newbie 2080: correct statements (this is over)

[Facebones]

Sorry for my absence, I was either sleeping or working. On my lunch break now, but before I go back some food for thought: not reading a players post due to apathy seems worse than not reading it due to laziness. Galron, is it just Cook's posts you're apathetic towards? Why?

[Facebones]

I'm not apathetic toward Cook's posts. I just don't feel like reading them. I guess maybe that is apathy; I don't know. Everyone else's posts are much shorter. That's got something to do with it. Cook could be open-wolfing (I have a personal bias against that term btw), but I don't know.

It seems that if anyone is wolfing (there's that term again) it up again,

I

, and everyone else, would be alerted to it. In a succinct manner ofc.

Unless that person is Cook, because how can you be alert to an open wolf if you don't feel like reading their lengthy posts? Start being more motivated, goddamn it.

hey, Facebones, you reckon DArby’s whiteknighting me a wee bit?

I mean, I guess there's a chance. I have accused people of whiteknighting in the past and been rather embarrassed about the whole ordeal afterwards though. Due to that, and because it's still early stages, I'm gonna put it down to being NAI

[Facebones]

How come you're anxious to hear about what Thynhith makes of my entrance? Like, why him specifically?

[Facebones]

facebones what are your thoughts on spangled

Jury's still out on that one. I'm a little suspicious of 123 and 142, could it be an attempt at buddying?
I don't feel like my three posts should put me at the top of anyones townpile.

On the other hand I feel he was sincere about his initial apprehension and questioning of your plan, trying to get a firmer grasp on it to see if it would indeed be beneficial for town. When reading through, I noticed the questions he was asking were similar to questions I myself was thinking

[Facebones]

I want to hear what Thynhith thinks of you so I can better, or at all, read them.

Guessing his answer didn't do much for your read? If it did, please enlighten me.

I thought it was funny how he looked like he didn’t want the strategy to be done, because it helped him when he was scum, but then kinda said, ‘I understand your hesitance, but it's something we kinda have to decide on sooner rather than later if it's going to work’, which read like he was supporting it to me. But other than that he hasn’t said much or done much; maybe some slight townpoints for pointing out to us the games where your strategy was implemented (or not) and for saying that no one should VT-claim, but that’s inside anyone’s scumrange

He’s in the null-basket, but what can you expect for 6 posts, I guess

Roden's first 6 posts were arguably more useful for town than my first 3, and he's a null whereas I'm top of the list. It just doesn't sit right with me, I dunno.

But yes, Cook's idea; I'm not that keen on it. I feel like a lot of things would need to go right after we out one or both town PR's and it's needlessly giving scum information. Without any further ado, so far we have

FOR: Cook, Spangled

AGAINST: Roden, MargotRosa, DArby, Thynhith, Facebones

COULDN'T GIVE A SHIT: Galron, Mewtaph

[Facebones]

Do people think one or both scum were against Cook's plan?

[Facebones]

Do people think one or both scum were against Cook's plan?

So you have Cook as town?

I do not. I'm suspicious of both, and think one of them has to be mafia
The game Roden pointed out where Cook did pre much the exact same thing i.e. tracker claiming is always on my mind
I think there might be a couple of slight differences? Some things Spangled has said seem disingenuous to me and I'm not discounting the possibility of him being scum wanting to out a town PR

Both being scum seems way too easy

[Facebones]

It'd be a surprise if both scum were against the plan or apathetic towards it

[Facebones]

Correct. I am suggesting it's possible Spangled is able to hold such a strong, and in my opinion unjustified, townread on Facebones because he actually knows for a fact FB is town because he ain't in the scumthread with him.

Haha, right?
It is quite unjustified, that's what I thought

[Facebones]

After articulating my issues, I'm now a little bit more confident in seeing a red flip with respect to Spangled than I am Cook, although it is close, and I do think

it's possible that's just the scumpair

, gg.

Though Val, what makes you so confident you've already caught the scum pair?

What makes you think Val is "so confident" he's got the scum pair? I'm confused

[Facebones]

I wouldn't be altogether SHOCKED if this did turn out to be a game we look back on in a few days and think "Wow, hero solved by page 11".

The ego on this man!

[Facebones]

The change I was thinking of was https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p12928671

VOTE: No elimination.

vs the one in this game

never no eliminate d1.

[Facebones]

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.p ... #p12936258

If we no-eliminate, that will likely put us at 2 scum 6 town and we can get a confirm townie tomorrow.

This one as well as scum trying to convince people no elim D1 is a good strategy

She's changed her tune a little bit
Granted she might've just pushed the no elim back to D2 instead of D1

[Facebones]

I didn't read the scum thread. Whether it's down to laziness or apathy is up to you.
You asked for slight differences, and I mentioned one about Cook advocating for no elim on D1 as scum.
You were rather verbose in your reply, but I think the message you were trying to portray is that no lim would've just been an added bonus to scum being able to narrow down the set up possibilities better than town?

Is there any advantage to town you can see from Cook's proposed strategy? Why is it you think Spangled is a higher chance of flipping scum than Cook?

[Facebones]

Yes Galron, I was talking about both people FOR Cook's plan.
Your powers of deduction are uncanny and quite frankly lost in this game when there are cold cases waiting to be solved.

GO! The real world needs you.

[Facebones]

Galron, in fairness who else could it have possibly been?

Furthermore I don't see the point in you getting caught up in semantics rather than addressing the crux of the post.

[Facebones]

Cook, do you have any town leans or scum leans at this point?

[Facebones]

What are ya saying sorry for?
Ya did nuffin'

[Facebones]

You don't have to believe my reasons for believing that Cook was Town (which I'm still not convinced aren't true).

Can I point out quickly that

was

town is kinda strange wording pre-flip.

[Facebones]

VOTE: Facebones

What's your deal?

I'm just not a big fan of D1's, there's no information to go off. Apologies for my lurky play, but for me it's easier to class people as either town or scum from their interactions with other players and seeing which ones I think are legitimate. It might be stupid or whatever, but I feel if I interrupt these people's interactions it'll interfere with the flow and I won't be able to get a clear a read on them as what I could.

If they'd left him alone, he'd be drawing all the heat on D2

Would he have been?

Spangled was the only one Galron was really scumreading/pressuring.

Galron stopped scumreading/pressuring Spangled on page 8, didn't he? He then moved onto Cook (voting for her twice and declaring intent) and myself.

My perspective on the TvT scenario is that if Margot or Val have one scum between them, killing the other or me makes more sense than killing Galron.

Just to touch on this a bit, why would scum Val or scum Margot NK you if you incorrectly labeled them as town? Wouldn't that be more of an incentive to keep you around?

Margot, Thynhith, DArby, anyone- I'm here to answer all questions in order to clear up confusion you may have about my alignment

[Facebones]

It seemed like DArby was very keen to secure the elimination of Cook.
I thought I'd give people an update on where everyone was at in regards to Cook's setup-breaking idea, and DArby took that information and essentially said "case closed, done and done" when I was expecting a bit more of a debate or exchanging of ideas?

Things like

This is why I’d rather move Spangled to d2.

and

Regardless of how Cook flips I'm pushing the fuck out of Facebones d2. Then Spangled.

came across as a little bit trying to line up townie after townie, and even more so now Cook flipped green.


I'm still suspicious of Margot suddenly doing a 180 at the last second and I'm not sure how she decided it was town Cook doing scummy things rather than scum Cook doing scummy things. Her not liking DArby could be distancing?

It confirms alignment and means the Town assessment cannot change

I'm confused, do you mean the town assessment on Roden cannot change?
Couldn't that be said for everyone who gets NK'd?
The plus point to keeping Roden around for you or Val (if one of you is scum) is being townread instead of having people around with doubts about you in their minds.
Surely that's greater than not having Roden around for town to uhm and ahh over?

Or are you saying if Roden's dead he can't change his mind on his town assessment of you and Val?
I get that if you're out of the game, you can't get your views across if they change. But everyone else in the game can when new information comes to light. I don't get why that's a reason to NK him?

[Facebones]

Because it was crazy late at night when I made that post. I slept afterwards and worked all weekend. The next time I logged in everyone seemed to have accepted it and moved on.

I think it's a definite possibility that this is scum Roden trying to incite paranoia

Not a fan all the "wtf why Galron" reactions, I've done that so many times as scum.

I'm glad he wasn't pocketing me in the end but his death felt like a newbie mistake. Which yeah obviously this is a newbie game, but Galron ended the day hinting that he was going to protect Val. I don't think a PR would be so blatant, but newbscum high on an easy mis-elim might go for it.

I'll keep you updated on the others when I've had another read through or 3

[Facebones]

Incite paranoia is the wrong choice of words...
Cast shade is better

[Facebones]

TOWN: Spangled (still a bit sus of the super early town read of me and going along with Cook's strat, but does seem to be trying to spark conversation (which is NAI, I know, but to me it doesn't feel forced). I do have similar concerns with DArby as he outlined in 213. Also he stands by his thoughts and doesn't seem to be wishy washy and easily swayed even if those thoughts aren't broadly accepted and go against the grain)

Val: (one of the same reason as Spangled (albeit in a more accusatory manner)- he's asking people questions and genuinely seems to be trying to solve this. His interrogation of me comes across as a genuine townie)


NULL: Thynhith, Roden


SCUM: Margot (for putting forth a decent case on Cook and essentially at the point of no return backtracking and started TR-ing her for reasons still unbeknownst to me)

DArby (due to his constant pushing to try and secure the Cook elim, I've still got my beliefs he's trying to line up townies)

[Facebones]

VOTE: DArby

Val, that was my first game of mafia ever on this or any site- my gamestyle has changed overtime and I don't think things said way back then has any relevance to present day

[Facebones]

Any reason you decided to avoid putting in Q1 - "1. What is your overall mafia experience? Not just on this site." and my answer - "I have little/no mafia experience. I witnessed my housemate play a game on a different site once, but that's the extent as to how far my knowledge goes."?

[Facebones]

Just a coincidence you're scumreading the guys on your wagon, eh?

From memory 3 or 4 people have been on my wagon at varying times
What am I supposed to do, scumread the 2 who haven't been?

[Facebones]

Do you think that was TMI coming from scum?

It's absolutely possible
Margot, can you please explain your thought process?
What clicked in your head?

[Facebones]

Your readlist comes across as extremely shallow.

Bit snarky, but alright?
I guess it fits me to a T then

[Facebones]

Why, because they're the only 2 players who seem to be on my wagon right now?
Coincidence?
You shouldn't base your town reads based on people who are so damn adament about arguably the easiest mislim

[Facebones]

And thank you. You are doing the lords work @Thyn

While we're on the topic of saying weird things, what about this?

[Facebones]

Spangled and Roden do seem to have dropped off a bit, and if they are scum it seems easy for them to blend into the background, because the headline story has ended up being "let's lynch Facebones because he threw up a bunch of red flags when questioned." which I feel is down to my lack of experience rather than being AI.

I've been trying to help, I've put forth my read lists and instead of taking any part of my posts on board, people seem to take every opportunity to poke holes in my arguments and devalue them, pointing the FoS squarely in my face. Wonder why I'm lurking?
Because everytime I do come out and say something, people twist and turn it into making me look scummy and immediately go on the attack. I feel way out of my depth here.

Anyway, I don't think people are going to get onboard with a DArby lim today so with that in mind

VOTE: Thyn

[Facebones]

Also FB said the no-no word

Just to be clear, what is the no-no word?
I didn't use any expletive, I didn't curse...
Please explain

Val, why do you seem unwilling to believe in the possibility of multiple reasons existing?
It was to observe, I handed forth what I had observed (which wasn't a lot because a lot of the D1 talk was drivel over Cook's plan)
That apparently seemed to raise some red flags and everything I said thereon after incriminated me in the eyes of most
It feels like a lot of confirmation bias and nothing I say is going to change your mind at this stage - the more I say, the more you'll find ways to misinterpret and make me look guilty

[Facebones]

Ahh right! Apologies for my use of the word lynch.
The correct terminology is eliminate and I shan't forgive myself.
I'm sorry for all the offense that my carelessness is responsible for and .


Val, I'm rather curious as to what your read list looks like.
You think Spangled and myself are the scummiest, right?
Where is Margot on this list?

Who do you think is looking the most towny at this point?

[Facebones]

EBWOP
I'm sorry for all the offense that my carelessness is responsible for and understand if you also aren't willing to grant me forgiveness over such ignorance.

[Facebones]

still 2 scum, still 2 PRs
7 people, so MyLo at 5 people after today assuming a mislim
and, y’know, you know the saying, expect the worst so that no matter what you’re not disappointed
or something like that

What if anything does this mean?

[Facebones]

Choo choo, my train's been boarded so damn fast. And by the scummiest characters in town, no less.

Didn't you chastise me for thinking the people who were on my wagon were scummy before and my reads of them were shallow?
This is very hypocritical

[Facebones]

how it makes sense for him to have killed Galron.

I must've missed this, who was saying it makes sense for me to have killed Galron?
Because I assure you, I did not, and whoever said it makes sense is spreading forth vicious lies and slander

[Facebones]

one that yielded nothing in terms of reads.

It gave me some reads, if you think they're terrible then that's on you

Spangled, you don't think Thyn is scum, nor do you think Val, Margot or Vulture are scum, therefore the scum pair is most likely DArby and myself?
Do you honestly believe that?

[Facebones]

Ah well
What slots will be better sorted if I flip green? What about red?