do I go all or nothing fights to reduce the amount of lead the sustain will get the other guy?

[RayFrost]

I pretty much only level q when I have to. The value of a longer silence / stronger heal outweighs the very light dps of starcall at level one. And it also promotes being out of position more than it does teamfighting properly, imo. If you're standing in the middle of the enemy team you're either about to get killed or winning the fight so hard your q isn't even relevant. In the case that you

can

stay in a position to use it without it being dumb, you're still probably a bit further away from your carry than you want to be, and the 60 damage in an aoe before mr that you get is really negligible vs an extra bit of silence / armor that can keep your carry / other persons out of the dead zone.

Edit: Whether to get w or e first is very reliant on what the lane is down on bot / what you're doing level one. Into a blitzcrank or other high aggro lane, I tend to prefer opening heal, while if I'm against something like janna vayne or anticipating an invade from the enemy team (or my team is going for one) I'll open silence. Silence is my more common opening due to the fact I like walking out of a brush to silence auto someone before walking back in like la dee da. I also tend to have winning lanes,which means I'm maxing silence over heal too.

Edit edit: I also played sona for the first time in a long time. My god she shits on a soraka lane so hard. Just constant q harass poking kog / sora down until six and then ashe arrow sona ult nautilus gank combo even under enemy tower leads to double kill. Soraka heal too long of a cd to keep up in harass.

[RayFrost]

I've come to the realization that people at 1100-1400 elo are absurdly passive. You're sona, against a soraka, q + passive harass things down, don't just eat silences all day. You're soraka, against a sona, ward the brush and silence her, don't just eat q passive harass all day. I've been on both sides of this and won both simply from the other guy just going "oh noes I'm being hit whatever shall I do? Run away! Don't try to harass back at all!" I've even harassed out a blitzcrank as soraka simply because they were too afraid to try any sort of initiation or trading. I've gone top against a shen as jarvan and he just let me poke him down without attempting any trades with me. I went jungle shaco against a jungle eve and the eve didn't gank the entire game while I was all over the lanes.

If there's one thing I've learned in my solo q time it's that you should

Assert Your Presence

even if it's a case where you can't fully apply yourself. Trade rather than just soaking up damage, don't let yourself get stepped on just because you don't want a full fight.

Edit: I know this kinda seems obvious (especially when so many of you guys are better than I am), but the large quantity of people I see that don't ever apply this makes me feel it's important to say.

[RayFrost]

Well, even in ranked there are games like that. Basically 80% of my ranked games have been over by 20. Meanwhile in normals... games are still p. much the same.

I think the only games that aren't like that are the ms inhouses that I haven't done in a million years.

[RayFrost]

Esurio as sona is ballsy as fuck and dives into ALL THE THINGS. It was awesome.

[RayFrost]

I simply think of him as his avatar and it makes all of his posts adorable.

Also just had my first solo q game where my teammates called everything but my worst role. And then the mid decided they couldn't mid and I got sent there, my second worst role. Zyra shat all over me and I felt bad.

[RayFrost]

On Zyra, I never played mid against her, and I only saw her once, but she doesn't seem so great.

Zyra's strong. Low cds on her abilities with long range, and her plants allow her to control whether she pushes or not, and decent ratios. And with a bit of cdr you get four of those fuckers out and kill things. Plus her ult. Oh god that huge ass aoe nuke.

[RayFrost]

That ult. Looks like we've got a strong initiating bruiser type with her rather than a raw tank or supporty champ like leona.

[RayFrost]

"ap carries should never pretend to play support just cuz they are girl characters with some cc" - lurkingabyss

[RayFrost]

Galio, vlad and karma are equal levels of disagree - passive gives ap

[RayFrost]

I'll play with anyone that I'm on at the same time as. Smurfings available on request.

But that like never happens.

TIME ZONES.

Also karthus free week oh gawd please no. yay irelia / corki free week lol tryndamur

[RayFrost]

Idek how far Japan is ahead/behind the UK. Tell me and we could work something out!

15:11 on the 31st ATM What time is it there?

Also probably going to be on in an hour to an hour and a half from now. And I have an account on the EU servers but uh sub-lvl20

[RayFrost]

Hmmm. Roughly what time do you usually play, nexus? Would you prefer dealing with my laggy sub-20 play on EU or dealing with your laggy sub-20 play on NA?

P-edit: What's the build, kdowns?

[RayFrost]

That changes with health, but I'm sure somebody somewhere did the gold value per 1 health math at some point.

[RayFrost]

"cc bot" means "cc whore" means "primarily cc utility"

[RayFrost]

So uh if anyone still wants a smite key I have one to give.

[RayFrost]

That happened for a lot of people not just the ilol client.

[RayFrost]

shortening a route?

Timing ganks effectively on people who may or may not ward / will run the fuck away when they see you / etc. Also dealing with another jungler.

It'd also be easier to join you for games if you told us your summoner name.

[RayFrost]

Cleaver would've also helped shyvana and hecarim do moare damages if you really wanted to be maxing dps against targets with "low" armor.

[RayFrost]

I like lee sin too. (hi fate)
And olaf. (hi bob?)
And cho'gath. But I don't think anybody but patrick and me play cho. Which is sad because cho is fucking awesome.

[RayFrost]

yeah but you wouldn't accept a 1v1 challenge so you lose by default Ray

I totally would. It's just that time zones prevent it.

Oh yeah nikanor does the cho'gaths too. I feel unstoppable when I play cho. DARIUS I HEAR YOUR ULT DOES TRUE DAMAGE. AHAHAHAHAHAHAANOMNOMNOM.

[RayFrost]

YOU TOO FROSTY?

GETTIN TOO COCKY FOR YOUR GODDAMN SCARF?

ILL TAKE ALL YOU CLOWNS ON

No I know you'd kick my ass.

But it'd be fun.

[RayFrost]

Andy's build is the most fabulous.

[RayFrost]

Nunu and taric hang out in the same club. The yeti made a man out of his human brother.

Also MUNDO owns this club. And katarina is the waitress.

We call it club smash. Because Mundo thought it was clever.

[RayFrost]

So it's time to

troll

beat Fate with an all Ar rune page, 9/21/0 mastery page, summoner heal / teleport Lee who opens cloth / 5 eh? The cunning plan is to just sit under tower farming until he loses his goddamn mind and is forced to tower dive you.

How did you figure out my plan before I put it into action

[RayFrost]

I ADMIT DEFEAT
Lost First blood both times due to my own carelessness.

Came back to save some face and win the lane, but as per term sof the CHALLENGU Ray is new lee mastah and I will see him NEXT MONTH (after Staeg challenges him, obv)

Rayfrost, did you have a mouse when you did this? Or was it on touchpad?

Still no mouse. Still 15-20 fps. Still in Japan.

Hindu, challenge or don't if you want. I don't mind if you play lee when I'm on.

Edit: Fate's cost for losing is different from that too so yeah.

[RayFrost]

Not that much really. I play lee on treeline every now and then, but he's not super common for me.

Here's the breakdown of fate's losses:
round 1 - dives me level 1, gets exhausted, gets clownfucked summoner spells: flash exhaust vs flash ignite (FATE WAS AN ARROGANT CLOWNFUCK)
round 2 - fights me gets exhausted I win via level up shields blocking ignite kill after he dies, summoner spells: exhaust ignite vs ignite heal (IGNITE BEATS HEAL AHAHAHAHA, EXHAUST IS BROKEN AHAHAAHAHAH)

I lost the lane despite such advantages because I suck at building lee and fate is a better lee after the whole getting fb'd because he's bad level one. "Lost" means "after a series of 1 for 1s fate finally kills me 1-0 due to building better giving him enough of a lead"

[RayFrost]

When I'm on in about 4-5 hours,, sure

[RayFrost]

Panzer and I were talking earlier about the

monster oh noes

mentioned in Rengar's lore. It sounds a lot like a mix of kog'maw and cho - kog ate his way to the league, cho has massive scyth-like limbs (and actually is big and eats things). Hint at another void-monster?

[RayFrost]

So it's a normal day in ranked duo q with panzer. He goes amumu top against a wukong, I go mf bot against a cait that I supported to victory in the game before. I outfarm cait like a baws, miss barley any cs while he's missing fucktons. All good times and funzies, my support blitz builds a tear and misses most of his pulls like a guy who should request blitz. Oh yeahhhh.

Meanwhile, in top lane... :an enemy has disconnected:
Panzer's constant crying made wukong throw a tantrum and leave. GG. A bandage on the wounds left by my own support.

[RayFrost]

He was playing amumu.

[RayFrost]

I don't really see how a wukong should lose to mummy top, but uhh alright.

I don't either but that's part of the beauty of it all. Basic summary is panzer makes 1200 elo wukongs cry.

[RayFrost]

I prefer Sona Soraka Janna and Leona to Taric.

Taric is a solidly tanky support with the ability to be a cause for a lot of pain (less than leona, but grants tankiness to the ad) and also sustain himself / his ad at a decent level if you aren't constantly trading (more than sona, less than soraka).

This is no fun for trying to trade. Combined with the ability to shred your ad AND provide post-six a damage steroid on low as shit cd, it is really no fun. Taric's actually a pretty solid support to counter kill lanes. Buritzcurankuh pulls your ad? Stun their ad, heal your ad, walk away. Leona jumps your

beautiful

fabulous ass? Stun her ad, walk up to it, hit w, turnaround initiations. 0 fucks.

Taric works best with people who can abuse the early level strength - sivir, graves (taric w + graves passive is lulz), ez, maybe mf - but he is still a solid pick with most ads due to the fact he IS versatile in lane. Decent sustain free tankiness to the team, damage steroid to the team (w AND ult count for this), and a solid single target stun (plus okay healing). Very very good utility. Not as hard cc.

[RayFrost]

Taric has better big-chunk single target sustain, Sona has better piecemeal AoE sustain.

Right, and Soraka does his job better than he does in that level.

Unless you're hitting creeps

(which you shouldn't be)

you won't out sustain Sona with Taric.

Found your problem. You hit minions but don't kill them when playing Taric. Taric has mana sustain this way as well btw.

Also keep in mind taric's aura is a larger decrease on damage than sona's so he

needs to heal less

.

[RayFrost]

Found your problem. You hit minions but don't kill them when playing Taric. Taric has mana sustain this way as well btw.

I don't play Taric, but both featured guides on solomid say not to do this except when helping your AD carry push the lane....plus, I imagine that if you're autoattacking minions as Taric, you're just ensuring that the enemy laners are closer to their tower and therefore harder to kill.

It's really a matter of balance: you hit one or two times per wave to avoid pushing too hard while still getting some mana sustain or if you want to push you hit more often. You're also auto attacking during each engagement, blah blah blah. Emphasis is on taric autoattacking is not an odd thing in lane.

Quadz: Sona is a better team fighting support if you need an aoe initiator / counterinitiator. Taric is better if you've already got that or are going for a targeted killing team (a la ashe + other good single target shit, nuke the fucker with a cc lock, then keep on going off the steamroll)

or if you are against a targeted killing team

. If your squishies aren't that squishy it's a bit of a lolumad against more assassin-esque team comps (fuck your shit talon I hate you). Also taric is stronger against ad heavy teams or with ad heavy teams due to w, ceteris paribus.

Sona's an archetype of aggressive support, who wants to poke sustain poke. This doesn't work if the enemy lane can force a more all-in situation. Taric, leona, alistar, blitz, nautilus (lol) can all do this to varied extents, as can a couple ads (tristana, ashe). She works really well against soraka and (to a lesser extent) janna, but janna seems to have fallen out of favor in current meta, so that just leaves soraka for things you'll see much.

[RayFrost]

I get a lot of ads who think eating harass is fun, nutritious, and healthy.

With the ads that don't, it's more rawr e w they're chunked fuck yerrr back off we barely lost anything like bosses.

Fuck I really need to get a lane that isn't ridiculously one sided sometime.

[RayFrost]

Rayfrost: How do you feel about assault supports?

Do you mean... kill lanes? Like jarvan and pantheon and shit.

Completely viable strategy, not really what I'd call support per se, but yeah. You definitely definitely have to go into it with someone you're comfortable playing as a team for it to work imo.

I'm not really that good with kill lanes (being part of them), so you're better off asking someone else if you want ~advice~. All I can give is tips on facing them.

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