Mini Theme 2164: Betrayal Mafia I (Game over!)

[Fun and Games]

The claims are functionally the same but with ABR withi,ding specifics.

No? ABR claimed he's a vig. Ydrasse claimed she can multiattack. Stepping back a moment from the big differences, I don't see why there wouldn't necessarily be two roles like that in the town. Maybe you could argue they're not both scum, but the issue with that is that by the time Noraa is set up to prove her role exists we may well be approaching endgame.

Further, the utility in ABR's role is that he can actually kill a player outright, which is a direct counter to both me and CMod's roles. Noraa is potentially way stronger as a proven role than a vig, because making multiple attacks when her stats are similar to the targets' doesn't particularly make it likely that she'll kill them.

The level of overlap is similar to me and Cmod, where cmod heals someone else and I have a way for others to heal me. There's not really a role disagreement there.

Why would it even make sense for the town to have a vig when the scum can barely nightkill?

[Fun and Games]

Bingle if you're town I will make it my life's purpose to make sure Penguin dies

Fucking seriously, skitter?

i'm not following what the issue is

~ skitter
(note that i did not write 1419)

[Fun and Games]

AHHHH I've let a game creep up on me again. I swear I will catch up by tomorrow otherwise if I wait any longer, imma be too lazy to catch up :/

*sigh*
procrastinating sucks ass

deadline is in 36 hours and you're a reasonable deadline compromise imo

[Fun and Games]

well you're no longer my pick for deadline wagon, but i was gonna vote you about two hours ago until this whole convo with jingle happened
and agreed that you probably shouldn't join so many games ...

fwiw noraa/jingle are very very very likely not partners due to noraa writing up a whole null case on jingle upon repping in when he wasn't particularly under pressure. it would be really bizarre for the one slot for scum!noraa to iso there to be her partner, and then not come to any conclusion

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

someone with the rm prfpc told me to iso jingle

oh
hmm
ok not as anti-partner-y but still somewhat anti-partner-y

[Fun and Games]

Its 10 pm and I have hw but I'll read a few pages as fast as I can rn. I'd prefer I didn't get limmed the day I replaced in :/

also however much i want you to post ...
plz prioritize hw
i promise that if i decide to vote you it won't be at least till tomorrow, k?
(might not vote you at all, depending on how i settle on bingle but i'm still working on that)

[Fun and Games]

I understand hydras have it rough cuz they got two people occupying one slot and inconsistencies in their reads is normally cuz its two damn separate people but like when skitters the only one talking and theres THAT many inconsistencies, im reluctant to believe anything besides they are scum and don't actually have any reads cuz they already know who the dang scums are.

Are you saying I don't have reads or are you saying skitter doesn't have reads?

~not-skitter

[Fun and Games]

Fun and games you attack ABR for jumping on a vanity wagon while u urself are on Johnny who has like 2 votes or something. that's a bit hypocritical don't u think?

ABR jumped on a vanity wagon when he thought there were 8 hours left until deadline. That behavior does not really make sense.

If we did something like that with 8 hours left until deadline - that move would also similarly not make sense - however since we knew the actual deadline timer was ~2 days(I can't remember the exact timing) and it was paused to search for replacement - our vote on Johnny for the reasons we stated does make sense.

[Fun and Games]

Fun and games: flip floppy, pushes others for doing what they do, seems to think flash wagons are great, overall scummy mindset, eager scum vibes, hard scum lean here. "obviously town day 1" does not exist. theres a lot wrong with this slot and I hate the scummy vibes I get here.

Lol

[Fun and Games]

Overall catchip is decent tho, tbh

[Fun and Games]

Or more accurately, it's kinda bad but not in a way that i think is particularly likely to come from scum

[Fun and Games]

I just went thru Ydrasse's ISO and .... *siiiiiiiiiiiiiigh*

Will note the amished tell tho ^

[Fun and Games]

I mean you hit the tell, what do you want me to do, ignore it?

[Fun and Games]

* why it is a scum tell, you mean?

Basically amished tell is when someone reps in and makes a point of saying how scummy their predecessor was (often accompanied by saying they understand the wagon on them and/or saying they're surprised they havent been wagoned yet)

It's p reliable, in my experience, and kinda exactly what you did there

[Fun and Games]

no what I meant was instead of saying "lol" and discrediting my opinions straight up, explain why these aren't scum tells

Will be at a pc/not at work later this evening, so can give a real answer then.

The short answer is basically: i largely disagree with most of your assessments (like 'seems to think flashwagons are great'. When it's like 36 hours to deadline and everyone is lurking, like last night, flashwagons arent that bad imo given that we need a flip. It'a not something i agree with in general). And strongly disagre with 'overall scummy mindset' or 'eager scum vibes' which i dont think you've really elaborated upon either

Dont particularly object to flip-floppy, i am sometimes

Actually going thru the wall is gonna have to wait till tonight, sorry

[Fun and Games]

except scum!me never does things like this bc scum!me overthinks and decides it might catch attention.

Do u think scum!you would have entered the game this way?

[Fun and Games]

"eager scum vibes" = way too present in the thread and every time ur present, I feel u don't move the game forward at all. I only see stubbornness and zero willingness to actually solve.

flash wagons are not ok with 36 hours left. 36 hours = plenty of time to discuss and actually get something out of a flip rather than rushing and gaining absolutely nothing.

u complain people are lurking. then engage them. put pressure on them. MAKE THEM TALK. sometimes there aint no shortcut. U tell the mod to prod them enough times and they'll get replaced or start engaging u.

a) um, no. i haven't been that active in the thread that much at all. last night, yes. overall, no. jingle even called me out on being lurkish like last week. i also *strongly* disagree that i'm not moving the game forward
b) not in a game where everyone's lurking and there's often a grand total of one page of posts each day? look at the number of posts made between when i was posting on sunday night and when i started posting last night, when there was <2 days left. there was i think like one page of posts, and even abr rushing in and decalaring an imminent 8 hour deadline didn't spark activity.
c) tried multiple times to engage the lurking people ... if they don't respond there's not much i can do at that point. also multiple people have been replaced and it hasn't necessarily helped with acticity, see chara/pine slot
also, i got *you* to talk by threatening a deadline flashwagon last night. kinda silly to complain that i'm not trying to get the lurkers to talk when i'm p much responsible for your recent burst of activity, no?

[Fun and Games]

Also let's note that p much everyone in my elim pool minus bingle is currently voting me

[Fun and Games]

So, skitter. Gonna share with me why the townread on Cakez?

a) i feel like you're trying to get me to scumread him (or, more precisely, that you're trying to divert me off of you and onto him while simultaneously pushing an icky omgus penguin vote)

b) attempting to solve the game, and i think he's approaching things from a +town perspective. i think the things you're nitpicking on are even in bad-faith or nai

[Fun and Games]

Fun and games is a hydra I take it. I've never played with anyone called skitter so I cannot tell but this hyperposting sure makes me think excited scum. It also feels like you kinda go around and sus everyone besides ur few TRs. Too much confidence feels scummy to me personally.

a) hyperposting is nai for me, ask jingle or penguin. kinda baffled how you're getting to 'excited scum' from hyperposting. didn't sircakez indicate that you also hyperpost? are you scum each time?

b) i've repeatedly said that i have like 5 or so townreads, and that i find the rest of the game either scummy or null. not sure what the issue is with that, and given that a lot of the scummy/null slots aren't posting, there's not much i can necessasrily do about it either

Fun and games ur TR on bingle sure was paper thin once other people started jumping on bingle eh?

he started posting badly, and he can definitely post things in non-badfaith ways when he's town

Fun and games ur TR on bingle sure was paper thin once other people started jumping on bingle eh?

my wagon at least was semi-viable ...

[Fun and Games]

You had a TR on Bingle. Then everyone flipped on Bingle. Then you lurked for a huge portion of them arguing about Bingle and when you come back, its to say you have moved to the Bingle wagon. Is that not scummy. Ur not THAT present in the thread but its clear as hell that ur "present" just not talking. Ur lurking.

this is a ridiculously bad-faith-y way of representing what happened while ignoring the context of what prompted the change to the bingle wagon (namely, that he posted scummy in ways on uncharacteristic of townhim)

also i was vla for the weekend, i said i would be last week even ...

[Fun and Games]

noraa you made a big stink about me not fully responding to you but aren't really responding to my responses ...

[Fun and Games]

also i hope chara is ok

[Fun and Games]

hyperposting isnt AI for me and don't turn the tables that defensively otherwise I'll just think ur more scummy. I specifically said I haven't played with u before so I don't know if the point applies. And also earlier, u said u hadn't been hyper posting soooo this backtracking is interesting.

Ur TRs also flip to SRs really fast which is interesting. What the issue is? nothing big. Ur likely scum tho.

maybe don't make silly arguments that just as equally apply to yourself ...
if you don't i woudln't feel the need to point out the hypocrisy

i'm informing you that hyperposting is nai for me
i told you who in this game you can ask to verify that
it's apparently a relevant part of your read so given that i'm informing you ti's invalid, i would expect your read to change (perhaps in some small way) to suit

i've been very mercurial, i've sometimes been hyperposting, i sometimes haven't been this game

[Fun and Games]

can I get the bingle wagon reasoning in a sentence or so, I'm trying to play several games fast rn

his current push on penguin is quite bad, it basically reads as a long-winded omgus of penguin
he originally claimed that this wasn't penguin's scum mo, but then informed me that scum!penguin always tunneled town!him. he linked a game to prove that, and ignored me when i pointed out that scum!penguin did not, in fact, tunnel him in the game he linked
he's ignoring my reasons to think penguin is town
he can't explain why penguin is scummy in any greater depth than the above

while he's insisting on his bad epnguin vote he's been trying to portray sircakez as scummy and has been appealing to me to switch my vote there, even tho he says he isn't townreading me either

altogether this is not a good pattern ^

he's been arguing in bad faith

he has exactly 1.5 townreads, and i expect better from him at this point

[Fun and Games]

no this happened yesterday while I was online.

my reasoning to move to bingle happened before you were online ...

[Fun and Games]

I literally said I didnt know if it applied what more do you want?

i literally told you it does ...

[Fun and Games]

so what if hyper posting isnt AI for me? Its AI for tons of fucking people. Why can I not use it?

Because. It. Isn't. AI. For. Me. Either.

[Fun and Games]

PEdit: first off that's not really in a senctence or close to it, and I think that's not damning for Bingle, plus Noraa raised good points against you so I'm not inclined to take your word

a) explain why this isn't damning for bingle
b) what points from noraa are good

[Fun and Games]

it's a scummy pattern:

-> he can't explain why the person he's voting is scummy
-> once pressed he appeals to a past game as an example of how penguin did the same 'scummy' things he's doing this game
-> ignores me pointing out the reasoning he's giving literally didn't happen in the past game
-> ignores my townread on him
-> isn't townreading me but is appealing to me to switch to sircakez in badfaith arguments

what aprt of that isn't scummy to you ^

[Fun and Games]

noraa elaborate on your bingle townread

[Fun and Games]

Bingle hasn't done anything crazy scummy. I have no reason to believe they are scum.

i want you to address the points i raised in 1535

and/or the quotes sircakez pulled at the top of this page

and/or acknowledge that you apparently haven't actually read the scummy binigle posts since you seem to think they happened after you started posting last night

[Fun and Games]

Bingle hasn't done anything crazy scummy. I have no reason to believe they are scum.

i want you to address the points i raised in 1535

and/or the quotes sircakez pulled at the top of this page

and/or acknowledge that you apparently haven't actually read the scummy binigle posts since you seem to think they happened after you started posting last night

[Fun and Games]

This is defeatist and AtE but so? Town!me does exactly that when under pressure. Its not AI for everyone.

sigh

[Fun and Games]

it's literally not the leading wagon but facts don't seem to matter to you

[Fun and Games]

I didnt count the votes but last I checked, bingle was the leading wagon

? the vote count is literally at the top of the page.

[Fun and Games]

there are four votes on fun and games rn. does that not say anything sir?

i think there's 5 and bingle probly isn't going to vote for himself

[Fun and Games]

it's literally not the leading wagon but facts don't seem to matter to you

cakez literally said you have 2 votes on you right before. but you don't call cakez out for "facts don't matter to you".

cakez isn't trying to wagon us out of the game with a bunch of terrible reasons that make no sense so I'm not paying as much attention to him

[Fun and Games]

I'm unlikely to get through with reason to ABR/Noraa/Johnny/Gamma/CreativeMod.

So I'd like to offer a compromise of sorts.

Flip bingle and have ABR prove his role on us if Bingle is not guilty.

I think that would be perfectly acceptable no?

If any of you actually want to reason out your case on us I'm happy to talk. :3

[Fun and Games]

There was creative, johnny, me, noraa, by the time you said it wasn't viable.

why does it actually matter whether it's viable or not? You seem to be more interested in proving that it is viable to wagon me than you are interested in whether I'm guilty.

Do you not understand what's actually important in this game?

[Fun and Games]

I townread Bingle so that's never going to happen.

Can you explain your townread then?

[Fun and Games]

u really think I check vcs?

why would you make comments on the VC or people voting if you won't even put in the effort to check the VC to make sure your post is accurate?

You understand people actually spend time on this game right? It's kind of disrespectful of our time if you just randomly spam nonsense.

[Fun and Games]

It matters a lot.

Cakez borrowed a move from my playbook of trying to present the options for today's lynch. He's more aggressive to defend you than I've seen him play in other games, and his initial reason was "F&G is active so I don't want to lynch him or the game will become stale".

what does this have to do with my alignment?

[Fun and Games]

You selectively pointed out nora for not having their facts straight when literally 2 posts above, cakez didn't even realize you had more than 2 votes on you. If you're town, you should be at least a little suspicious of cakez trying to take a bullet for you from out of nowhere.

I'm responding to Noraa because she's trying to get me lynched. When somebody is hard-driving your lynch you usually focus on them and not every person in the thread.

[Fun and Games]

Fun and games you attack ABR for jumping on a vanity wagon while u urself are on Johnny who has like 2 votes or something. that's a bit hypocritical don't u think?

This is so true it hurts.

btw you never responded to my response on this.

Do you admit you and noraa were wrong here?

[Fun and Games]

ABR do you actually have reasons for wanting me elim'd ? I'd like to go over them with you, you can start with your best reason.

[Fun and Games]

I voted Bingle, because he is currently in 1v1 with FaG.
I have never played with scum Skitter, but I have played games with town Skitter. In both of these games she
a) townreaded and defended me ✓
b) kept asking questions I wanted/ would ask ✓
Both happens in this game. If Skitter can't fake these details into her scum game, she is very likely town.
I have FaG in townleans. At least.

alt?

~ skitter
(to be clear i haven't been doing most of the posting recently)

[Fun and Games]

(i'm asking if you're an alt, not to reveal the alt)

[Fun and Games]

it's a scummy pattern:

-> he can't explain why the person he's voting is scummy
-> once pressed he appeals to a past game as an example of how penguin did the same 'scummy' things he's doing this game
-> ignores me pointing out the reasoning he's giving literally didn't happen in the past game
-> ignores my townread on him
-> isn't townreading me but is appealing to me to switch to sircakez in badfaith arguments

what aprt of that isn't scummy to you ^

gamma i want you to explain how this isn't scummy to you, and why it just boils down to poor reasoning ^

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

Cakez borrowed a move from my playbook of trying to present the options for today's lynch.

i also feel the need to point out you were trying to do exactly this below:

DEADLINE IS IN 8 HOURS PEOPLE, WAKE UP AND VOTE

VOTE: Penguin

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

also just wanna make sure i get this out:

town: penguin, iks, sircakez
lesser town: gamma, nos, cmod
null: chara/pine
scum-ish: abr, johnny
scum: bingle

noraa: probalby bad town but they're playstyle is remarkably annoying

i'm not sure gamma actually knows what he thinks or can articulate his scum!us or not-scum!bingle position

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

given that they've been my townreads since well before this wagon happened, your point?

[Fun and Games]

Wait why is everyone afraid of us?

I'll do one too!

Town: penguin, gamma, cmod
Slightly lesser town: iks, nos, bingle, sircakez
Idk: ydrasse, pine
Scummy: abr, johnny

~ skitter

from a full week ago, ty ?

[Fun and Games]

that doesn't actually answer the question ...

[Fun and Games]

As much fun as it is to indulge you in your fantasy world. do you actually have any reasoning or are you just going to continue hard-trolling?

[Fun and Games]

it's like:

ABR: Your are susp because your reads are very COVENIENT - they are all NOT VOTING YOU
FG: No those are the same reads I've had since before the wagon.
ABR: I DONT BUY YOUR BULLSHIT SCUMBAG
FG: Here's a timestamped post.
ABR: Unfortunately for you I don't care about facts! DIEEEE!!

[Fun and Games]

oh, deflection, is it? I didn't see that coming.

Asking you for your best reason to elim me isn't deflection. It's basic accountability.

[Fun and Games]

It's almost comical how bad this push on me is :3

[Fun and Games]

When your "townreads" do new things that appear suspicious, I expect you to comment on it or think to yourself, hey maybe I was wrong about someone I thought was completely town. It doesn't make sense you hardtownread penguin and cakez and suspect me johnny and bingle. Your play is very safe. Consistent and safe, so much so that it's not scumhunting to me.

So your best reason for wanting me Elim'd is because you think I'm too logically consistent?

[Fun and Games]

Wait why is everyone afraid of us?

I'll do one too!

Town: penguin, gamma, cmod
Slightly lesser town: iks, nos, bingle, sircakez
Idk: ydrasse, pine
Scummy: abr, johnny

~ skitter

from a full week ago, ty ?

also notice how bingle is a townread here?
....

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

When your "townreads" do new things that appear suspicious, I expect you to comment on it or think to yourself, hey maybe I was wrong about someone I thought was completely town. It doesn't make sense you hardtownread penguin and cakez and suspect me johnny and bingle. Your play is very safe. Consistent and safe, so much so that it's not scumhunting to me.

like you're literally complaining that i haven't done things that i've very loudly done so like ...

[Fun and Games]

Our reads have evolved though. You can see bingle used to be lesser town on our readlist and now we are pushing for him being elim'd.

[Fun and Games]

It's not really a pro-town mindframe to break off engagement when you can't come up with a single good reason for pushing an elim. Looks shady af.

[Fun and Games]

The context I'm referring to is cakez and penguin, not bingle.

well you were talking about all of our reads, now you're talking about specifically the reads that did not change.

Congrats ABR, you are correct - we have people on our readlsist that did not change. You see our readslist is based on actual actions and thought and we don't randomly shuffle people around for fun

[Fun and Games]

So just to make sure I'm getting you completely straight.

You want us to be elim'd because 2 of our reads (specifically Penguin/Cakez) did not change ? You think this is a good reason for pushing an elim? :3

[Fun and Games]

oh ok now we're getting somewhere.

Which one do you think is fake? Let's go through the reasoning and you can let us know what's fake.

[Fun and Games]

I agree that all of F&G's townreads being people not interested in elimming them is off

again i've had those reads well before the wagon formed ...

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

ABR doesn't it feel weird to you how this wagon only formed within a day of deadline though?

The deadline is paused. We have time back on our side.

yeah but this should have formed earlier no?

yes ...
it's kinda like how support for iks came out of the woodwork randomly a few days ago when we were in a similar position

[Fun and Games]

that never really pulled together though

true, but mostly because i made a big stink about it while it was forming

either way i'm agreeing with you that it's sketch that this wagon has formed but numerous others have stalled (like i pointed out i think yesterday about the johnny wagon)

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

The more ABR talks, the more town he seems. He shares most of my thoughts and im having a lot of town pings there. He is putting an effort into his posts. Its 100% noticeable now.

well then

[Fun and Games]

I don't really like either of them at this point, but hopefully reading more into things helps me out.

Heya, is there anything u want to talk about?

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

I think I quite prefer Noraa over Bingle at this point.

Would kinda still prefer bingle
Kinda think noraa is bad!town

[Fun and Games]

*sigh*
am I not supposed to see this as a pocket?

No offense, but you're p clearly tunneled so your opinion on my posts doesn't really matter to me that much

[Fun and Games]

Still voting Bingle but I disagree.

Why scum over bad!town?

[Fun and Games]

Fair enough
I'm basically kinda reading it as too scummy to be scum

Also noting that noraa's pocket/egregious townreading of abr thing would be wild if they were partners and i'm scumreading both of them

Like there's several anti-parner-y interactions with people i *strongly* scumread

[Fun and Games]

I mean - short answer is intent and not actually caring.

Sorry, not parsing this?

[Fun and Games]

@Fun and Games Not yet. I know there were moments, so I'll go back and pull them here for you.

Fair enough, would like to hear them before u cast q vote plz

[Fun and Games]

Yeah i realized i misspoke in that post, more accurate would have been to say something like: ' if they're both scum noraa's bizarre tr of abr would be wild so it's hard for me to scumbin both of them and so i'm going with scum!abr over scum!noraa since holistically i scumread him more.'

Better?

But ya got your 'gotcha', grats

[Fun and Games]

I’m led to believe she’s asking questions just to ask and doesn’t actually care about the answer.

Oh yeah absolutely. Cept i think that it's more of a personality thing than anything else, like she's proud of herself for coming to a conclusion, it must be the right one, and she absolutely will ignore evidence that doesnt fit her pov.

G'night penguin!

[Fun and Games]

I mean you're heaping effusive praise on people who reinforce your conclusions + wont engage with people offering opposing opinions in good faith

[Fun and Games]

I don't agree with ur reads and I personally think ur scum.

Ok.

[Fun and Games]

1563 just seemed like a cop out excuse for him not to specify on reasons of thinking your reads were fake. However, I feel like there is somewhat of a "smug" air around you and ABR as if you think his reasons aren't believable and he isn't going to get you hanged which is somewhat surprising but also fits in with a scum narrative.

- i think you quoted the wrong post (that links to noraa)
- idk if smug is quite the right word, as neither of us were feeling that. but both of us were super annoyed at abr/(noraa's) push earlier and were very exasperated and frustrated, it felt like banging my head into a wall.
- i think his reasons are ridiculous, yes, and i tend to resort to sarcasm when i get exasperated
- he might get us hanged idk. Would give it p decent odds actually

[Fun and Games]

Oh yeah that was one of the exasperation-inducing posts, cuz what was i supposed to say to that already

[Fun and Games]

I will self to prevent a no-elim

[Fun and Games]

also just wanna make sure i get this out:

town: penguin, iks, sircakez
lesser town: gamma, nos, cmod
null: chara/pine
scum-ish: abr, johnny
scum: bingle

noraa: probalby bad town but they're playstyle is remarkably annoying

i'm not sure gamma actually knows what he thinks or can articulate his scum!us or not-scum!bingle position

~ skitter

Those are my reads

@ iks/penguin/cakez plz prioritize jingle tomorrow, ty

[Fun and Games]

I'm not asking you to trust me dude. If we no lynch this is going to be on you and IKSF.

I'm kinda just noting that I very strongly dislike the current browbeating ^

Also noting that the fact that the votes exist for me and not for bingle is sketch

[Fun and Games]

Lol he did actually

[Fun and Games]

Sounds good!

[Fun and Games]

I literally just said i was willing to self, the fact that you wanna vig me is not particularly threatening or interesting. I got my reads out alrewady

[Fun and Games]

Idk earlier he wanted to do your slot, probably will switch to mine given recent developments

[Fun and Games]

We decided to go for the hail mary move of blowing up a lab even though we only have like 4% chance of doing so because we felt if we didnt do it we are going to get pushed today.

we unfortunately only rolled a 3 so it did not work

[Fun and Games]

Well blowing up a lab would clear us and push the scum back from their win condition by a step.

Getting some kind of stat bonus is unlikely to help very much if we get elim'd the next day.

So the risk/reward seemed to make sense when we talked about it. Unfortunate our luck was super not great :3

[Fun and Games]

We decided to go for the hail mary move of blowing up a lab even though we only have like 4% chance of doing so because we felt if we didnt do it we are going to get pushed today.

we unfortunately only rolled a 3 so it did not work

"Two heads are better than one" debunked.

That was not a great idea

Guys I have so much knowledge

is that useful?

We decided to go for the hail mary move of blowing up a lab even though we only have like 4% chance of doing so because we felt if we didnt do it we are going to get pushed today.

we unfortunately only rolled a 3 so it did not work

this honestly just sounds like scum trying to get towncred for doing nothing.

Honestly, y'all would have said all of this no matter what we did last night, so we opted to go for the fun/cool option

Neither of us particularly cares to put effort in to preventing this, it's quasi-nightless, and you have our reads, so i dont have much else to say unless we're asked a particular question

Plz focus on abr, and johnny after us, ty

Glhv

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

Aside kinda wondering why abr didnt try to vig us last night

[Fun and Games]

Cuz the other options were exploring, which was boring and potentially dangerous. Or visiting the gym, which might get blocked again and is boring and probably useless given that we're getting lynched today. Or visiting thr library, which is also boring and probably useless

[Fun and Games]

We basically decided it didng actually matter cuz we'd be having this convo no matter what we did so we went for the option that seemed cool for the lols

[Fun and Games]

hello

Cmod and Noraa are probly both bad because they knew the scum would not roomblock the gym so they went there. a normal townie-thought process is usually not to go waste their 1 nightaction on the place that got blocked last night.

After we flip town should go there.

I think you guys should wagon us faster so we do not have to post here anymore thanks :3


~Not-Skitter

[Fun and Games]

Yeah I like this. My first reaction was that F&G was throwing.

And a better option would have been ... ?

[Fun and Games]

If you don't stop with this attitude, I am voting you.

Fair enough.

[Fun and Games]

Again just wanna note for tomorrow that its ... incredibly strange that abr didnt try to attack us last night

[Fun and Games]

Idk earlier he wanted to do your slot, probably will switch to mine given recent developments

I won't attack you. I'll let things play out day 3. Tonight I will explore for a weapon or go to the gym.

Everyone seems to be forgetting about this?

The point is: why'd you choose to do this instead of attacking us? You're getting a pass cuz people think you're a vig-equivalent, but why havent you tried to prove it?

And i'm p confident that iks is town

[Fun and Games]

will I ever get a page top? ;(

Lili is God-Tier at pagetop grabbing so probably no unless you like septuple post :3

[Fun and Games]

hey i confirmed just at work rn gonna catch up later. I didnt know what i was signing up for and need to do mech analysis. If someone can give me a list of currently performed actions that are publicly revealed that would be great

oh hell yea

Koba-JohnnyF-ABR-Noraa-Pooky

the shitpost dream team is complete

we can break some records here fam

[Fun and Games]

what's the longest mini game site record? We can do it team

[Fun and Games]

you forget that we have koba here and Koba is like the mvp of spam-posting

plus this game is nightless

[Fun and Games]

NORAA

DREAMS ARE MADE OF GREAT THINGS BELIEVE IN US

[Fun and Games]

what's the longest mini game site record? We can do it team

Just looked it up i don't think we have another 200 pages in us

JohnnyF

If you're good you should unvote us. we can do this together

[Fun and Games]

you forget that we have koba here and Koba is like the mvp of spam-posting

plus this game is nightless

Im reformed

why ?

[Fun and Games]

i am not sure I can handle this more mild and restrained koba

i miss my spamgod

[Fun and Games]

Do what? You're in a unique position, if town. Tell me where the scum are? Because last I looked it was me and Albert according to you? And while I'm uneasy about Albert just skating through last night, it's not the strongest read, y'know?

we've been wrong about bingle and georgie b - not sure why you would think we are the best place to look to for advice on scumhunting :3

[Fun and Games]

boop

[Fun and Games]

also just wanna make sure i get this out:

town: penguin, iks, sircakez
lesser town: gamma, nos, cmod
null: chara/pine
scum-ish: abr, johnny
scum: bingle

noraa: probalby bad town but they're playstyle is remarkably annoying

i'm not sure gamma actually knows what he thinks or can articulate his scum!us or not-scum!bingle position

~ skitter

@ whoever asked these are basically still our reads ^
I would very much like people to bear in mind tomorrow that we think iks is town

~ skitter

@ noraa when we flip town can you keep that in mind?

[Fun and Games]

I do not believe you will flip town and purposefully not including me in ur reads list just seems like preflip shade

Ok but given that yout beliefs are going to get shattered upon our townflip, i'm telling you what i think uou lot should be thinking tomorrow:

- town penguin, town iks, town gamma
- scum abr, scum johnny

I really really really dont want people to flip iks next. If i flip scum feel free to ignore me, but i won't, and i'm telling you that flipping iks next is a mistake

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

i mean i already made it p clear what i thought of your townbloc

i'm telling you that you should not flip iks tomorrow
again if i flip scum (which is not going to happen) feel free to ignore me
i'm writing this because i *am* going to flip town and i'm telling you that iks is town and i want you to listen tomorrow

[Fun and Games]

if you really flip town, I shall rethink my decision to lim iks. I don't see why town!you would be so confident in another player's towniness considering iks has not been towny at all this game. my SR is not entirely based off of that but I definitely think u and IKS' partner equity is what would drive a IKS lim tomorrow should you flip red. If you flip green, IKS alone doesn't look that bad tbh. I still don't think ur gonna flip green tho so :/

because they've been townie, i've been saying this for like a week tho ...

but we agree that when (if i guess from your pov) i flip green your reasoning to vote iks vanishes, right?

ok how does my greenflip affect your read on abr?

[Fun and Games]

idk if that's been outed so i won't say, but he's free to say if he likes

what does town!ydrasse look like?

[Fun and Games]

whos the non skitterz slot in fun n games

Pooky ^^

[Fun and Games]

@Gamma what type of rolls are you getting on attack/defense? you took 2 dmg last night - was the attack roll abnormally high?

[Fun and Games]

no. it does not but it makes my SR there much weaker and I likely won't push that wagon the next day unless there's a really big reason to.

ok now let's get to the abr bit

and @johnny i wanna talk to you

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

Lets play a game where we imagine my slot flips town
How does that affect your reads and where do u go next?

[Fun and Games]

Gamma, you too

[Fun and Games]

Lets play a game where we imagine my slot flips town
How does that affect your reads and where do u go next?

let's play a game called you've been hung up on this "when we flip town" thing all day and it's getting old.

Well since you lot wont listen to me today i'm trying to get you to listen to me tomorrow

[Fun and Games]

Lets play a game where we imagine my slot flips town
How does that affect your reads and where do u go next?

I'd have decent VCA fodder given how yesterday ended, I'd prolly go there. From what I remember Albert's been off every wagon, maybe also IKS?

Would you vote abr tomorrow?
And again let's imagine that ot's tomorrow and we flipped green: i'm p confident iks is town

[Fun and Games]

yeah at this rate I don't think its really possible for F&G to flip green.

After our flip i want you to come back to this page and review these takeways:

Town: penguin, iks, gamma
Scum: abr

[Fun and Games]

Penguin?

Hmmmm?

And i would like concrete names from your vca please?

[Fun and Games]

Fun and games what have your actions been thus far?

N1 we explored and found one of the labs (um, sorry) the euegene one

N2 we went to the gym

N3 last night we decided to try to kill a lab

[Fun and Games]

If F&G flips red(most likely will happen), IKS is one of the buddies
If not, I'd still like to look into a pool of {cake, penguin, lavar}

I mean if your reads wont change upon our greenflip that might be an indicator that your pov is bad ...

[Fun and Games]

Like that doesnt really make sense ?

[Fun and Games]

For now I have them down as town!lean but it is always possible that upon replacing in they could see that we were looking into F&G as a upcoming elimination and thus went for a bus

Hi why are we scum again?

[Fun and Games]

i dont understand this mentality that they are confirmed scum can someone tell me why

We were the cw to bingle yesterday so i ~kinda~ get it but i dont ger how people are acting like we're guaranteed to flip scum and wont engage with me about what to do *after* we flip green

Like i'm not even trying to get people to vote elsewhere today, but articulate where they go next

[Fun and Games]

I don't care, Fun and Games. I'm beyond it. Let's get on with this.

Incidentally i'm not the person you should be talking to if this is your approach

Gonna just loudly reiterate while i'm here that it's scummy that abr didnt try to attack us laat night, that he's tunneled, and that he refuses fo think about what happes next

[Fun and Games]

yall think it would break the setup to be pro town if we just shared all our info? im like trying to think of what the worst case scenario is or whatever. like i feel like scum could be sussed out via them having to fake info and us being able to track basically what everyone is doing

Lol i said this like irl the first day of this game and everyone shouted at us that this was a dumb idea

[Fun and Games]

F&G, claim you career.

We gef a +2 to defense rolls when attacked. Since abr appears to be *exactly* our counterpart we thought it's mildly +scum, that's why we were all interested in his role, and why we think he might be the person making the scum attacks, with a high attack bonus

[Fun and Games]

I'm ready for hammer guys.

Cakez and Lavar place your votes.

Oh look, doing the thing where he's trying to artificially force the end of day again, for like the third or fourth time now

[Fun and Games]

It's pretty clear FG is being bussed here. The entire town minus IKSF wants his head.

Ok since you're starting to annoy me greatly, i no longer want immediate hammer

I want to talk to literally everyone voting us and get them to articulate what happens on our greenflip, and reiterate as loudly as i possibly can where you lot a should go next tomorrow

(Well maybe not you cuz that's apparently a lost cause)

[Fun and Games]

Says the guy who was on every mislynch.

* gal

I never claimed perfect reads, but i'm doing my best here. That doesn't mitigate you strongarming shitty lynches

[Fun and Games]

Penguin?

Hmmmm?

And i would like concrete names from your vca please?

Penguin was early on both town wagons so far. Why is he town?

I dont think i answered this one: he's unequivocally in his town meta (i explained in great detail already multiple times, i can pull them up again if needed), and i think that this is a very surface-level vca

[Fun and Games]

Guys you can waste your breath on this scumbag or you can vote him out. The choice is yours

Her, again

[Fun and Games]

Guys you can waste your breath on this scumbag or you can vote him out. The choice is yours

Yeah sorry i meant to answer and just remembered, and circled back ^

[Fun and Games]

^^^^^^

[Fun and Games]

Sircakez can i get you to commit to reconsidering abr tomorrow (upon our townflip, etc)

[Fun and Games]

F&G, claim you career.

We gef a +2 to defense rolls when attacked. Since abr appears to be *exactly* our counterpart we thought it's mildly +scum, that's why we were all interested in his role, and why we think he might be the person making the scum attacks, with a high attack bonus

I ruined your plan by not attacking you, whick sparks infinite joy

Ftr i didnt write that post that you're thinking of, and wouldnt have

[Fun and Games]

Sircakez can i get you to commit to reconsidering abr tomorrow (upon our townflip, etc)

He said he would suspect me if you flipped green already. Try to read.

I'm aware, ty

[Fun and Games]

I'm basically trying to get him to say it again in the hopes that tomorrow he'll actually remember this conversation and act upon it

Repeating things very very loudly over and over again is key to actually get people to listen to me tomorrow

[Fun and Games]

yes

Ty

@abr i'm fully capable if reading the room and seeing who i'm most likely to get to listen to me posthumously, and thus taking action to try to actualize that when i'm not going to be here. Dont just dismiss what i'm doing as 'didnt read lol'

And I am going to make this as painful as possible for you tomorrow

[Fun and Games]

And I am going to make this as painful as possible for you tomorrow

In the senss that we'll see if i can make a lynch happen posthumously!

[Fun and Games]

Whoo progress!
Ok why cakez and iks, i think they're both town?

Why not noraa?

And will be back later, work, etc

[Fun and Games]

if you were really green, rn u would write a wall about what we need to do once you flip green not whine and say why is everyone not talking to me.

this is revisionist and not what i'm doing, ty. I'm not whining, and i'm functionally doing exactly what you want me to be doing - i.e. telling people where to go on my green flip - albeit with different methodology

And, imo, the way i'm going about it is going to be significantly more effective than just dropping a long wall without actually engaging with people

[Fun and Games]

you keep doing a ton of preflip analysis which just feels like scum setting up chain lims atm. And saying these today means tomorrow you can be like tee hee look at me I suggested this the day before. I was scum hunting therefore I get +++town points.

This ia decidedly *not* what they're doing, and this just reads like you're taking things out of context and trying to shade them

[Fun and Games]

wtf. the plentiful interaction between F&G and cake will make me drop an SR on cake if F&G flips red bc it just feels like a scum setting a townie up to be their "buddy"

And how is this any different than sircakez 'chaining lims', exactly?

[Fun and Games]

He's town if we're scum?

[Fun and Games]

very different. Cake is saying if u flip green, the limpool is only {this}

Not really, no

[Fun and Games]

Ok :shrug:

I ask that you do actually reasses tho

(Aside for all the people complaining we gave up- kinda hard to do anything if the people driving the lynch literally are saying they dont want to engage with us. Kinda silly to bash us for that imo)

[Fun and Games]

Hi i hope you wont still be doing tha when i flip green!

[Fun and Games]

No

That issue is stemming from abr and noraa steamrolling things through and ignoring other opinions, not iks

[Fun and Games]

Has anyone played with town!noraa before and are they usually so dismissive/steam-roll-y?

[Fun and Games]

Dk i'm still not convinced that they aren't just bad town

[Fun and Games]

Noraa.

Do you have any completed town-games where you are super confident about an SR and you push it the way you do now and you were right?

~Pooky

[Fun and Games]

Dk i'm still not convinced that they aren't just bad town

~ skitter ^

[Fun and Games]

Noraa I hope you're ready for Koba's spreadsheet of doom :3

~Pooky

btw can you un-vote me I'm not a bad guy :3

[Fun and Games]

Cake and Penguin r EH. Idk light scumreads.
Cake and F&G are most likely opposite alignments tho so that'll depend heavily on F&G's flip

If you think we flip red, that would make cake green according to your second line.

but according to your first line you have them as light scumread?

feels almost like you are setting up for when we will flip green and then tomorrow you play to go after SCake.

~Pooky

[Fun and Games]

Noraa.

Do you have any completed town-games where you are super confident about an SR and you push it the way you do now and you were right?

~Pooky

I pushed the last scum to hell and back in Ancient Arthropods and it lead to a town victory. I was JKer that game.

I have skim-read your ISO for ancient arthropods - link here: https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... er_sort=Go


You seem to change your mind multiple times, you are constantly moving your vote around, engaging with different people and have lots of opinions about who scum is in that game - you were town.

Here in this game you are death-tunneled on my slot without even really considering that you could be wrong and you are incredibly confident to a degree that seems fake. Reading your town ISO above, I find you to be much more open-minded in your town-game as opposed to here.

~Pooky

[Fun and Games]

Gamma you're wrong

trust in Pooky thx

[Fun and Games]

what fishy questions ? stop being ridiculous :3

[Fun and Games]

Gammmmmmmma

you know im goooooood :3

[Fun and Games]

during day phase items should be received immediately

[Fun and Games]

you might be taking this pagetop thing too seriously :3

[Fun and Games]

Pointing out again that he's the *exact* counterpart to us

[Fun and Games]

Yeah naw ABR has claimed to be useful, and hasn't proven. I'm still willing to let him prove it tho, especially if he delivers scum

Ok but he's had 3 chances now? Why are you giving him a pass exactly?

[Fun and Games]

And how do we know that careers are random again?

[Fun and Games]

And how do we know that careers are random again?

@ johnny

It's not in the op

[Fun and Games]

Also,

Us, day 1 saying we should massclaim night actions: scum

Dkoba now proposing that idea: nobody particularly has an issue with it

?

[Fun and Games]

Pooky we friends but like ... no. if ur town, u can yell at skitter post game for being scummy but I have high doubts that ur slot is town atm.

we literally share the same alignment noraa

if I'm town, skitter is town too :3

~Pooky

[Fun and Games]

I’d rather me and/or DK try to destroy the lab since we at least have decent odds of that while opening the vault is gonna be a challenge for us
Meanwhile your knowledge would easily destroy the lab but you at least have decent odds of opening the vault
And scum can also INCREASE THEIR OWN KNOWLEDGE with their operate action so opening the vault now versus later is advised

you should do the vault so you might get some items that keep you alive no?

[Fun and Games]

pooky start claiming mech things pls

N0 explored found a lab
N1 went to gym got blocked
N2 went to lab to try to deactivate it - failed rolled a 3

[Fun and Games]

VOTE: lavar


so gamma hold up what negative attacks have been performed on you, can you list them?
it would help if we knew what people have done that NEGATIVELY impacted us.

I was physically assaulted N1 and N2, that’s it
I’m gonna hazard a guess that the same rules that disallow standard attacks N0 also disallow operation, at least negatively. I do think it’s possible scum operated on someone to increase their knowledge N0.

they increased lavar's knowledge n0 didnt we already conclude this yesterday?

[Fun and Games]

VOTE: abr

[Fun and Games]

F&G has to go for gamestate progression

this is nonsense

[Fun and Games]

there's no fantasy world in which town has to kill town to progress the game state.

it's just a patently absurd statement to make.

[Fun and Games]

it would be pretty concerning for you to state otherwise

[Fun and Games]

@Fun & Games do you think Penguin and Cakez are scum? Because that's the only ABR team that makes sense to me if you're town

In case skits can't read the last page

I dont understand the premise behind this conlusion.

Why are penguin and cakez the only potential abr partners given me!town?

I still think cakez is town
Possibly rethinking penguin but still on the whole +town
Was there anything else directed at us?

~ skitter

[Fun and Games]

I don't. But ABR/IKS and ABR/Noraa were both parked on the same wagon back to back for several VCs yesterday.

Lavar is also an option for his partner

So ?
A) this doesn't preclude them being partners
B) there's like 11 people alive in the game rn

[Fun and Games]

Nah. Who is Ally's partner if he's scum?

In {you, noraa, pine's slot} + someone i'm wrongly townreading

[Fun and Games]

Given that i've had those reads for *over two weeks now* i'm baffled how you can come to that conclusion

[Fun and Games]

I can quote a post from like 1500 posts ago with those reads

Like tell me my reads havent changed, but to complain that my reads are changing too much is ridiculous

[Fun and Games]

Who could you be wrongly townreading? Plausibly.

Atm i'm thinking penguin but it's something i'm interested in pursuing rn

I would like to hear how you'e come to the conclusion that if scum!abr penguin and cakez must be his partners

[Fun and Games]

*not something i'm interested in pursuing rn

[Fun and Games]

Good god you're conflating me saying you're both 'probably bad town' and 'a potential abr partner' as 'my scumreads reads change each time i post'

I've noted multiple times that i'm waffling on if you're bad town or just scum

Compare the null/scumread in 1611 lines with my list of potential abr partners ... notice the strong level of overlap ???

The fact that where i'm landing rn on one read (that i've been vacillating on for over a week now) changed over time doesnt mean my scumreads are inconsistent

[Fun and Games]

wait nora went to the gym.after it got blocked? cmon fr nora is literally so scummy i s2g

I'm p sure ydrasse is the one who actually went

Like half the game went that night

[Fun and Games]

Oh wait you're saying they went last night? Yeah that was silly and pooky called her out on that already

[Fun and Games]

scum!abr penguin and cakez must be his partners

Votes placed like partners place votes, though looking back on d1 I'd say penguin is less likely. Probably Lavar/AbR/Cakez

I gotta say, again, that this is a fairly surface level analysis

[Fun and Games]

Johnny dis i get you to commit to reconsidering abr upon my townflip?

[Fun and Games]

Remind me why it doesnt bother you that he hasnt done so yet?
(Or even tried to ...?)

[Fun and Games]

I dont really get why we're giving him a pass for his role when he hasnt done it, and he's had 3 chances already ....

[Fun and Games]

so? why is that relevant?

the fact that he only claimed it yesterday doesn't change the fact that he could have done a proveable action on n0 or n1

people are giving him a chance for him to prove it, but he's had three chances already

[Fun and Games]

"Could have done" =/= "should have done" =/= "it's scummy to not have done"

He had pressure to perform for 1 night and blew it. I'll not allow him to get through tomorrow if he blows it again

that doesn't change the fact that he had ample time and oppurtunity to do so already, and that last night would have literally been the perfect night to do so given his reads and how the day ended yesterday

also i'm p sure that at the end of day1 he was alluding to using his action but i have to go back and double-check

[Fun and Games]

Don't say that. In case doctors purposefully mess with him to set him up tmrw, that'd be bad.
This is the plan imo
Lavar give ABR the weapon
ABR kill Lavar tonight. I can provide an extra attack to make sure it goes thru but this way I still get two night actions. One attack and one other action.

that's not the plan, and just because you announce it doesn't make it so

[Fun and Games]

idk if that was directed at me or not

[Fun and Games]

noraa is basically sticking her fingers in her ears and going 'la la la' whenever confronted with anything that opposes her narrow pov
she also repeatedly drops mistruths and misstatements as if they're fact and ignores people who try to point out how she's wrong

[Fun and Games]

Have you read any of d2 at all? The almost FnG lim that switched to Bingle?

are we actually scummy outside of being bingle's cw ?