Large Normal 223 | New Beginnings | GAME OVER

[Hectic]

Hiya all.
This is one of my first forum games so I'm quite excited!
So I thought I better prepare myself because I've heard all the stories of wolfgods (that's what we call in them in the inner circles) of the likes of Sharan Tate and Skellen solving games by page 5. Insanity?!
So I've been up all night reading through the mafiascum wiki and I am now a walking encyclopedia of knowledge.
I'm serious, if you want to know about ANYTHING, whether it be about what an abbreviation means, or some obscure study or guide into how often people who mention self-meta are scum: just ask me, I've got you covered.

So while reading through the wiki, I discovered that it's site meta to claim the Miller role right from the get go, so without further ado:

I am the

Miller Survivor

.

I know you may have reservations given the Survivor part of my claim. But I give you my honest law-abiding word that I will strive to and will always work with the town's best interests from here on out.

In fact, here's a pledge:

I, Hectic, will self-hammer myself in any situation where the number of mafia are equal to the number of town.

That pledge up there stops me from siding with scum and winning the game with them in a LyLo situation. With this fallback, you guys can just use this failsafe to spite me out of a win. Therefore, I will never betray you.

I look forward to finding scum with you all.

[Hectic]

VOTE: Rick Dalton

Love you <3

roster is flailing here.
And with that I just made roster 15% more likely to be scum.
A study on mafiascum states that anyone accused of flailing is 15% more likely to be scum.
However, the person accusing someone of flailing is actually made 30% more likely to be scum.
Unfortunately, even though I am 30% more likely to be scum here, I cannot self-vote because I am confirmed Survivor to myself.
So I will have to take the second best option and vote for roster, who is 15% more likely to be scum here:

VOTE: roster

[Hectic]

Ah, OK, that makes sense, but I think my serious vote on roster is also good, right?

Anyway, I had another look at my role PM and apparently I'm a "Survivor Miller", not a "Miller Survivor". Not sure if the order of the words matter but thought I better bring it up anyway

[Hectic]

I think I've read about this on the wiki actually.
What he's doing here is

breadcrumbing

. He's essentially giving us clues that he's a survivor, so that when he claims it D4 or something, he can point back to this post.
It's a bit weird to have 2 survivors though, so:

VOTE: profii

[Hectic]

Thanks for the help btw, Elements.
There's a term on the wiki for people like you. IC I think it was.

[Hectic]

oo 21 players now this is something new. Never been a game with over 15 players before. A stark difference from the days of playig mafia in warring factions side forum for forum games

was a struggle at times to get a game with 10 players of which 2-4 would be turbo lurkers. Think a game with so low activity that it could have its days extended to a hoel month

I think this is a MyLo situation, correct?
Why are you doing this Information Instead of Analysis stuff, the wiki says this is a scumtell?
You should know that if you are scum, I won't be siding with you this game even though I technically can since I'm a Survivor. Sorry.

VOTE: bob3141

[Hectic]

For anyone unaware, my post up there is a

PageTop

. As far as I remember from the wiki, I don't think they serve any purpose other than being the post at the top of the page.
Though they can hold a sort of strategic value of sorts; think of them as watchtowers built into the walls of a stronghold. They're great for scouting out the opposition, but are also very prominent/obvious, due to their positioning.
Hey, maybe I can be an IC one day!

[Hectic]

I think he's referring to players being inactive with the "turbo-lurkers" label rather than implying a 4v6 mylo situation.

Oh, I see. Thanks, IC.
Can I ask people to only use terms found in the wiki please? As that's the extent of my knowledge.

[Hectic]

Dont think there is term in wiki for what they were like.

Maybe you could try adding the term to the wiki?

Who claimed survivor.

Hey Bob! I did.
I ISOed you (looked at your posts in isolation) earlier and I found you haven't put a RVS (Random Voting Stage) vote down, any reason for this?

[Hectic]

Oooh man, this is gonna be fun.

VOTE: Hectic

Because I don't want him to survive.

Why not? I promised to work with you guys and everything?

IAATSINARING < that's my breadcrumb for this game.

[Hectic]

Hectic, what does the wiki say about gimmicks?

Hmm, I couldn't find a page for that on the wiki strangely, so I have no idea what you are talking about. I'll do some research into it and try and make a page myself though.

[Hectic]

Damn it Hectic. You know as well as I do that I was planning to accuse someone of flailing in my opening post and now it'd just look unoriginal. You know what? I'm going to come right out and accuse YOU of FLAILING. We both know that there's no statistics in the wiki about people who accused someone of flailing AND got accused on flailing so it's going to be interesting to see you forced to stop hiding behind the wiki.

Oh no, uhhh, it doesn't mention people who have been accused and are doing the accusing in the table...

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Flailing
IC, please help me out here. Hopkirk is OMGUSing me.

Current reads:
Hop
profii
Elements
Garmr
Bob
Lil Uzi Vert
Kirk

[Hectic]

I've been told by the wiki that providing a

readslist

is good way of helping people sort your though process. So:

Hop - Based on meta. As memey as he is in recent town games with me.
profii - Reactions and content genuine so far.
Elements - Done nothing wrong and had been active, but his play is oddly regular.
roster - Null.
Garmr - Fine with me being around, which I really appreciate though!
Bob - Non game progressing contributions so far.
Kirk - Kill him with fire.

Woah, a lot more people just posted. I will add them to my

readslist

at a future date after I have checked with the wiki whether they are good or not.

[Hectic]

Elements - Done nothing wrong and had been active, but his play is oddly regular.

Is this in comparison to my more erratic behaviour in other games?

The wiki tells me that we shouldn't talk about ongoing games.
Your helpful entrance here does parallel your undertale game. So you're a nulltown for me due to paranoia.

[Hectic]

Honestly I try not to talk about the undertale game. It was kind of a trainwreck after we realized the omniversal transport deity from that other rolemaddness game on a different site had swapped all the night actions in that game with all of the role actions in our much more simple game. Still don't know why a mod would do that.

-Kirk

So I was initially confused about your Hop/Kirk thing since I couldn't find it in the wiki, but I get it now.
Could I hear what Kirk's read on Hop is right now?

I was referring to the pick your power game

Took me a while to find that game on the wiki, but I skimmed over your entrance in it again, and you came up out with serious reads/discussion a lot more quickly (as a Lyncher). So I think anti-town you=more helpful/less erratic is a fair conclusion to draw.

I believe I know who hectic is

Go on, guess. Want to see if you're correct.

[Hectic]

no I was just correcting a behavior, unless it was a joke and flew over my head

I don't want to see that happen again when someone subtly crumbs doctor or something and someone else posts,, "hey guys this is a [bold]doctor crumb[bold]"

Sorry, I won't point any of from now on. Good thing you made this post too, because I've noticed 3 more breadcrumbs I think, but I won't say what they are now thanks to your advice.

The wiki tells me that being LAMIST is sometimes a scumtell, but I think Carcalily has genuine concern for me not outing breadcrumbs, so she can be put down as townlightpush for now.

flailing this wifom that buzzword buzzword buzzword blah blah

who made a page 1 list??

and if you keep signing your posts I will treat you like a hydra

Who are you accusing of flailing here? This makes you and that person you're accusing more likely to be scum, so it's important to clarify who you're talking about.

[Hectic]

I don't Actually Mind hectic pointing out breAdCrumbs. It's Only a Problem if mafia kills tHe person who is doing the breAdcRumming. Don't Care if Losers Aren't In My traIN of thinkinG here, we Can dO this without People like that dragging us down.

Is the flailing thing cumulative? It sounds like we should all just accuse the d1 lynch target of flailing before we hammer (I call the lolhammer btw) to increase their chance of flipping scum.

@Hectic: if anyone gets to L2 and you want to lolL1 I'll lolhammer or vise versa.

OK, that makes sense.
Why are you capitalising certain letters In your post, is your shift key broken or wAs that intentional?
Just thought that was worth bringing up because I've heard of a scuMtell from the wiki where scum go back and edit typos into their posts to make them look more natural. SURVIVOR.

@Everyone:

If you're about to be lynched, could you please accuse people of flailing? It'll increase the chances of you being scum before you flip, so do this even if you're town please.

[Hectic]

122 is a masterpiece. I'll add one for you.

"This one time, Hopkirk used LAMIST in a game with me. The mod thought he was so obvtown, they turned him into an Innocent Child to save us all some time."

am I the only one who doesn't know who hectic is because it seems like y'all do

Hi Carca. I was reading through your wiki page and really getting to know you when I noticed something.
It seems like you've rolled an anti-town role as often as a town role (3 to 3). Does this mean you are more likely to roll town here because you are due more town games, or will the weighted trend continue and you will roll anti-town again?
I'd like some clarification, thanks.

[Hectic]

Oh man, hectic and hopkirk are both going to make this game fun to read and infuriating to play. I don't have a clue how to read them, but it's enjoyable at least. Can't tell if carcalilly was joking, because that was a bit LAMIST. Carca were you joking?

VOTE: Carcalilly

Hectic's survivor crumb had me dying.

bad post

vote: billy pilgrim

JEEP's guide to catching mafia told me that naked votes with little explanation like this are usually bad.
Do you dislike his post because he's LAMISTing it up and not scumhunting?

[Hectic]

I didn't really find an answer on the wiki for how I should tackle this, so:
I can neither confirm nor deny any discussion about whether I am an alt.

[Hectic]

is hectic an alt of an old user or a genuinely new player? because that's gonna drastically impact how i'm reading them

I'd say alt.

Hi Dave!
So there was this study on the wiki I was reading where newbie!scum are a lot more likely greet the thread than newbie!town.
Could you tell me if you're a newbie please?

[Hectic]

I'm qualified to be an IC. In fact maybe I am an IC but it won't come out for a couple days.

Oh, wow. So I read this on the IC page from the wiki:

The easiest way for newbies to learn is to watch good players playing at their best. Do not attempt to water down your game, or play any differently in terms of your objectives as you would in any other game. Make sure you're playing to win, and make sure you attack just as hard as you would in any other game. Do not attempt to coddle the newbies by playing down to their level, as that will not help them advance as players, and that's pretty much the point of the game

Could I see you playing at your best please? What's your page 6 gamesolve?

[Hectic]

Hectic's a hard null for me so far, but I like YAG.

I like this read.

[Hectic]

Carca is town I think.

[Hectic]

hopirk posting that carca is town on the exact same minute that i posted carca is town probably makes all three of us town

Oh, wow, that makes 4 now!
I've heard about this on the wiki, are we forming a

townblock

?

[Hectic]

Hectic's a hard null for me so far, but I like YAG.

I like this read.

does this mean that you townread me too?

what makes you tr carca?

Similar thoughts to Hopkirk about Carca. Frustration feels genuine regarding this alt business so she can actually read me.
Don't know about you.

[Hectic]

hopirk posting that carca is town on the exact same minute that i posted carca is town probably makes all three of us town

Oh, wow, that makes 4 now!
I've heard about this on the wiki, are we forming a

townblock

?

now i feel like you're trying to piggyback off of hopkirk & i's read

Disregard that PageTop. Though I agree with the Carca read, it was after I'd seen both your and Hopkirk's reads.

[Hectic]

Oh actually, I decided to go through Great's

ISO

and I like her answer to my question in 165.

I'll put her down as a towntilt for now.

[Hectic]

Ok makes sense. It's early, so this was basically my way of directing a question to Carcalilly while we are still in LIVS. LAMIST means look at me I'm so town. Her comment about worrying about Hectic pointing out breadcrumbs in response to what I thought was a pretty obvious joke came across to me as her trying to score easy townpoints. That's why I asked if it was a joke. And I didn't read it as a joke initially, which is why I directed the vote there.

And as for my comments that I can't read Hectic and Hopkirk, I mean that. The jokey posts come across as though they're not game solving, but they're legit nai, so sorting them is tough. Yet for some reason I decided to torture myself by replacing into this game.

Could I ask what LIV means please? I don't see it anywhere in the wiki.
If you believe the jokey posts are NAI, can't you just disregard them?

[Hectic]

Woah, I am on a roll of PageTops here. I think I read on the wiki somewhere that consistent PageToppers are 11% more likely to be town.
This statistic is incorrect however, since I am a Survivor this game. Silly wiki.

[Hectic]

Woah, I am on a roll of PageTops here. I think I read on the wiki somewhere that consistent PageToppers are 11% more likely to be town.
This statistic is incorrect however, since I am a Survivor this game. Silly wiki.

What I think you may find interesting is that there was this old statistic/graphic that "scum tend to post less" in general, so the likelyhood of pagetopping is less.

I've been wrecked by exceptions before, so it doesn't really help you in my book. Everyone's got an equal chance of being scum here. Except maybe gamma.

I was reading through Mastin's Insane Tells in the wiki and apparently a lot of these statistics and guides become obsolete once people actually start reading them and playing against the tells.

What's your history with

Omega Ruby

Gamma Emerald?

[Hectic]

Some people (myself included) believe the RVS stage is never truly random and you always pick someone for some reason, so it's a "low information vote stage"

I think it's a minority opinion

Hmm, there's probably a statistic for scum being more/less likely to pick their buddies during RVS, but I couldn't find anything like that on the wiki unfortunately.
We could start gaining info for that now if you like? What alignment are you and was your RVS your scum buddy?

[Hectic]

Some people are God meta manipulators and following what you know can be a weakness for them to exploit. They take no prisoners.

I have a little bit of history. He's just town.

Oh no. This makes me want to OMGUS you because the wiki is all I have to aid my scumhunting this game. I'll just hope there's no wolfgods in this game then.

I'll take your word for it.

HEAL: Gamma Emerald

[Hectic]

So I'm still reading through Mastin's Guide for Scumhunting, and Rick's behaviour this game fits perfectly into "riding the wave" scum archetype she describes.

VOTE: Rick Dalton

[Hectic]

i take it back. hectic is probably lying about being a survivor for reactions but he's still probably town

So if I understand it correctly. Your read on me has went from Genuine Town>Scum piggybacking>Town?
I've consulted the wiki and apparently it's useful to ask people about their though process when it comes to reads changing.
So: What caused the second change in your read?

Also, I'd like to encourage any Godfather vest gifters to target me in the night please. Since I'm a Miller, it'd really help me out if someone could turn me into a Godfather please. Thanks!

@Hopkirk:

I thoroughly enjoyed reading through those sigs. If you're trying to compete with me on the meme counter, I WILL

Finger of Suspicion

you without warning. Got it?

[Hectic]

Mastina’s one of the people who’ve misread me in the majority of games I’ve played against her.

She scum read me in most of my town games, and then town read me as VI town when I was scum bussing a buddy whom she also thought of as town.


Hello, I’m Rick Dalton. The best TV baddie cowboy in the biz.

I’m the antithesis of the normal mafia philosophy and bring results. This town ain’t big enough for the two of us.

Oh, that's unfortunate, I knew I should've kept reading through JEEP's guide instead...

It's just that I haven't seen any attempts to progress the game or scumhunt in your 17 posts. Do you disagree with the basis of my read, disregarding where on the wiki it came from?

Ugh, don't remind me about the memecounter from meme mafia. I regret that mechanic already.
I'm a bit busy atm so can you do the memecounter later? Don't think LUV does those for some reason.

Despite the amount of demand from people in this thread, at this time Hectic and I aren't planning to form a stand up comedy duo. We'd also like to deny that we intend to sell resonabely priced tickets (with ample leg room) to our opening show next week.

Don't like JJD doubling down.

Who's this Arnie you mention. Are you hinting something?

I was pretty sure that topping it would turn me into an Innocent Child this game, that's kind of what I was going for...
To satiate the crowd, should we combine our slots into a hydra? I don't think it's too late.

[Hectic]

Oh no.

[Hectic]

I feel like you should bus him a bit more, it's not like he doesn't deserve the criticism here.

[Hectic]

Also should I be changing my vote so often or does erratic behaviour like this usually get scumread?

[Hectic]

I've heard from the wiki that walls are a great way of getting points/reads across without clogging up the thread. So here's my first one!

Could I ask what LIV means please?

Short for LIVERPOOL. Check his avatar!

I think I read somewhere in the wiki that Liverpool supporters are 17% more likely to be Bulletproof Jesters. Do you think we should lynch him or let him walk alone?

Hoptic would make an amazing name for a hydra between us.

No, that's ridiculous. How about Heckirk?
I'll gift you fruit tonight if you oblige.

Oh no.

That wasn't supposed to be posted here.

Don't like JJD doubling down.

What's wrong with him doubling down? Do you dislike the certainty with which he is reading his tone as town?

I can soul read Davy boy Jones

So I was looking through the wiki for

soulreading

but couldn't find anything. Do you like Davy boy Jones in a personal sense or a game sense? I feel like something like that is important to clarify as we want as little confusion as possible when talking about who we dislike/like.
For example, I really dislike profii for his pinpoint accuracy in guessing my alignment every time, but I really like him this game.
Like=think they're town in this context.
Their tone has been genuine and they're giving

townie vibes

.

[Hectic]

Personally, I am loyal to my local team of New York Red Bulls.

Henry made his name playing the way he did for us.

[Hectic]

Pretty sure Soulreading is something FL just made up. Either that or it's that thing Cowbells has where you sell your soul for enhanced mafia abilities.

Oh, I was wondering why Lil Uzi Vert approached me earlier asking me about some... deal.
I didn't think I needed the extra help though, since I have the wiki by my side.

Don't like JJD doubling down.

What's wrong with him doubling down? Do you dislike the certainty with which he is reading his tone as town?

Upside down question mark

[Hectic]

I like having hetic in this game his generating content and making the game flow.

That being said Town shouldn't really want a neutral survivor in the game but I'm a bit of hypocrite but a hypocrite with reasons . I guess we just treat mylo as a day earlier.


Finding it hard to digest 10 pages of content so fast.

VOTE: You are great

Gut doesn't like her.

Thanks! I like you too

I think Garmr's reason for keeping me around despite me being potentially anti-town is legitimate and genuine.

I'll put him down as a townbend in my wiki.

[Hectic]

i take it back. hectic is probably lying about being a survivor for reactions but he's still probably town

So if I understand it correctly. Your read on me has went from Genuine Town>Scum piggybacking>Town?
I've consulted the wiki and apparently it's useful to ask people about their though process when it comes to reads changing.
So: What caused the second change in your read?

my overall read on you is town, but the timing of you townreading carca and then trying to get in on the "town-bloc" felt manipulative. my reads aren't static this early in the game, i call it like i see it.

Fair. You should know that my "I think Carca is town" was intentionally trying to replicate your one, and that forcing myself into the townblock based on it was part of the joke.

I'll stop with LAMIST now, the wiki tells me it's a bad idea.

[Hectic]

I'm town reading hopkirk. I've never experienced them forming a town block as not town

In forum games or IRL?
(IRL means In Real Life)

[Hectic]

Hectic. Name 5 or more normal/non-bastard roles. all but one of which aren't your role, and one that is. Randomize the order. I want to see if I'm right about you.

Bulletproof Jester
Survivor Miller
Lynchproof Lyncher
Town Bus Driver
Mafia Day Vigilante

irl. Unless you know to the contrary?

I remember specific examples of him doing it as town for sure, but can't actually specifically remember him doing it as mafia. I feel like he has done so though.

[Hectic]

idm day 1 its just not always as entertaining. but its still a part of the game

Day 1 is great. I love everyone trying to generate content and discussion through talking about nothing, and then something more substantial as the day goes on.

The wiki tells me that RVS and RQS are particularly helpful for this.

[Hectic]

Gamma might be scum. I don't remember town!Gamma being this active most of the time.

Don't you doubt your ability to read me? Also I refuse to believe what you are saying. I'm certain I've been this active in games in the past, and honestly I don't see how this is that active.

Why'd you halt your catchup after seeing this post, Gamma?

I was reading your guide to finding scum on the wiki, and you said scum are more prone to being put off the thread by being scumread. Did you stop catching up for that reason?

[Hectic]

Oh, nevermind.

Well played, Gamma. I will not be voting for you for the next 2 and a half irl days

[Hectic]

Trying to accurately read Hectic early in the game is never going to work out the way you think it will.

What's the motivation for telling people not to try to read someone?

Not telling anyone not to read him. Just warning that his early game is unpredictable and intentionally confusing.

What'd you think of my answers?
And are you an alt account?
I went through my

Mind Palace Wiki

and I didn't see you in any of my previous games.

[Hectic]

Hectic/Elements/Hopkirk have a connection of some kind.

It's true
They're all town

Why Elements?
He hasn't even self-voted for himself, let alone claimed serial killer yet.

[Hectic]

Ugh, don't remind me about the memecounter from meme mafia. I regret that mechanic already.

Oh PLEASE tell me more!

That game was amazing.
The game was called Meme Mafia and was role madness, we thought the Meme part was just a flavour thing.
I got off to a strong start posting many memes as you'd expect, and then out of nowhere Hopkirk (the mod) posts this goddamn Meme Counter.
Now suddenly everyone's suspicious of me for being like 5 ahead of the next person on this newly discovered Meme Counter.
"Why does Hectic want to be so high on the meme counter?" - Jimbo
"I think Hectic is scum, he probably activates some hidden ability by being first in memes." - Bobby
"Yeah, and he didn't realise the Meme Counter would show up." - Clarise

The worst thing was that I had to stop posting memes

And then at the end of course, it's revealed that the whole Meme Counter was a meme itself and meant absolutely NOTHING.

Fantastic game.

[Hectic]

Ehhhaaaaaeeehhh this reminds me of mastina's "God of scumplay" post

Tried a quick wiki search for this but landed nothing. Where do I find this?

[Hectic]

Hmm, my posts haven't been ALL jokes/memes.
I've thrown in some pretty fantastic reads and gamesolves as well.

Perhaps I should put everything I'm serious about in-

the green text of seriousness.

I read something about

the red text of truth

in the wiki, where everything under that font colour in your posts must be the truth, which effectively makes it a trust tell and therefore a bannable offence.
Therefore, I will be using a clever loophole where I will be changing the font colour to

green

instead.

(this is a joke, don't ban me pls)

I'll have to make good use out of this before the mods catch on and patch it out in the next balance update.

I am Hectic.

[Hectic]

interesting how all are different factions, idk how to take this information though. nice list though

Thanks!

I worked hard on it.

I have a feeling deep inside my bones that Tchill is town. His catchup is natural. 409 is pretty good.

There's been like zero content that's alignment indicative imo.

I wouldn't say that though. There's been reads and questioning thrown around as well I feel.

Pretty sure Hopkirk is town. Elements bringing up Hopkirk's history with townblocs is town-indicative, especially since he wasn't in it.

Not knowing what a green PM is is NAI.

EBWOP. More to come. Hope your eyes aren't bleeding yet.

[Hectic]

Hectic is currently playing in line with the irl towntell I have on him but idk if it works online. He's had one scumgame (offsite) where a brief skim doesn't show it come up and he does play in line with it in a towngame (offsite) that finished a couple of weeks ago.

@Hectic: just had a look and you started your first scumgame with a 'hey'. Tragic mistake really.
Personally I started mine with 'Has' but I was a SK and idk if that tell works on SKs as well as mafia.

Goddamn, I'll figure out what this towntell is one day. I've looked everywhere on the wiki for it but don't see any mention of it on my profile.

That scum game was a... mistake. Next newbie game, I'll start off with a "hey" while congratulating the doctor and accusing someone of flailing.

[Hectic]

green

stop

Is this better?

[Hectic]

everyone has daytalk

I have two separate daytalks weirdly. In both, everyone there is getting really annoyed at me for some reason.

[Hectic]

Bingo! You get a free T-shist signed by Steven George Gerrard himself!

Hey Judge, I've learnt from the wiki that parking your vote on someone for long periods of time can be scum-indicative. Are you still happy with your RVS on me? Got any scumleans?

[Hectic]

everyone has daytalk

I have two separate daytalks weirdly. In both, everyone there is getting really annoyed at me for some reason.

you weren't supposed to see that

Completely disregarded.

[Hectic]

I'm guessing you made a mistake but explain your thinking here

Elements is a Goon. Goons don't have much brains (and neither do Judges). He just makes shit up.

Say wouldn't be cute if I did a sequel and casted Sandra Bullock as my apprentice?

Is this a serious read?

[Hectic]

JJD, from the wiki, I've read Judge Joseph Dredd is a most feared, respected, and reverred figure in Judaical system. He's known to have NEVER lost a custody battle case.

So start doing your job, and start UPHOLDING THE LAW by finding those scum.

[Hectic]

green

stop

Is this better?

ok, slightly, but please

[imagine the font colour is green] Fine, how about this? [/imagine the font colour is green]

[Hectic]

I don't think that's a scumslip. I'm assumed green PM to mean a town PM, I don't think the colour of the PM is important, and I think Carca was just assuming green=town for the way she used it.

[Hectic]

“Judge Joeseph Dread shouldn’t actually check people as cop. The chance of them being a godfather is actually higher than the chance he’s ever wrong about a read”

Also, this is a reminder. We should be lynching Elements before dawn.. (Yeah, I'm too dumb to tell the difference between dawn and twilight. To me the sun isn't there but the sky isn't completely dark either way, so same difference)

Why?

Because I said so! I AM THE LAW!

Don't tell me... are you hiding behind your gimmick to not play the game?
I haven't written the page for gimmick accounts yet (it will be made soon) but isn't that scum-indicative?

[Hectic]

I don't think that's a scumslip. I'm assumed green PM to mean a town PM, I don't think the colour of the PM is important, and I think Carca was just assuming green=town for the way she used it.

Basically, I think the use of 'green' wasn't in a literal sense of the role PM being

green

.

[Hectic]

Pilgrim, opinions on Elements?

and hectic, still solid on that Dalton vote?

Nah. Wish Bob would come back, we have so much more to discuss.

VOTE: JJD

[Hectic]

I like the sentiment going around that people are okay with keeping me (a Survivor) around though. I look forward to our joint victory, and don't forget the failsafe!

I'd like to thank everyone and in return will say: NONE of you are flailing.

[Hectic]

Hectic's whole shtick is to be loud, lot of words and confusing to read.

Accurate IMO. Townish observation.

Fine, I get it.
I was so eager to join this game and play with all you guys, I literally stayed up all night memorizing the wiki so I wouldn't be left behind in discussion.
But I see how it, clearly my input isn't wanted here.
I shall now take my leave, expect me to return a few hours before the deadline to land a lolhammer.

[Hectic]

Well, the wiki did warn me about playing too many games simultaneously. I swear on my Fish Monger that I'll catch up tomorrow.

And when I catch up, I don't just catch up, I overtake.
Wiki tells me that the top poster rank is held by town 78% of the time during day 1.
So I'll be taking that tomorrow, thanks very much, Carca.

-Hectic "Hectic" Hectic

[Hectic]

Woah, what's going on here?

According to my memory of the wiki, wagons on people who probably aren't even reading the thread right now are utterly useless. Move your votes from roster to anyone else, people.
Either roster will get replaced or will make a return and we can judge/lynch him then if he continues to actively lurk.

[Hectic]

I don't like Hectic dropping out like that.
Lots of slots in prod range.
Fake claims are

fun

but don't really help solve.
Setup spec in a closed game before any flips seems pointless at best, and harmful is more likely.

VOTE: rosterfoster seems like a good place to poke, for now.

It is no longer a good place imo,

Also to everyone voting them, if they come back you can always get back on, hell id probably join you if they dont have a good reason.

If rosterslot ends up being scum we have a candidate for partner here?

Yes but not much to determine which is scum. Since theres no defense

Ok, maybe I do need to punch here.
You're the partner I'm talking about.
You're defending roster, who has done nothing to deserve defense.
Bleating about "ooh that's an empty slot" is nothing useful.
You'd prefer the wagon to be on someone else?
VOTE: EveeLution Army

Don't like this reasoning. Eevee's right.
What's the point of a wagon on someone who literally admitted they're skimming the thread, and still haven't posted since votes started building up on them?
Someone who's not reading the thread and playing can't exactly feel pressure they're not aware of.
Wiki says, most of the time, inactives are actually just inactive and not scum tactically not posting for long periods of time.
And as Eevee said, we can move back onto roster if he returns and starts acting scummy, or continues to actively lurk D1 without really contributing.

UNVOTE: JJD
VOTE: davesaz

[Hectic]

Woah, what's going on here?

According to my memory of the wiki, wagons on people who probably aren't even reading the thread right now are utterly useless. Move your votes from roster to anyone else, people.
Either roster will get replaced or will make a return and we can judge/lynch him then if he continues to actively lurk.

If that's in a wiki (I have my doubts), the entry is waaay too shallow.
Wagons have a purpose beyond their effect on the person being wagoned.

A lynch on an inactive has purpose if it's a scum lynch, and can be worse than useless if it's not. But wagons are most definitely not equal to lynches.

Any other comments on the things that have happened since you posted last?

I understand your point about wagons being useful. Since you can see the stances people take on it and who's on/off it.
But we can do that but on someone who's actually active anyway.

What do you think of Eevee's comments since?
I'm lazy posting right now, I'll go back and catch up properly.

[Hectic]

Woah, what's going on here?

According to my memory of the wiki, wagons on people who probably aren't even reading the thread right now are utterly useless. Move your votes from roster to anyone else, people.
Either roster will get replaced or will make a return and we can judge/lynch him then if he continues to actively lurk.

Well, according to my memory of the wiki referring to the wiki in every post is becoming silly. It is also a useless move that's unlikely to convince anyone. Finally, roster (pr his replacement) should feel the heat. I am not going to let lurkers lurk any further, and if there's a wagon on a lurker I am going to join it. Right now I believe this is the largest wagon on a lurker,

Recalling back on my reading of the wiki, your memory of the wiki of referring to the wiki every post is flawed I believe. 58% was the statistic.

Wagons on lurkers are boring, they can't respond and we're not getting a better read on them because they aren't posting/contributing at all.
Let's wagon active players even if they're not that scummy. Can still get a better read on them and make them more obvious town if they don't crumble under pressure (because they're town and have nothing to hide - other than PR stuff obviously).

[Hectic]

The classic. How can I refuse?

HEAL: elements

[Hectic]

Actually, going by my own logic, sure.

VOTE: Elements

[Hectic]

The catchup begins now. I've read about spam being quite annoying but I would quite would like that top posting rank. It may or may not have something to do with a conditional ability of mine which goes into my Survivor role. Sorry for not claiming it earlier.

Hectic, join us
VOTE: roster

Still disagree.
Barbecuing a sleeping chicken is useful for seeing who is and isn't on the wagon.
Voting for an active player is useful for seeing who is and isn't on the wagon, AND how the wagonee interacts with everyone else.
I took a wiki course on wagonomics, so I know what I'm talking about.

[Hectic]

But if the choice is no wagon or roasting a slumbering chicken:

VOTE: rooster

[Hectic]

Continuation from last night

JJD - shouldn't be today's lynch imo

Hectic - I get a vibe from his iso that he is being active for actives sake. I'd say he perhaps lacked direction until this little roster wagon popped up so that's something to consider

Fish monger - thered be a tumble weed gif here if I was clever

Hopkirk is a little bit similar to hectic in his jovial entrance to the game but I get more of a sense that he is trying to convey opinions as the game progressed so I'm ok with that

Roster - come talk to me or the votes stays, y'arr!

Carcalilly - inquisitive enough to be town

Finish this tomorrow I think

I feel like some of this is a bit out of context as sometimes you only see 1 side of a conversation but whatever I'll reassess once I've done them all - not sure if I'm going to come out with a realistic number of slots of concern so we shall se

Ha, spoke too soon, didn't you?
I have expressed reads earlier, but you have to look closely for them.
It's like going treasure hunting to find some nuggets of gold in a field of garbage.
Hmm, can understand why that wouldn't be worthwhile actually.

Why'd you feel the need to Express a read on Fish Monger on particular? There are other relatively inactive players this game. What makes him different?

[Hectic]

Woah, what's going on here?

According to my memory of the wiki, wagons on people who probably aren't even reading the thread right now are utterly useless. Move your votes from roster to anyone else, people.
Either roster will get replaced or will make a return and we can judge/lynch him then if he continues to actively lurk.

the savior has returned to offer his wisdom!!

Ah yes. People often refer to me as Hec "the saviour" tic.
Could someone edit this into my wiki please?

[Hectic]

I am 1000

Just elevated you to a UTR for me (Ultra Townread).

[Hectic]

Even through I haven't be vocal in my interactions.


1.I have a town read on judge dread His answer to my query made me feel warm about him. Plus I don't think scum would react the way

2.Laid out a test for gamma i'll find out if his town or scum and I don't need to use any powers to do all it requires is a bit of faith in him it should become obvious latter on. I guess this can apply to Bob in some extent as well. But I forgot he was in the game tilll recently. Through last game and this game bob feels different his more how to do I put it aggressive which makes me feel like his town.

3.I found Hopkirks vote pretty scummy on me I was going to shift over but I thought I would feel them out more. I feel like a town hopkirk wouldn't of disengaged like he did when it wasn't working out so well. But it honestly surprised me he would jump off me. It feels like he was dipping his toys in the water to see if he could get a wagon off instead of actually hunting.

4.I town read Elements now I don't want to go into it because it involves set up speculation.

5. I'm not feeling the "You are great vote" anymore.


Interactionless read.

Well I like caralilly for town but I don't have interactions with them. I hope to change this maybe like day 2 I'm not really in a rush through since I town read them. She pushes the game so I think she vital to the game at the moment as well.

The Elements read is interesting here.
Has Elements talked about his role at all this game?

The read on Hopkirk is a wiki-approved play.

[Hectic]

162 posts??? What is wrong with you, Carcalilly?

Catchup momentarily paused.

[Hectic]

Hectic, we're trying to move onto a Cliff wagon given so many people don't want to vote roster

I see, I'll take your word for it O Great IC.

VOTE: Cliff

[Hectic]

Why'd you feel the need to Express a read on Fish Monger on particular? There are other relatively inactive players this game. What makes him different?

I am working my way through ISOs literally in playerlist order from post 1.

I wouldn't call what I put there 'a read' - I just wanted to make a joke about a player still have 0 posts at time of writing given we were about 30 odd pages in

Ah, I didn't realise they literally hadn't posted yet.

[Hectic]

Even through I haven't be vocal in my interactions.


1.I have a town read on judge dread His answer to my query made me feel warm about him. Plus I don't think scum would react the way

2.Laid out a test for gamma i'll find out if his town or scum and I don't need to use any powers to do all it requires is a bit of faith in him it should become obvious latter on. I guess this can apply to Bob in some extent as well. But I forgot he was in the game tilll recently. Through last game and this game bob feels different his more how to do I put it aggressive which makes me feel like his town.

3.I found Hopkirks vote pretty scummy on me I was going to shift over but I thought I would feel them out more. I feel like a town hopkirk wouldn't of disengaged like he did when it wasn't working out so well. But it honestly surprised me he would jump off me. It feels like he was dipping his toys in the water to see if he could get a wagon off instead of actually hunting.

4.I town read Elements now I don't want to go into it because it involves set up speculation.

5. I'm not feeling the "You are great vote" anymore.


Interactionless read.

Well I like caralilly for town but I don't have interactions with them. I hope to change this maybe like day 2 I'm not really in a rush through since I town read them. She pushes the game so I think she vital to the game at the moment as well.

The Elements read is interesting here.
Has Elements talked about his role at all this game?

The read on Hopkirk is a wiki-approved play.

To clarify on the last sentence here: I don't particularly agree with TR (the read), but it feels like an honest one from Garmr.

[Hectic]

Oh no, more to catchup on.

Before I start, I want to try something out from the wiki:

Intent to hammer.

I'll remove it if people think that was a bad play.

[Hectic]

Point 3 has convinced me you're town

It's my best point yet .

on a serious note

VOTE: Hopkirk

Suspicious placement of the emoji here. Like why put it before the full stop?
Disgusting.

[Hectic]

i like garmr's reasoning for fos'ing hopkirk, but i don't agree with it initially. i would like to hear more from hopkirk on why he decided to disengage from his vote on garmr.

i don't really get the vote on elements.

roster wagon feels lazy.

hey Tchill look buddy ol' man you're a great asset to this game but within the whole YAG vs Tchill thing I have to side with the latter.

Honestly your last couple of posts were good. I town binned him because I felt like he came into an inactive game and started trying to sort, but this puts that into question. Why don't you think it's enough to read him red?

Precisely why you town binned him. This is one interaction between another player that didn't sit good, but there's a lot of other interactions (that I haven't looked into fully

yet

, mind you) that are pretty good at plain level looking.
I might change my mind after digging deeper because I have yet to know what's actually there, but I have to finish my other thoughts before I loose them.

You know this might have a point, a scum in another game got pretty far doing what YAG has done at replace in

Did you mean YAG or tchill? Because I think that both myself and Lilly were talking about tchill here. I know I was.

YAG. Maybe it applies to TChill but why can't YAG be looked at that way too?

feels like you're trying to have it both ways without actually taking a stance between us

sucks that tchill has gone absent when i questioned him, much like he did a couple of days ago.

i usually try to play mafia by sorting every player at once, but this game is too big for my usual playstyle to work here. i'm just gonna try to play ~in the moment~, so to speak.

bit contracdictary at the start there Great. You don't like the reasoning for his FoS but you like him FoSing him? Do you have other reasons for suspecting Hopkirk?
Btw, what does FoS mean? Field of Suspects?

Also, why not try sorting smaller groups of people at a time then?

[Hectic]

VOTE: Garmr
Seems to be active but doesn't appear to be trying to scumhunt.

extra effort is not an obligation day 1.

If it was later, sure, but idk how I feel about this reasoning at this point in time.

Hmm, Garmr's sudden surge of scumhunting after Dave's post here is interesting.
Feel that's very slightly scum-indicative, but his reads seemed natural enough.

[Hectic]

I'm guessing that there's only so much we can talk about day 1, even though for a large game 32 pages isn't much.

I expected us to lynch someone soon but either scums playing real good or the lynchbait is laying low.

Wanna predict the nightkill? Do you think scum will be cautious of jjd's whatever-the-fuck-cop-claim? Or will they realize it's a joke? Or is it?

What are we going to achieve by trying to predict the nightkill? You do realise that there is most likely going to be more than one kill.

1. Who are you, where did you come from, why is this one of the first times I'm aware of your presence?

2. If town can work together-subtly-with the prs to prevent or predict a NK it will be favorable. Town can WIFOM scum with protective roles. Giving them a hard time is worth a minimal effort. Predicting can urge scum to rethink their decisions and possibly make ones less favorable to them. It prepares us for day two. Nobody was saying anything on the thread and I wanted something-anything-to talk about.

3. How the fuck is everyone so sure about a third faction or alternative killing role?

I don't know why this is the first time that your aware of my presence, maybe I never got involved with the whole RVS stage properly, or properly announce myself.

I have never played a game where we have tried to predict the nightkill so apologies on not seeing what kind of benefits it has. If I had actually participated in a game where I've seen it done and seen the affects it has, then I could have possibly had a different view on it, but since I've never been in a game where it has been done, I had a hard time seeing the negatives and positives it has.

And as for your third point, I thought I had seen someone quote a phrase that mentioned serial killer and I thought it was from the Mod. Reading back at the mods posts in this game, there was no mention of it so my bad for misreading into it, I don't know who quoted it so I can't check back on that either. However a game of this size, I'm going to presume that there will be a alternative killing role, possibly a vigilante, or another scum faction, or possibly a lone serial killer. Otherwise it's going to be quite a big mafia team if we're going to guess the ratio is 1 mafia to 4 town.

This could be a townslip since scum will definitely be talking about whether or not there's a serial killer in their PT.
So him being unsure whether the mod confirmed a serial killer is something something

[Hectic]

Goddamn it, I just missed my stop.

Catchup will resume shortly.
Let me know if people want me to stop btw, I've heard some can be cranky about spam.

[Hectic]

Let's go ISO by ISO and provide a short summary of each player because I'm bored and I feel like I haven't really analysed this game in any substantial way yet

I feel like some of these will be easier than others but what the hell...

1 Kop:
I'm surprised about his interest about my RVS vote, probs NAI though
Notable comment that he expects more than 1 NK
Naked vote on roster - note to self check later as this out of context when in ISO mode

2. Billy Pilgrim
Hehe liverpool fans on top of the player list - I'd lol if I was #3 (or jjd)
I get the carcass vote in context of first few pages
I also like that he retracts upon explanation
Note to self double check the supposed carca pm slip thing, assume negative due to no press but curious anyway...
Note to self - check why billy might like JJD

3.Cliff Booth
The main thing from this ISO is I wonder what I was close about Hopkirk with.. Cliff?

4. Rick Dalton
I have a way to read Rick which says town so far, wont be revealing my secrets here

5. Sharon Tate
Largely inactive. Did google the real sharon tate and read about her murder, you learn something new every day

6. Hectic
Miller claim, I'll make a call on this when some conflicting wagons and stuff make hectic pick a side. For now its irrelevenant
Interesting that he says I have picked guessed his alignment previously...

Eevee
My gut feeling is we do not see things in a similar way, is that AI? Unsure so far

Gamma
I dunno, always struggle to read gamma:(


Tired now. More later

I was wanting to clarify that game you were on about, I didn't have any recall to it at the time I asked the question. Curiosity killed the cat, I guess.

@profii: What'd you think of me now after I heroically came to rooster's aid earlier?
Basically, after I picked sides.

[Hectic]

Even through I haven't be vocal in my interactions.


1.I have a town read on judge dread His answer to my query made me feel warm about him.

2.Laid out a test for gamma i'll find out if his town or scum and I don't need to use any powers to do all it requires is a bit of faith in him.

3.

Wait, doesn't your tracker crumb test fall apart by mentioning point 2?
If he's scum and spotted the breadcrumb, isn't this gonna tip him off that it was a test?

[Hectic]

Page 42 was pretty entertaining.
Fine scumhunting from that Hipkork guy (Sorry if I got your name wrong, I'm really bad at remembering these).

On hold again.

[Hectic]

Sup guys

Woah, is that really AaronFrost???
Been wanting to play a game with you for quite a while, sir.
The wiki tells of the most legendary of stories regarding you.

For example:
"This one time, it was just AaronFrost and 3 mafia left. He was just a vanilla townie, but by using his AaronFrost haggling skills, he recieved 2 dayvig shots from the mod. He shot the first 2 scum, and then bluffed the third into conceding. Masterful play."

[Hectic]

No promises, but I will complete the rest of my catch up today for 60% sure certainty.

[Hectic]

Woah, did I say I'd catch up today?
Afraid I'll have to cash in on that 40% uncertainty from earlier.
I will 100% catchup in the new day with 80% certainty.

Brief reply to Profii:
-Was against a wagon on rooster for reasons I've explained, but eventually voted since a wagon of some kind is better than no wagon.
-Vote on Dave was because I thought his pushing for a rooster wagon was either lazy town or opportunistic scum. Not so sure about that now though.
-Vote on Cliff was simply for the wagon. Thinking of my read on him right now, barely anything comes to mind. I recall some stuff that might have been him hiding behind his gimmick? That's the only thing I can remember.

[Hectic]

Actually, I reckon I'll pull an all-nighter to reread the wiki.

I'll have a ganesolve for you fine people once I'm done with that.

[Hectic]

Currently on the run from some VERY angry mobsters.
Don't worry, I'll handle it, but give me half a tenday.

@mod: V/LA 17th to 21st.

[Hectic]

So I read a pretty good strategy on the wiki where you convieniently "forget" when D2 of a game starts. Therefore, allowing you to lurk for half the day and not have to deal with pesky

people.

Unfortunately, I recently discovered this strategy was one targeted at scum, not town (which is what I am - town, not scum, just in case you were wondering). And since I am

town

, and definitely not

scum

(scum are the mafia btw, town are the good guys), I have realised that I should come back and start contributing again.

So give me the rest of today to brush up on my knowledge again, and I will return with a game solve, courtesy of the wiki tomorrow.

Good luck, fellow townies (unless you're scum, then bad luck, because I am town and don't want you to win, because I am on opposite teams as you. (To clarify, I'm talking to the scum here.))

-Hectic

[Hectic]

We should solve the game together sometime. I'm sure we're thinking along the same lines here.
Anyone mind if we start just posting from our hydra account and not signing the posts?

-Hop

I don't mind.

-Tex

We should solve the game together sometime. I'm sure we're thinking along the same lines here.
Anyone mind if we start just posting from our hydra account and not signing the posts?

-Hop

I don't mind either.

-Cat

Who's this? You new? I like you.

We should solve the game together sometime. I'm sure we're thinking along the same lines here.
Anyone mind if we start just posting from our hydra account and not signing the posts?

-Hop

Let's do it, Hop. Honestly though, I kinda dislike that Kirk guy, is it alright if we lynch him today?
Alternatively, you could nightkill him, that would work as well.
Also, do you mind if Citceh joins us?

[Hectic]

Welcome back Hectic. I'm glad to see you've branched out into other wikis. Perhaps I can interest you in another one?

https://wikis.fandom.com/wiki/The_Wiki_Wiki

-Hop

This is a treasure-trove. Thank you greatly, I am forever in your debt.
During my browsing of this wiki, I learned that searching for "crime" in the search bar lands a sole result of the Sweden wiki page. Proof.
This is undeniable evidence. Is anyone Swedish here?

[Hectic]

VOTE: Tchill

Unlucky.

[Hectic]

Because he's been actively lurking and posting non-content from what I can remember of my encyclopedia of D1 notes.

[Hectic]

Oh, wow. I've integrated myself so well into the town that I'm using Survivor and Town interchangeably now.

We are ALL survivors on this blessed day.

[Hectic]

The wiki and I have returned to solve this game.
Hey, Carcalilly, did you know that there are OTHER wikis outside of the mafiascum one? I know, right?!

So am now currently trying to read every single wiki I can find before I really dig my molars into this game.
Do you have any good recommendations?

[Hectic]

Don't worry, friends. I will help you find the rails once more.

I believe the most recent topic of discussion was Eevee asking the following question:

Hold it. Why does tchill have 5 exactly?

At first, I thought she was asking why Tchill had

exactly

5 votes. But under closer inspection, I quickly realised that what she was actually asking was very different.
Her true question was: Why does tchill have 5, exactly?

Notice my sly addition of the comma? You can thank wikipedia for teaching me how to use those.
She's not asking why Tchill has that exact number of votes on him, but why he has a large number on him at all.
I've been absent for a while, but I tried to answer this question as best as I could in a previous post. I fear my explanation was lacking though.

Aaron, I know you're a man a guy can rely on when times are tough.
Could

you

explain to Eevee and perhaps even me why Tchill has 6 votes on him?
Thanks Aaron, you're the best.

[Hectic]

The wiki and I have returned to solve this game.
Hey, Carcalilly, did you know that there are OTHER wikis outside of the mafiascum one? I know, right?!

So am now currently trying to read every single wiki I can find before I really dig my molars into this game.
Do you have any good recommendations?

Boom beach wiki might help

Thanks, am archiving it into my mind palace now.

I.. ummm..

May I suggest reading the game thread?

Plan to catchup tomorrow, do not fear. This the best I can do for today.

[Hectic]

Oh.

I'll take my leave then.

[Hectic]

Apologies. Busy until Friday, but I will catchup then for 100% sure.
In the meantime, I'll read up on the history of the Mongolian and Byazantine Empires. This will make sense later.

[Hectic]

So seems like I've missed a couple of pages of stuff. Will start catching up now.

Did you know that the majority of Mongol armies did not consist of ethnic Mongolians? This is due to the voluntary surrender of many cities and states, resulting in the incorporation of many soldiers and tribesmen as federates in the Khan's ranks.

[Hectic]

I might be slightly confused.
Read through Garmr's ISO can't actually see where/what he claimed.
Is he claiming a normal watcher?

Those who showed resistance to the Mongol Horde would be methodically massacred, with only persons of invaluable skills or crafts being shown the mercy of enslavement.

[Hectic]

Enquiry to Tchill:

What was your read on YAG/Texcat end of day 1?
Why not track your scumreads?

Should counterclaim this if you're a tracker. Very unlikely there's a watcher and 2 trackers in game.
Never mind, this is a Large game and duplicates are possible, disregard that. (I've read that it's good to leave stuff like this in your posts, as town are more likely to change their mind, so you can get some insight into my towny thought process and really stamp me in as a Survivor.)

Thanks, Garmr.

[Hectic]

pff that can't be true

because I'm a voyeur

neighbour 5 shot doctor fruit eating porn star.

4.I town read Elements now

I don't want to go into it because it involves set up speculation

.

Also I was originally going to test gamma with the power role drop because voyeur is a type of watching role. But I realised bob was in the game and that could fuck up the results. So I told Gamma about what I was trying to do to test him because scum would probably think I'm a Vt if I did making use of my initial plan in a different way. 4d chess

Here some for quick reference hectic.

So did you actually townread Elements since you're a voyeur or was that just a crumb?
Isn't it a certainty that there's gonna be some other investigative in the game?

WikiWikiWeb is the world's oldest wiki. At the respectable age of 24, it boasts gallons of discussion regarding software design patterns. Highly recommended.

[Hectic]

Why have 5 PRs claimed by day 2?
I may reading the wrong wiki, but that doesn't seem like optimal play. Why did you claim, Garmr?
What do you mean by you were paranoid he was a ninja?
Why does you being a voyeur make Elements' claim any more believable to you? Every Large game is gonna have investigatives, so your voyeur shouldn't change your perception on whether Elements was fakeclaiming or not.

Tchill's done this thing again where's he said something along the lines of "give me a bit/second" and then come back with a PR claim. Did this in a previous game with me where he was scum. Though, overall, he feels different enough this game, he effort posted a lot more in that game, especially towards the end. He hasn't done much here.

[Hectic]

Don't think you're understanding my question. Every game with 20+ players is going to have investigatives like a watcher/tracker/cop.
So you being a voyeur isn't useful for knowing there are investigatives in this game, since that's a given anyway.
So why was the fact you're a voyeur make Elements' claim more believable?

3D Monster Maze was the first 3D game ever made. To this day, the graphics and gameplay still hold up to the likes of Pacman, and is a cult classic among millions of people to this day.

[Hectic]

Don't really get what you mean about the Ninja part honestly. You were afraid you wouldn't be able to see him investigate people because he was a ninja? So your role would be useless for verifying him? What gave you that impression?

Don't get me wrong, you're a great guy, Garmr, but I'm struggling to understand your thought process here.

[Hectic]

Oh no.

I probably die tonight unless scum are dumb. Either Eevee or Titus dies too.

Lynch: Cliff/JJD/Titus/Eevee.
Look at closely (Kop/Profii/Bob).
Consider if scum or pocketed after the JJD scumflip: Dave.

Lead the way, wiki admin. I'll llama you until I get a good grasp of this game.
VOTE: Cliff

What hapenned to the Tchill wagon?

[Hectic]

What's the reason for claimed watcher/voyeurs to not reveal results?

[Hectic]

If anyone ever has a problem with hectic later then think about how they don't have one right now. Last chance for scumreads there.

That's very kind of you, Hop.
I have a confession to make: I had an accident recently.
Life came along and suckerpunched me, before choke slamming me through a steel chair.
As a result, I am still recovering from the decrease of time I have available.
However, I always aspire to reach above and beyond what I should be capable of.
Therefore, I will be making a GRAND return to the game TONIGHT. Please remain excited and eagerly anticipate my return.

@Hopkirk, Aaron, Carca:
I trust the three of you more than anyone else in the world. I really don't know what I'd do without you, and I would love to hear one (or all) of you briefly summarise what's hapenned the last couple of game-days.
I feel this would give me a better understanding for when I do start catching up, and would allow me to fill in the blanks with incredible efficiency and precision.

Love you,
Hectic

[Hectic]

@hectic who was in that game- can you confirm Prometheus/samthony happened like I described there.

I can confirm this. Don't know how he'd feel about you calling him "Sam Thony" though.

[Hectic]

Billy's never scum by any means. Not ever.

The quote you mangled was an if/then.

Billy claimed to have received fruit -- if there isn't another FV then what does that mean? Normals can't have redirection, in case anyone has forgotten that.

dave, look at me, pal.. look at me.. look at my lips.. I'll spell it to you real slow.. are you ready?

C-L-I-F-F
I-S
A
S-I-M-P-L-E
D-I-S-L-O-Y-A-L
F-R-U-I-T
V-E-N-D-O-R
J-U-S-T
L-I-K-E
M-E
O-N-L-Y
H-E
I-S
S-C-U-M

Got it?? Could you write that down, please so you won't forget it?

OK.. so I was theoretically assigned to find the Goon (the Vanilla Scum). Cliff is my counterpart so is supposed to singe out the Vanilla TOWNIE in this game.

He is NOT Loyal, and he certainly is NOT Complex (nor is he without a second modifier).

Forget about the Scum having a Tracker/Watcher for a minute (I mean, they DO, but that has nothing to do with this situation between me and Cliff. I see that now)

Billy did receive fruit, and it was from Cliff, who is SCUM and is DISLOYAL and SIMPLE.

Remember when we all thought Cliff was crumbing Neapolitan?? His role IS Neapolitan, only by another name.

Fruit Vendors are merely "Loud Visitors" in essence. HOWEVER, you add Simple/Complex/Loyal/Disloyal and you turn them into COPS. The exact type of Cop depends on what modifiers you give them. Simple Loyal/Disloyal is Nea for Town/Scum, respectively. Simple Disloyal is a Goon Cop in the hands of Town, and still Nea in the hands of Scum because they already know their own team so will on,y check Town.

Yadda yadda yadda. Capisce?

Woah. Since when were you in this game?

[Hectic]

@Profii - what the fuck are you waiting on here? I cant see any scum motivation in what you're doing, but its sure as hell weird.

I'm not hammering until we know why cliff didnt pursue a guilty yesterday?

I will respect this, and will delay my self-hammer for .. what? 6 more hours??


Naaaah. As much as I hate to disappoint profii here, a promise is a promise, and when even guys like dave side by scum the town deserves to be punished for it's stupidity.

VOTE: JJD

P.S. Lynch texcat too. She can't get to LyLo. And if I had multiple Vig shots I would have shot every single one who voted me.

That's two self-hammers in 3 days. The wiki says self-hammering is never a good idea as town, but hey, we can't always play optimally in the face of emotions, so all is forgiven.
So Cliff dies tomorrow because he can't coexist with town!JJD's role?

[Hectic]

@hectic - that's an alt slip from JJD.

I dont like that both Cliff and JJD are both calling me conf town.

Oh, right.

[Hectic]

Hectic's "big return" to the game tonight, hopkirks willingness to accept me as town all of the sudden.
These are very fucking weird things to be cut short by a self hammer. ESPECIALLY if this flips red like I am 99.9% sure it will

What are you suggesting?
My scumteam and I cut the day short so I didn't have to come in fabricate some divine wisdom?
Or that the day was cut short before I could storm in and solve the game with my wiki prowess?

Either way, I like the credit you're giving me.

[Hectic]

I'm seriously getting to a point where I'm going to start blacklisting people who self-hammer as town, because it happens way to fucking often. So if by some miracle JJD isn't scum I'm gonna be pissed.

But yeah I can't see him flipping town here. Self-hammering this early in the day when he knows he's not escaping a lynch is 100% a scum move.

Lul, tell me about it. Though I've accepted it's just part of the game since emotions are a big part of mafia.
You think it's 100% a scum move despite experiencing first hand many town self-hammers in your time? The one in the Normal was 10 days short btw.
The oxford dictionary wiki labels this as contradictory.
That's kind of odd, Aaron, my friend.

[Hectic]

what is it with people self hammering. Your not dead until your lynched and if you know your town how is lynching you self playign to your win condition.


Was still pleanty of debate to be had. Any one hammerign woudl ahve been tehre scum claim

Classic case of Typo-Fibrodysplasia ossificans progressiva here.
Check the NHS wiki if you don't believe me.

The ridiculous amount of typos and errors here make this passion fueled post very towny.
Good job, Bob.

[Hectic]

I like Bob's thoughts on page 153.
The double scum theory is interesting, since they were both suspects coming into this day, right?
Don't find it likely, but soemthing we shouldn't rule it.

[Hectic]

I see what you mean, Aaron.
I like your post if JJD flips town. Neutral if he flips scum.

[Hectic]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention.
My Suvrivor wincon turns into a Jester wincon at twilight. At least that's how I think the role works if I'm reading it correctly.
The dole's not actually found on the wiki, so I'll ask LUV some more questions about it.
So if you guys wagon me real quick, that'd be real cool of you all. We'll probably have a few days to do it.

[Hectic]

I still don't understand why alonzo claimed to be a doctor at twilight.

Was this during day 2 twilight?
What was the reason he gave?

[Hectic]

oh ok! we still found like, one scum guys. we'll be fine

I've read about this role called "Lyncher" on the mafia universe wiki. A possibility to be sure, but a welcome one.

[Hectic]

Looks like Almost is flipping green, so Cliff definitely dies tomorrow.
Not buying it if he goes back on saying he didn't receive fruit.

[Hectic]

Haven't recieved any fruit this game.

VOTE: Cliff

What do you think of your assessment on JJD now, Aaron?
Bob needs to slow down on the obvtowning.

[Hectic]

Check your wikis, guys. Already said I haven't recieved fruit this game.

Addressed to Hopkirk:

Elaborate on your town/metaread on Aaron Fucking Frost of all people
I get he's a great guy, but he's actually been pinging me recently, there's definitely a change in tone from my other two town games with him.
He's a lot more assertive/aggressive here.

[Hectic]

Davesaz and Carcalilly are mod-confirmed to be town.
Profii is town because he was Gobble's neighbor.
Billy is town because he claimed VT early on and I believed him.

If Cliff flips town, we then can confirm both Billy and Bob.

Rick has claimed doctor, but he's an actor so I don't put much stock in it.

I don't get the Profii or Billy townreads there. Wiki states that neghbours can still be scum, they're not masons, which is an entirely different role.
Why is Billy claiming VT early town-indicative?

[Hectic]

Check your wikis, guys. Already said I haven't recieved fruit this game.

Addressed to Hopkirk:

Elaborate on your town/metaread on Aaron Fucking Frost of all people
I get he's a great guy, but he's actually been pinging me recently, there's definitely a change in tone from my other two town games with him.
He's a lot more assertive/aggressive here.

Why the fuck am I obvtown?

But yeah I am being a bit more aggressive here. I've been trying to play a bit more aggressively as town lately since too often I see town players not do anything and allow scum an easy victory. Look at my most recent Newbie (1959) for a good example of this.

PEDIT: So you're not scumreading anyone else?

Interesting.
I had noticed the drastic change in your profile picture. I'll be honest: I was a little taken aback at first. I was thinking; is this the same AaronFrost I've known and loved for years?
Has age and self-hammers mellowed him into an entirely different player? Time will tell.
I'll have a look at the newbie game later.

That said, I still want to hear Hopkirk's reason for his town/metaread on you.

[Hectic]

Is hectic confirmed too?

Are you confirmed?

[Hectic]

And yeah, I can confirm myself as town if you're wondering.
I'm no fool; I've read the wiki page on Lynch All Liars, so there's no way I'm lying this game.
If I was scum, I would've claimed it from the start to avoid a horrible liar's death. But instead, I've been truthful from the start about my Survivor Miller claim.

[Hectic]

Okay. So that leaves. Titus(town cause dave is town)
Aaron(who is being helpful)
And kop(who im still convinced isnt a real person)

Remind me what this is for?

[Hectic]

Davesaz and Carcalilly are mod-confirmed to be town.
Profii is town because he was Gobble's neighbor.
Billy is town because he claimed VT early on and I believed him.

If Cliff flips town, we then can confirm both Billy and Bob.

Rick has claimed doctor, but he's an actor so I don't put much stock in it.

I don't get the Profii or Billy townreads there. Wiki states that neghbours can still be scum, they're not masons, which is an entirely different role.
Why is Billy claiming VT early town-indicative?

Both of these required some contextual analysis. Profii claimed neighbors with rooster/gobble who flipped traitor. It wouldnt make sense for Profii to be scum here, because it would have defeated the purpose of the traitor role. Something left out of this was that Profii claimed backup tracker and now we had tchill's flip. So while his backup role and his neighbor association dont require him to be town, they both heavily suggest it.

As for me, I claimed VT as a way to verify someone that seemed to be softing neapolitan. It was in the context of Cliff saying he thought his role may have negative utility and not sure if there was a VT. JJD was the one that proposed the idea of a single.VT claiming. I volunteered. You can make of that what you will, but I think the context is relevant both with Profii and with my claim.

Thanks for explaining.
Makes Profii likely town. I'd say your claim is NAI though, could just be a goon claiming VT.

[Hectic]

Ah, was confusing Vanilla Cop with Neopolitan. So many roles I've memorised from the wiki that I sometimes get confused in my own mind palace.
Makes your claim slightly town-indicative in that case.

[Hectic]

Ah, was confusing Vanilla Cop with Neopolitan. So many roles I've memorised from the wiki that I sometimes get confused in my own mind palace.
Makes your claim slightly town-indicative in that case.

Only slightly town indicitave? There is zero reason to claim vt in that situation when we thought there was a nea.

Hectic I can never get a good read on you.

Well, scum!Billy could claim it banking on the fact that you'll make that argument, he gets an easy townread, and the neo won't check him as a result because there's no point and they can check someone else instead.

Good to hear you're the same old AaronFrost, so I edited your wiki page for you, hope you don't mind.

If anyone wants to request a wiki edit, don't be afraid to ask for one, I'm quite accustomed around these wikis now.

[Hectic]

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=80577&user_select[]=33131
viewtopic.php?f=50&t=80540&start=925
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=80753&user_select[]=33131

I'm going to go with a nice townread on Aaron actually.

1950- scumgame finishing the same time this started. Aaron doesn't really give a read on anyone for 200 posts. Barely townreads anyone, scumreads aren't particulrly justified.
1949- Catch up is very similar to this game. Gives a lot of reads early on. Changes reads (two townreads for most of the game flip to scumreads)
1954- frequent reads

This game- catch up mirrors thought process in 1949. Mind changes frequently enough (excuse the formatting). Not afraid to give reads. The previous scumtopic (1950) that ended when this started makes me think Aaron wouldn't go into this as confidently as he did with the reads list. Some of the Ate earlier sounds legitimate.

This is where I changed my mind on Aaron @Hectic. How different to you think he feels to what you've played with? I obviously wasn't in these games so it's kind of second hand. I'll probably reread the slot sometime soon.

I see what you mean, I'd accidentally deleted that Aaron!scumgame from my personal wiki. Was just making sure you actually had good reasons to back it up.
Hop is still town, I buy Aaron's reasoning for being more aggressive for now, so he also stays in the town wiki for now.

@Hop: Why is Aaron the top reread priority? Doubting your read on him now?

[Hectic]

Aaron FF also shaded me for it I think.

I like that abbreviation.

[Hectic]

Aaron 'waits until Hectic says he doesn't townread Aaron to decide to not townread Hectic' Frost.

I gave him so many opportunities to say anything negative about Hectic when I made a dozen posts about Hectic being close enough to confirmed town.
I said anyone who wants to say anything bad about Hectic should say it then or should read him as town.
Aaron's problems with Hectic are clearly something that he had a problem with back when I said this.
I want to know why he didn't raise his problems with reading Hectic then.

Lul, interesting.
I'll hold my peace on this until he responds.

[Hectic]

Searching for where he mentions you is very complicated.
Stop giving people sig quotes.

How no one has taken any of your sig quotes yet is beyond me honestly.

[Hectic]

Getting really impatient for an answer. As in I want to just out what actually happened. I dont want to self hammer. In fact I would really rather not even be at L-2 right now. Scum are the only ones that know I'm telling the truth about being town and I think the cat is trying to get rid of me before I can hurt their team.

No one put this man on L-1 please.

The wiki states:
"In any case in which another lynch is still possible, it is almost always anti-town to self-hammer. However, if the day's deadline is imminent, a No Lynch would be statistically worse for town, and no other options are available, it can be appropriate for the player to self-hammer, providing the town with some information from that day, and preventing their likely lynch on future days."

Unlucky, town!Cliff, you'd be breaking the wikilaw if you self-hammered.

Are you waiting for

[Hectic]

Disregard the last line there. I sometimes get these weird hallucinations where seconds can feel like hours, and as I started typing that last line out, it honestly felt like each key press was taking

minutes.

As if my mind was processing everything 20 times faster than how quickly my body was moving. I think I may have hit 200wpm while typing that sentence simply because of how efficient and thoughtless my hand movements were.
At the end though, I gave up and just pressed submit, wasn't even worth hitting backspace to delete the line, as that would've taken another 10 minutes to do.
And what do you know? As soon as I hit submit, my mind returns to a normal state and my perception of time is normal again.
Typical.

[Hectic]

I think Texcat's kinda formal posting style is part of the reason that makes it easy to scumread her, can kinda sympathise with that.
What other reasons is she scum other than Cliff-interactions?

[Hectic]

Give us the big reveal, Cliff.

[Hectic]

So tomorrow, assuming the kill doesn't get blocked we'd be at 13 people. What's a standard amount of scum for a game this big? I'm pretty confident that we're not in multi ball, and theres probably not a vig. I think the odds on exactly one of them getting blocked each night is just a bit weird.

more than likely 6. though since a traitor flipped it could have been 7.

so rn we are probably at 6 or 5.

6 or 7 scum seems like way too many for 21 players.
The wiki states that the formula for a balanced game is number of town = 3(number of scum)+1

So 5 fits perfectly in this case.

Also, I'm a Survivor, so take that into account for balance, since my role could technically be anti-town if in the hands of some fiend.

[Hectic]

I'm a simple loyal fruit vendor. I sent fruit to jjd on n1, billy n2, and bob n3.

So you lied about being Simple?
Why?

[Hectic]

I mean regardless, Cliff still dies for lying about receiving fruit from JJD.
I for one have read the wiki page on Lynch all Liars.
Going back and examining the people on the Cliff/JJD wagons should be very useful after Cliff flips.

[Hectic]

Hectic, under your formula 3(5)+1=16. 6 would fit better 3(6)+1=19.

I'm curious because I'm wondering if we can give Cliff another night to confirm another VT. But if theres 6 scum, then tomorrow is LYLO and Cliff cant make LYLO.

There's 21 players this game.
So 5 scum and 16 town fit the formula is what I mean.
But davesaz is right, traitor means it's probably 6 scum, so 5 alive right now.

[Hectic]

All this reluctance to lynch Cliff is making me more confident on his death. We can't guarantee we have a vig and that scum doesn't have a doctor.
Cliff still gets banished to the abyssal wiki today.

[Hectic]

Came across a nice term on the HowStuffWorks wiki today: Occam's Razor.

Is it more likely that this is Cliff's "biggest fuckup to date", or is he just scum?

[Hectic]

What do you think, Eevee?

[Hectic]

Guess I reconsidered, Eevee. But I think it's the lower end (6 total).

[Hectic]

@Cliff: I'm seeing something that makes me think this is plausible. Did you soft anywhere else?

@Hectic: how are you reading Titus?

Did Titus pull a Kop and stop existing? I can't remember the last I made a note about them in my wiki.

I'll go back and check.

[Hectic]

I flicked through many random pages and couldn't find any posts so that I could click the ISO thing.
Someone help me out please.

[Hectic]

That's amazing. I am forever in your debt, Texcat.

Titus' stance on profii is really odd. Like I get considering the possibility that he could be scum with a traitor in a neighbourhood, but thinking it's likely the case is dubious to say the least.

@Titus: Why'd you vote for Garmr late on yesterday? Earlier, you said he does crazy stuff as town and that you'd very surprised if he flipped scum.

[Hectic]

I haven't caught up but I really don't like this lynch Titus talk. Seems like a cheap cop out. We know my utility picks up once we lynch scum.

Perfect way to discredit me after Cliff flips scum.

Would appreciate if you answered my question when you return.

[Hectic]

That's a really odd reason, Cliff...

[Hectic]

That's a really odd reason, Cliff...

you're scum hush

No u

[Hectic]

Thanks, Hop.

I like them so much, I had to edit them into my wiki page of sig quotes.

[Hectic]

May the wiki-gods smile down upon you, Titus.

Time to end this day.

Re

VOTE: Cliff

@LUV: Shouldn't Kop be replaced based on the number of times he's entered prod range this game?

[Hectic]

May the wiki-gods smile down upon you, Titus.

Time to end this day.

Re

VOTE: Cliff

@LUV: Shouldn't Kop be replaced based on the number of times he's entered prod range this game?

Why do you want to lynch him before we've heard from Kop?
We lost Tchill's tracker result due to an early hammer/wait for a replacement.

Kop absolutely should have been replaced already.

No guarantee Kop will exist today.

[Hectic]

I'm actually getting second thoughts about Cliff now, but he has to get the chair at this point.

[Hectic]

Lot of his recent posts feel like a townie which has nothing to lose.
But at the same time, I'd never be able to properly trust him if we kept him alive because of his lying this game.

[Hectic]

Still gets the injection.

[Hectic]

Why claim there, Hop?
Isn't claiming today strictly worse than tomorrow since you're in no danger of being lynched today, and now there's no chance scum will kill you?

[Hectic]

Thought I guess you were at very little chance anyway.

[Hectic]

No one.

[Hectic]

Oh didnt even notice pagetop

On a related note, could I interest you on this wiki article on unusual deaths?

They range from 620BC where Draco, an Athenian lawmaker, was reportedly smothered to death by gifts of cloaks and hats showered upon him by appreciative citizens at a theatre on Aegina.

All the way to this year, where Elena "Lena" Struthers-Gardner, 60, was carrying a mason-jar style drinking glass with a screw-top lid in her kitchen when she collapsed. The 10-inch stainless steel straw entered her left eye socket and pierced her brain.

[Hectic]

Why'd your grandfather hate the masons so much?

Let's start with Cliff first; how would you like to be killed, Cliff? Make it something strange so we can add you to the list.

[Hectic]

Though I guess you were at very little chance anyway.

Was your

exactly

referring to this?

[Hectic]

By the way, can someone remind me of the second confirmed town that isn't Carcalilly?

[Hectic]

we have dave who is mod confirmed

Why is he mod confirmed again?

[Hectic]

Let's add Profii to the list and edit them out if they recover.

Eh what list

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unusual_deaths

[Hectic]

I was reading up on Combating Apathy and I've learnt a lot of useful tips for modding.

@LUV:

If you need someone to help comod, let me know and I can help out with votecounts and night actions. I'll forget everything once the next day starts, so don't worry, I won't do any meta-gaming.

@Bob: Last one: What turned Dave into an IC?

[Hectic]

Apologies for this, that was the period where I was basically prodging.

[Hectic]

Huh, so I guess that's how you LAMIST yourself into locktown.
Hop, by the end of your story, tears were streaming down my face, and I think my perception of masons has been forever changed. Your grandfather was a great man.
Sorry, Carcalilly, will have to use my Survivor Shotgun on you tonight.

[Hectic]

@LUV:

If you're replacing Kop, don't you need to post you're looking for a replacement in the replacement queue?

[Hectic]

is anyone ever going to question the survivor miller claim? no? alright

Why would they? I promised to work with town.

[Hectic]

One of the reasons I'm getting second thoughts on Cliff is because of all his shading on me/Hop (Hop's my second strongest townread excluding the confirms). Scum!him knows he's probably going to be lynched but is randomly pushing a townie and a survivor? Don't really get it.

A lot of his actions don't really make sense regardless of alignment tbh.

[Hectic]

To clarify: I mean a townie and survivor that are very unlikely to be lynched today, as opposed to more realistic mislynches.

[Hectic]

But don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to open the gateway for a non-Cliff-lynch here. In fact, I'm going to park a bus in front of the gate and then fill it with bus drivers.
He's still the lynch today just because of the confirms we get if he actually is town.

[Hectic]

So I'm not getting lynched today anymore right

VOTE: texcat

This gives Texcat townie points if Cliff flips scum. Would be a way too obvious attempt at bussing, more likely he's trying to make it look like that.

[Hectic]

Wow no one cared about my claim :<

Oh, are we actually mass claiming then?
Don't really understand why right now.

[Hectic]

Too many people have claimed to not mass claim now.
Suspicious people go first.

[Hectic]

I've got an insane role lined up to claim. Took me a solid few months of extensive wiki readings, and a few PhDs on surrounding topics for me to fully understand my role.
YIITOTVVBLMFCADHATIAZOTGTOA

[Hectic]

I'd like to see a full claim from Rick. Also Titus.

Texcat too.

[Hectic]

Maybe we should hold off on any more claims untill tomorrow.
The only advantage of having people claim now is that it gives mafia less time to think of their claims. I think that's outweighed by the disadvantage of letting mafia prioritise nightkills better though.

[Hectic]

Hey hopkirk wanna share your results before I call bullshit on your cop claim?

Huh?

[Hectic]

Did Kop claim any kind of role this game?

[Hectic]

Don't put him out of his misery just yet.
Kop could get replaced by the end of today.
Maybe.

[Hectic]

I'm eth0s

What in the world.

[Hectic]

Just someone we'e talked about before, especially during that Government newbie game when Doctor Watson was "testing" you.